Wills and Guardians

Ima2NYM_LTR

Fri, Apr 30 2010, 9:02 am

DH and I are currently doing the depressing but necessary job of updating our wills. The only critical issue is the big one -who will get our kids if c'vs the unthinkable happens.

We have already decided on who, the question will follow
Choices:

DH's Father and step-mother- currently listed as guardian. They are frum. Kids have an ok relationship- see maybe 3-4 times a year. 3 hrs away. Both have medical issues.. House is very far from childproof. Both have wanted us to 'label' sons (normal) behavior in the past.

DH's mother and step-father - not an option. Surface frum only. step-father under suspicion of child molestation, MIL supports him. MIL is a narcissist and we have 0 relationship with them (never even told them about DD)

My dad and step-mom. "Mesorati" live in Israel. Dad will wear a kippah except when he drives on Shabbos. Only see the kids 1x a year,, but spend a lot of time with them and we webcam often.

BIL and his wife- Frum. kids hardly know. They live in Israel w/ her parents, both in school. neither have experience with kids.

SIL- 17 years old- enough said

My sister and brother in law -live 1/3 a mile away, we see constantly, have 2 kids, who my kids are close with. Love them very much. Sister is staunchly conservative, BIL is a kibbutznik (enough said)

Well we decided with those options the obviously one is my sister and BIL. It would be the least disruptive to the kids. they an stay in their community and school, and with people who know and love them. WE HAVE SPOKEN WITH OUR RAV ABOUT THIS!!!

The issue arises obviously, since they are not frum and we want our children to grow up frum (we are M.O.)
This is the list of things we want to request of sister and BIL. If anyone can think of anything to add, that would be great

1) Consult w/ MO Rabbi in matters relating to religion. Encourage a positive and warm personal relationship with rabbi and rebbetzin
2) Continue at Day School
3) Encourage to go to frum HS , with Rabbis guidance
4) NCSY
5) No treif
6) encourage Shomer shabbos. have go to frum shul at least 1x month. Encourage to spend shabbos lunch/afternoon w/ ppl from frum community at least 1x month.
7)Bar/Bat mitzvah at frum shul
8 ) any inheritance to be used to facilitate frum lifestyle

any others????

(PS, we live in a small community)

amother

Sat, May 01 2010, 8:20 pm

We were asked to be guardians for a family who are much less frum then us. We agreed on the condition that we would raise them as we lived. It's not exactly possible to raise 2 mixed families in one home on 2 different levels. It's easy to say No Treif, But what happens when they go to MacDonalds? Your kids stay home or they sit there and have only coke? Think again if there are friends that you can ask that are on the same level as you. Iy"h it will never happen but at least you'll know that your children will grow up the way you would have raised them.
In our case the father recently passed away, and the mother is not very well but B"H the children are all over the age of 18 now so it is not an issue any more.

Tablepoetry

Sat, May 01 2010, 8:53 pm

I don't think it's really fair to ask them to change their lifestyle. They would be doing you such a huge favor and such a chessed just taking your kids in.

It's fair to ask them to send to frum schools, to encourage (can't force the kids) to go to NCSY. The inheritance should go to supporting your kids first of all (food, clothing, tuition) - if anything is left over, it can go to 'supporting a frum lifestyle' (not sure what that means). If they live in a Jewish city, avoiding treif may not be such a big deal for them.

But I would never ask them to commit to being shomer shabbas in such a situation. Or force them to take the kids to shul once a month!! They would be throwing their lives in upheaval as is, taking in others' children. You want them to do it with love, not with resentment. You can't ask them to change their lives. It's illogical, it's chutzpah.

Given your options, I would choose the sister and BIL too. And I would be eternally grateful if they agreed. I wouldn't dream of presenting them with a list of conditions.

Ima2NYM_LTR

Sat, May 01 2010, 9:35 pm

Woah people. I think you misread entirely!!!!

1) My kids go to the same school her kids may go to. There would probably be no issue there, and even if her kids dont go there, there is no reason mine cannot. Thats not a lifestyle change

2) my sister rarely, if ever goes out to eat. When they do, its usually just the 2 of them and not the kids

3) My sister keeps kosher in the home. My Rabbi has even told us we cane at there

4) I am not asking my sister to be shomer shabbos, just to encourage my kids to be. Dont plop them in front of a tv Saturday morning. let them go to the rabbi (who my sister knows, lives 1/2 mile from and has no problem with) every now and then

5) My sister gos to shul already on a regular basis- just a conservative one.

My sister is already very dedicated and committed to a Jewish lifestyle, there are just some differences in our approaches. It is not like she is anti-religious.

Furthermore I HAVE spoken with my sister about these things and I WILL be speaking to her when I have a finished list. (and for the record, her response was "my husband will never be shomer shabbos" and I replied "I wasnt asking him to be") I was just looking for more ideas.

But thanks for jumping down my throat. I appreciate it.

Ima2NYM_LTR

Sat, May 01 2010, 9:54 pm

some stuff is slightly different than what they would do. they would send to the day school, except if they found XYZ that they werent happy with, then they would send to public school. They usually dont eat out BUT (esp when my dads in town) they will have 1 or 2 meals out together with him and the kids. They do go to shul, but BIL watches TV and uses the computer. So pretty much to encourage (not force) the kids to not follow suite, as well as encourage them to spend time at frum friends houses every now and then.

It would also be for my kids. When they look back, and they are emotionally mature enough, I want them to see that these things were important enough to us that we put them in our will. It would be our legacy (and yes, we plan on writing them a just in case' letter as well)

Tablepoetry

Sun, May 02 2010, 5:28 am

Ima2NYM_LTR wrote:

Sorry, did not mean to jump down your throat - I was probably more abrupt than I should have been.
I did say in my original post that the school issue should not be a problem, and that kosher food might not be either. But it seems your sister and bil are threatened by the rest of your demands, if their response was 'will never be shomer shabbos'- even though I realize that's not what you were asking.

Your sister goes to a conservative shul. She may actively think that is the best derech, she may just like the community there, whatever. I'm sure she'd be happy to take your kids there too. I'm not sure you can ask her to go to an orthodox shul once a month instead.

It's hard enough to combine families. I think it would be impossible to turn on Saturday morning cartoons and 'encourage' some of the kids not to watch. Usually kids get up early on their own anyway, on Saturday morning, and turn on those cartoons. Your sister can't encourage two totally separate lifestyles under one roof.

I think writing your children a letter is a great idea, emphasizing how important shabbat, etc, is to you, and giving them encouragement to do their best to keep it. But I still don't think your sister should be put in a position where she has to make ANY compromises in her daily life, beyond embracing your children as her own. And that's exactly it - embracing your children as her own, subject to her guidance. Either she raises your kids or she doesn't.

amother

Sun, May 02 2010, 8:20 am

I'm glad you brought this up. It has gotten me thinking about our own situation. Our original will named a close family member and spouse as guardian but that was agreed upon before they had kids. I still think it is the best choice but I should ask them again if they would still agree to take in the kids if need be since their family dynamics are now different.

This family member is actually more strict than we are in many areas and I am not thrilled with my kids being raised in a very narrowminded lifestyle IMO but how can I be so ungrateful??? I just hope that we will B"EH be able to raise them ourselves in our own way. In this situation, I would never ask them to riase my kids any different than theirs. Well, at least they are not less observant than we are. I could also ask a grandparent but I am afraid that they may need to be taken care of at a certain point and won't be able to handle the kids. That grandparent is also less strict than us but not the point where I'd say anything.

Tough call but I just compare it to the possibility of foster care and then anything is better and my own situation sounds perfect.

Ima2NYM_LTR

Sun, May 02 2010, 8:30 am

I understand what you are all saying
re: shul- not that my sister has to go. My son has a lot of friends there and she could arrange for him to be watched by another adult (easily, this is they type off community that would do that for an orphan) and then eat lunch by one of them

re: TV, I agree it would be hard. thats why I said 'encourage' that means show him (and my baby) that this is something that was important to their parents, but not make it into a battleground. obviously, I would go over specifics with my sister beforehand.

Plus there are also some other details we have to add that have nothing to do with yiddishkeit ie, they should see DHs father and have a relationship w/ him. etc.