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Forum -> Parenting our children -> Our Challenging Children (gifted, ADHD, sensitive, defiant)
Where to send ds to school?
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Lady Godiva




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 12:15 pm
amother wrote:
Would you consider Montessori? There is a Montessori yeshiva in central NJ - they love bright, challenging kids! Definitely MO (Hebrew-speaking, Zionist, strong secular and Judaic studies, mixed gender); definitely not "cookie-cutter."


Not OP, but I'm curious--which school is this?
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amother


 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 12:18 pm
Lady Godiva wrote:
amother wrote:
Would you consider Montessori? There is a Montessori yeshiva in central NJ - they love bright, challenging kids! Definitely MO (Hebrew-speaking, Zionist, strong secular and Judaic studies, mixed gender); definitely not "cookie-cutter."


Not OP, but I'm curious--which school is this?


http://www.netivotmontessori.com/

It is in the Edison/Highland Park community. A few of the students come from "out of town."
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mom4life




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 12:22 pm
Based on the facts you are giving us I would say the more MO school. The reason is that MO is still frum (even if it's not exactly how you live your life) and the benefits for him are really really great. If two schools would both be okay for a child, then yes a school that's more your haskafa is better. Otherwise, I really think people should stop resisting a better option because the child might be more MO. There really is nothing wrong with being MO.
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Isramom8




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 12:36 pm
amother wrote:
I'm sorry I think I'm being unclear because I'm trying to beat around the bush. Right now he does not have any real behavioral issues because I pretty much have him under control. In previous years he has been the star of the class because he is SO bright and his teachers have absolutely loved him. I was very lucky to have gotten teachers who "understood" him and challenged him and he became a real asset to the learning of the class. This year he tells me he is bored at school and has been having more behavioral issues but not major. Just some bad days. I'm worried that since his current school is such an old fashion, cookie cutter, frontal teaching type of school he will be bored which will cause him to have behavioral issues because that IS what he does. When he's bored he makes trouble. I'm also worried noone will take the time to answer his amazing questions and more likely they won't know how to answer his questions which I have seen turn kids away from Judeism. Maybe I am just extra sensitive and worried because I have a brother who is not too frum (I think he keeps Kosher and Shabbos but I'm not sure)(also he flat out tells me he doesn't believe in G-d).
You have to understandthat he's really a different kind of a kid and I see he can be so great or Chas v'shalom the opposite.


Some of my kids are very bright, and have gone to Israeli schools where the teaching is frontal and the hashkafa cookie cutter. And did not always answer their amazing questions. And sometimes appreciated them and sometimes encouraged them to keep quiet.

No one was turned off from Judaism because of this. They just appreciated when things were more open. YOU will take the time to answer his amazing questions. YOU will understand and challenge him. YOU will validate his thoughts.

And YOU will work with his teachers to find creative solutions so that a few bad days do not turn into a major crisis. That doesn't have to happen.

If it does, you can always switch him later.
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Atali




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 12:53 pm
Since you live in the NY/NJ area you should have more than two choices of schools if you are willing to commute.

I would recommend trying to find a school with small classes since a school with small classes is more likely to be able to provide individual attention. I have a very bright first grader with severe ADHD and he is thriving at his current school. He only has eight kids in his class so the teacher can really cater to each child.
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amother


 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 1:55 pm
Atali wrote:
Since you live in the NY/NJ area you should have more than two choices of schools if you are willing to commute.

I would recommend trying to find a school with small classes since a school with small classes is more likely to be able to provide individual attention. I have a very bright first grader with severe ADHD and he is thriving at his current school. He only has eight kids in his class so the teacher can really cater to each child.


In general, I agree - but I would recommend observing the actual classes and speaking with parents of students (if you know anyone with kids similar to yours) to find out what the classes are actually like.

Overall, we have found that general studies teachers are better equipped to handle differentiation in the classroom than the Judaic studies teachers, even in very small classes.

About choosing a school for its academic reputation:"excellent secular studies" sometimes just means more homework, or more drill to get the average students to work at a higher level - not necessarily the best atmosphere for an academically advanced student. Ask the principal how the teachers are supported in differentiated instruction. You may find the higher-performing students are left behind. If there is an "advanced track," you're in luck, but the principal might want to watch your child for a while to see if he qualifies (it's unlikely they'll take mother's word for it), so don't expect placement up front.

Personally, I would go for the "MO" school - older elementary students typically do not care to mix with the opposite gender anyway, and at least you have a chance at appropriate education. Being bored in school and realizing that you're the smartest in the class can have complex and long-lasting ramifications, beyond small behavior problems and attitudes towards frumkeit.

Hope that helps!
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cm




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 2:03 pm
amother wrote:
Atali wrote:
Since you live in the NY/NJ area you should have more than two choices of schools if you are willing to commute.

I would recommend trying to find a school with small classes since a school with small classes is more likely to be able to provide individual attention. I have a very bright first grader with severe ADHD and he is thriving at his current school. He only has eight kids in his class so the teacher can really cater to each child.


In general, I agree - but I would recommend observing the actual classes and speaking with parents of students (if you know anyone with kids similar to yours) to find out what the classes are actually like.

Overall, we have found that general studies teachers are better equipped to handle differentiation in the classroom than the Judaic studies teachers, even in very small classes.

About choosing a school for its academic reputation:"excellent secular studies" sometimes just means more homework, or more drill to get the average students to work at a higher level - not necessarily the best atmosphere for an academically advanced student. Ask the principal how the teachers are supported in differentiated instruction. You may find the higher-performing students are left behind. If there is an "advanced track," you're in luck, but the principal might want to watch your child for a while to see if he qualifies (it's unlikely they'll take mother's word for it), so don't expect placement up front.

Personally, I would go for the "MO" school - older elementary students typically do not care to mix with the opposite gender anyway, and at least you have a chance at appropriate education. Being bored in school and realizing that you're the smartest in the class can have complex and long-lasting ramifications, beyond small behavior problems and attitudes towards frumkeit.

Hope that helps!


Sorry, this was not meant to be "amother." I'm "cm."
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Lady Godiva




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 2:38 pm
amother wrote:
Lady Godiva wrote:
amother wrote:
Would you consider Montessori? There is a Montessori yeshiva in central NJ - they love bright, challenging kids! Definitely MO (Hebrew-speaking, Zionist, strong secular and Judaic studies, mixed gender); definitely not "cookie-cutter."


Not OP, but I'm curious--which school is this?


http://www.netivotmontessori.com/

It is in the Edison/Highland Park community. A few of the students come from "out of town."

Thanks.
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amother


 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 6:55 pm
OP here-

Could you give me more information about netivot montessori? How old is the school? How many children? What's the Hashkafa? Where do the students come from.

Isramom-I would agree with you if he were the average bright. I have average bright too B"H. It is very different talking about a child that is not just bright. And I've seen children that were turned off from Judeism because they were discouraged from thinking for themselves and having their curiosity squelched.

If anyone else could think of schools they think I should look into I would really appreciate it.

Thanks so much for taking the time to answer everyone.
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amother


 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 7:49 pm
amother wrote:
OP here-

Could you give me more information about netivot montessori? How old is the school? How many children? What's the Hashkafa? Where do the students come from.


Netivot is about ten years old, and currently goes up to sixth grade, although they plan to go up to eighth grade soon. The school is growing rapidly, with about 100 students, mostly from the local community but a few commute from elsewhere. The community itself is very down-to-earth (not "fancy"), and religiously diverse. The hashkafa is modern/centrist Orthodox; as I mentioned earlier it is a Hebrew-speaking, Zionist environment. It's co-ed, but they may choose to separate the male and female students in the upper grades in the future. Even if they do that, please keep in mind that strict gender segregation is not part of the local culture, which might be an issue for you. Take a look at the website for an overview of the program. They don't give a lot of details, so you could call the school if you need more info.
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 8:20 pm
if we are talking jersey there is a montessori/rabbi rietti school in passaic-clifton.

There is a new montessori school in bklyn but it doesn't have a first grade yet.
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 10 2011, 8:22 pm
I would just like to add to the passaic-clifton school is very right wing.
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mo5




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Mar 11 2011, 2:12 am
Have you considered an extra shiur with someone else with an openended course of Jewish learning?
A chance to ask all the fantastic questions he has?
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Isramom8




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Mar 11 2011, 3:04 am
Average bright, genius bright...it's hard to say that the way a group of 5 year olds appears is the way it will play out as certain kids mature and other plateau. Can you give examples of his past experince with being super bright, and how the reaction or lack of it he received was a concern?

One of my dds says that when she is bored in school, she translates Hebrew books into English in her mind. She also helps classmates with their schoolwork. Another dd knew how to read Rashi before taught - she said, "What do you think I always look at when I'm bored in Chumash class?" One son is an early reader. Next year's reading teacher (they start in kindergarten) reassured me, saying, 'We all know that he reads! Don't worry. I won't place him in a reading group with other kids until they catch up."

In my experience, there are solutions other than putting in a MO school lechatchila if that is not your hashkafa. Look at the total picture. With any school, I always say - look at the 8th graders, not just the 1st graders.
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amother


 

Post Fri, Mar 11 2011, 7:04 am
My dh always says "it's a lot harder to repair emotional damage [from being in an inappropriate educational environment] than to 'repair' hashkafa". Hashkafa comes from the home for the most part. Yes, your son might be exposed to some things that he otherwise would not have but who cares? His emotional well-being is at stake. If your gut is telling you it's the right thing to do, go for it. We have a very similar situation with our son and despite much deliberation decided on the more modern school.... it's just not worth it....
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BeershevaBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Mar 11 2011, 8:39 am
amother wrote:
My dh always says "it's a lot harder to repair emotional damage [from being in an inappropriate educational environment] than to 'repair' hashkafa". Hashkafa comes from the home for the most part. Yes, your son might be exposed to some things that he otherwise would not have but who cares? His emotional well-being is at stake. If your gut is telling you it's the right thing to do, go for it. We have a very similar situation with our son and despite much deliberation decided on the more modern school.... it's just not worth it....


I totally agree with this.

If your son is bored and acts out he'll be branded, and that's that. Good luck getting him into a school. If he's stimulated which will more or less prevent him from acting out, all the better.
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