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-> Interesting Discussions
Inspired
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 Wed, Dec 08 2010, 3:56 pm
Thank you for posting amother.
What an amazing, courageous man Pinny Taub is. I wish him all the bracha and every good thing for him and his family.
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Merrymom
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 4:06 pm
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I watched the youtube clip the other night. It was so terribly disturbing, yet I'm glad I watched it as I felt his message is very important to parents.
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ora_43
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 4:39 pm
The clip is interesting, and it's impressive that he shared his story like that.
I think he ascribes a bit too much power to the parent-child relationship, or at least, to the parent's role in it. As parents, we can't guarantee that our kids will come talk to us as teens - we can try, but what if they don't?
I thought his suggestion that a parent who is close to their child will recognize signs that something is happening was also off. It's generally true but not always true. I can think of many people I knew in high school who hid all kinds of things from their parents.
It also wouldn't necessarily be true with younger children. An older child is probably more likely to show signs of distress right away, but a younger child who is abused might react years later, when they realize what was done.
Given his suggestion that a parent would recognize the signs of abuse, I wonder what he would say about things like yeshivas with dorming in, or summer camp. How can a parent tell if their child is hiding something upsetting if they aren't speaking face to face?
And given the discussion that preceded this post, I would have liked to hear something about how a third party should react. I think we could all agree that the rabbi he approached about the abuse did not react appropriately. But what should our reaction be, not as the party approached, but as the party that only hears about it through whatever channels of third or fourth-hand communication? And what can we do in general?
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Inspired
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 4:45 pm
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Ora, the entire conference is on you tube- 17 videos. Watch them.
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ora_43
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 4:46 pm
| Inspired wrote: | | Ora, the entire conference is on you tube- 17 videos. Watch them. |
It would take me forever and a day to watch that many videos. I don't do well with videos.
Any in particular that you recommend?
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amother
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 4:58 pm
| ora_43 wrote: | The clip is interesting, and it's impressive that he shared his story like that.
I think he ascribes a bit too much power to the parent-child relationship, or at least, to the parent's role in it. As parents, we can't guarantee that our kids will come talk to us as teens - we can try, but what if they don't?
I thought his suggestion that a parent who is close to their child will recognize signs that something is happening was also off. It's generally true but not always true. I can think of many people I knew in high school who hid all kinds of things from their parents.
It also wouldn't necessarily be true with younger children. An older child is probably more likely to show signs of distress right away, but a younger child who is abused might react years later, when they realize what was done.
Given his suggestion that a parent would recognize the signs of abuse, I wonder what he would say about things like yeshivas with dorming in, or summer camp. How can a parent tell if their child is hiding something upsetting if they aren't speaking face to face?
And given the discussion that preceded this post, I would have liked to hear something about how a third party should react. I think we could all agree that the rabbi he approached about the abuse did not react appropriately. But what should our reaction be, not as the party approached, but as the party that only hears about it through whatever channels of third or fourth-hand communication? And what can we do in general? |
Hard to believe, but a lot of power is in the parents hand. Teach your children from a very young age, when they start school. Tell them that no one can ever touch them in their privates and if they do they should tell you right away. If anyone threatens them, they should know to tell you that too because as a parent you love your child the most and you will protect your child as much as you can. Talk, talk and talk to them.
As a third party, REPORT it! Thats the only solution for now! And make sure the victim receives the right help and support. If you can't do it, make sure someone who can will. Lo Samed Al Dam Roecho!
Please take the time to see those clips. I may post the most important ones.
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ora_43
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 5:05 pm
I'm from a community where people talk to kids about the dangers of molestation and how nobody should touch them and all the things you said.
It's not a 100% solution. Once kids get to be older, like the angry alienated all-knowing teenager type, I doubt it's even a 50% solution.
When I said third party I meant, as I said, someone who is hearing the story, not someone who's in a position to report it. You started this thread because you were angry about some responses in a thread about a specific molestation case, right? So what should the response have been, in your opinion? What should the response be in general, if someone hears about a case that has already been reported to police - should they publicize it, do nothing, take a third route, what?
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ora_43
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 5:19 pm
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I forgot the first question I had watching this, which was - what about s-x ed? Does that come up at some point in this conference?
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amother
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 6:29 pm
| ora_43 wrote: | I'm from a community where people talk to kids about the dangers of molestation and how nobody should touch them and all the things you said.
It's not a 100% solution. Once kids get to be older, like the angry alienated all-knowing teenager type, I doubt it's even a 50% solution.
When I said third party I meant, as I said, someone who is hearing the story, not someone who's in a position to report it. You started this thread because you were angry about some responses in a thread about a specific molestation case, right? So what should the response have been, in your opinion? What should the response be in general, if someone hears about a case that has already been reported to police - should they publicize it, do nothing, take a third route, what? |
I am from a community, the same as Taub, that does NOT speak about the dangers of molestation. Never mind discuss this subject. About angry teenagers, I was about to post something, but I decided I will ask professional advice first.
I started this thread because another victim pm me and begged me to do it. We are sick and tired of molesters being protected and victims blamed. "LH, mesirah, he is such a nice important person there is no way that he could do such things," bla bla bla... We wanted to bring awareness.
Your answer to your last question is PUBLICIZE it. Let everyone know it happens and to stay away!
I feel bad for the victims.
I don't think they discussed s@x education. Its more about how the community should deal with abuse.
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smilingmom
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 7:19 pm
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Thank you so much for posting. I watched it and plan on sending it to others.
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amother
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 9:53 pm
I cried while watching Mr. Taub speak. How heroic of him to speak so publicly about the abuse he suffered. I hope this brings him complete healing.
As a mother, this is a fear we live with.
What can parents do besides for educate their children and maintain open communication with them? (most teenagers do NOT confide in their parents).
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amother
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 10:23 pm
I am soooo impressed that Pinny Taub came out to talk about it.
He has a large extended family and hopefully this will bring awareness which is so desperately needed.
To the amother, were you abused by family? because unlike Pinny's situation, when its your own family (father or brother) doing the abusing its harder to come out with, as the implications will have a greater impact on you directly.
And for all those ppl who don't believe that the "nice", "frum", "aidel" "easy-going" people next door can do such a thing, THINK AGAIN! these are exactly the words used to describe our family....
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HindaRochel
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 11:04 pm
Of course this happens in aidel families, which is why we should listen when a child or adult tells us they were abused. We should listen with open hearts and minds.
I am very glad Pinny spoke out against his abuser, and we should never assume, because of outward appearances, that a person is in fact innocent and couldn't do this.
Of course we should publicize what happens when it happens, and that has been done. I am not against stating publicly that so and so has been accused of this crime, because that is way to get evidence in. And of course we should keep our children away.
And as I said on the other thread, you have no idea what my past holds. I have actively intervened in child s/x abuse cases, actively put myself and family in danger to protect children. So please stop judging me NOW.
I still think the best way to bring justice is, unless one is connected, to stay neutral and not assume guilty until proven innocent. I don't see how my assuming someone is guilty is going to help the victim at all, unless I have a connection with the person describing the abuse.
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amother
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Wed, Dec 08 2010, 11:53 pm
To the amother above, yes I suffered from incest and that is why you don't hear me speaking publicly. (Yet.  you can never know... )
HR, may Hashem reward you for all your efforts.
The clips that I posted from Oprah are very educational. I would like to hear feedback from that too. Thanks to the poster that is forwarding Pinny's story. I hope everyone will do that.
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fiddle
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Thu, Dec 09 2010, 1:04 am
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Finally. Its about time people are speaking out in public about the dangers of abuse. its amazing how he has the courage to stand up and publicize his story.. may we all be granted that same strength to speak up to protect our children and grandchildren from abuse.
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shosh
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Thu, Dec 09 2010, 1:38 am
I have to say that one of the aspects I found so frightening, listening to Pinny's story, was that the abuser was his rebbe, and this man's cynical exploitation of a boy's vulnerability after losing his mother. It sent shivers down my spine to think how sometimes the pple we trust the most are the ones behind it. 
All I can say is it shows how sharp eyed we all have to be, and I hope that all of these victims find peace.
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chavamom
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Thu, Dec 09 2010, 2:23 am
| shosh wrote: | I have to say that one of the aspects I found so frightening, listening to Pinny's story, was that the abuser was his rebbe, and this man's cynical exploitation of a boy's vulnerability after losing his mother. It sent shivers down my spine to think how sometimes the pple we trust the most are the ones behind it.
All I can say is it shows how sharp eyed we all have to be, and I hope that all of these victims find peace. |
Not to mention the violence....
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mammele26
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Thu, Dec 09 2010, 2:38 am
 I like!
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