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Passing on family names- important or no
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Seraph




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 2:13 pm
I know so many people feel so strongly about naming minhagim, especially regarding naming after family. My parents, for one. Every kid in my family is named after at least one relative who passed away, sometimes two. My parents didn't mind changing names (a Betty, who's Jewish name was Breindel, was named after in the form of Elisheva=Elizabeth=Betty), but naming in memory of someone wasn't even a question. Its the "right" thing to do.
To the extent that when my sister named her son after my grandfather, and a second name they thought was suitable, my father was emotionally in tears, because the second name was the name of his grandfather (baby's great great grandfather) that never had anyone named after him.

Me? Personally, I don't give a flying rabbit about naming after people. If its someone that was special and dear to me, or someone I admire, I'd name after for emotional/sentimental reasons. But not because I see any value whatsoever in giving a name "just to pass on family names" or "because its the right thing to do".


How do you feel about naming after relatives? Is it an important value to you, or just because of emotional/sentimental reasons?


Last edited by Seraph on Sun, Jul 24 2011, 3:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ElTam




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 3:19 pm
We did not do. There is one relative that I would have liked to name for, but so many other relatives have used that name (and a bunch of people on DH's side have the same name too), it would have been too confusing.

One other person I would have liked to name for died tragically, so we opted not to do that.

But, I think each parent has to make the best choice for themselves/their baby.
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amother


 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 3:24 pm
I think it is important to keep family names going.
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ChossidMom




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 3:26 pm
I don't think that it's about how we feel about it. There is an inyan to use names of deceased family members (among ashkenazim).
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saw50st8




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 3:31 pm
I think its important to pass on family names IF you connect to the people. All my kids have family names (the youngest has one family name and one that we liked).

We do look at our family trees to find names we like because I think its nice to have a family connection, but not essential.
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hadasa




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 3:55 pm
Yes, I do think it is important to pass on family names. It is a zchus for both the deceased ancestor and the child.

My personal opinion is that for BT's it is especially important, so that the ancestor gets the zchus of someone named after him keeping Torah and Mitzvos. Whereas when I got married, there were already about ten girls named after my grandmother, so I felt no great need to name after her. I did eventually, when I wanted to. (once I already had my Mushky, my Devorah Leah, etc. )
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chocolate moose




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 4:00 pm
If you can't or won't pass on the name, it's important to do other things l'ilui nishmas the neshomah.
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Seraph




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 4:02 pm
hadasa wrote:
Yes, I do think it is important to pass on family names. It is a zchus for both the deceased ancestor and the child.

My personal opinion is that for BT's it is especially important, so that the ancestor gets the zchus of someone named after him keeping Torah and Mitzvos. Whereas when I got married, there were already about ten girls named after my grandmother, so I felt no great need to name after her. I did eventually, when I wanted to. (once I already had my Mushky, my Devorah Leah, etc. )
I personally feel that I want to put what is best for my child ahead of what is a big zchus for ancestors. Because if having a certain name won't be an advantage for your child (for whatever reason, either being mocked becuase of a strange name, or a name that doesnt have good middos connected to it), I put my child above other considerations.

And I find that my parents, for example, who put big stock in naming after family, at least accordng to my rav, didnt actually "name after" by naming an elisheva after a betty/breindel, and then its just about personal feelings, not about the neshama connection.
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hadasa




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 4:16 pm
Seraph wrote:
I personally feel that I want to put what is best for my child ahead of what is a big zchus for ancestors. Because if having a certain name won't be an advantage for your child (for whatever reason, either being mocked becuase of a strange name, or a name that doesnt have good middos connected to it), I put my child above other considerations.
OK, I agree that those are also important considerations.
Quote:

And I find that my parents, for example, who put big stock in naming after family, at least accordng to my rav, didnt actually "name after" by naming an elisheva after a betty/breindel, and then its just about personal feelings, not about the neshama connection.
That may be true, but remember that simply making your parents happy is also a Mitzvah. I've given several names mostly for that reason. I didn't realize it so much when I was younger, but now that my parents are older and since they live thousands of miles away, there aren't that many ways in which I can still give them such Nachas and pleasure.
I'm not saying it's what everyone MUST do - just explaining my own reasonings.
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spring13




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 4:28 pm
Its a consideration for sure. and I care a lot more about using a name that's associated with someone I cared about.

but I think that one's personal taste and desires come into play when choosing a name. if for some reason I have a strong feeling against using a particular name, I'm going to take that into account; when we say that people have ruach hakodesh about what to name their children, I think that intuition is part of it. I hate it when people feel that their own desires do not count at all when it comes to naming THEIR OWN CHILDREN. if you don't have any second thoughts about a certain family name, then obviously it's right for this child; but if you're feeling very conflicted or unhappy, then maybe its not. and you should feel ok about going your own way.

I can think of lots of ways to honor my parents and ancestors; naming is just one thing.
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 4:39 pm
I think it's a great thing.
And I'm also grateful to be privileged to KNOW so many names, a few generations back, fine people with names our kids can live with.
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lamplighter




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 4:50 pm
I think it's a beautiful thing. My DH and I do not see eye to eye on this one (he wants all his kids named after tzaddikim) but I think I will insist on grandparents or if there are aunts or uncles that either of us were/are particularly close to.
I think it's weird to name kids something just because you like the name - it should be more significant than that.
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amother


 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 7:58 pm
My dh and I both felt no particular need to name after anyone in the family, particularly as he is sephardi so his father is same name as his deceased grandfather and so on..

SO yes,we chose a name that we liked and felt was right for our first son - Yaakov Yisrael and on the day of his bris we found out it was the yaartzeit of the Steipler that week!!! Talk about Ruach Hakodesh!

Our second son we did the same went through a bunch of names, we both didn't want Moshe because it is such a common, but holy name and we didn't like the sound of the Moishie, but come what may, Hashem kept on putting that name in our mind and we named him Moshe Yehudah. Same situation, we looked up the yartzeit list and his bris was on the same day as yartzeit of Rambam.

Then finally my daughter, we liked the name Esti, and since we have a grandmother, alive on dh's side with that name we asked my fil if he was ok about it, he said his mother would be over the moon as it's an honour among sephardim. My great grandmother was Esther Rochel, there are already 3 grandkids and 2 great grandkids named after her, so we did too, and made my mother and grandmother happiest people in the planet.

so I believe that there is something in naming after relatives, but I also believe that people should choose what feels right, coz we did and we were proven how right it was!!!
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saw50st8




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 8:39 pm
I also think there is a difference in family levels. We named my oldest after my father even though I don't like the name. But after a great uncle twice removed? No way.
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amother


 

Post Sun, Jul 24 2011, 8:51 pm
I plan to do so in cases where the person we are naming after is either someone one of us felt a strong kesher with, or someone whom we admire greatly due to the person he or she was.

I would not do so in the case of a name that would make my child embarrassed. I might use a second name, but more likely would translate the name. Anyway, my dh is sefardi and he is not comfortable with using yiddish names, even as a second name. So while I loved my grandmother dearly and was very close with her, we will not use her yiddish name. We hope to one day give the Hebrew name (a tzadeket from Tanach) that her yiddish one is believed to have been derived from.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 25 2011, 12:29 am
To me, passing on names is:
-a strong minhag (if you have it)
-a way of saying thanks for making me alive, and Jewish, who I am
-a way of keeping their memory alive
-a way to "ground" children, and to materialize Jewish and family history for them
-a way to keep the beautiful "chain" going on, I would hate to be the one stopping it
-kibud av ve em (to parents, and to ancestors)

For info we believe translation, equivalent, combining, or even common sounds make it naming after someone (neshama connection, zchus). Some don't. Some even think just an initial or a quality is naming after (we don't). We do believe ideally you keep the name as is (but absolutely no problem wihth combining here).

We also only name people who aren't named after already (with a Jewish person named for them...), and in straight line (no uncle etc). Why? Too many names after the Shoah.

If the name is weird, we would use it as second or third. Ideally with another family name before.

I see many people do TZADIK, FAMILY NAME or MODERN HEBREW NAME, FAMILY NAME.
Like Menachem Mendel Fradji, or Liora Rivka.


Interestingly most people with Yiddish names I know are Sefardi or Mizrachi. Some named for family, some for tzadikim, some for fashion. I have also seen people translating a Ladino name into Yiddish "to have a Hebrew name", which is funny but soooooo ignorant I couldn't believe it.
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amother


 

Post Mon, Jul 25 2011, 2:37 am
Seraph wrote:
How do you feel about naming after relatives?


I feel that that is what last names are for.

In our community there is a strong minhag to name the first son after the paternal grandfather. Since not many people leave the community to live elsewhere, there are some families that have like 10 people all with the same name. It gets pretty confusing!

My cousin has given "family names" as middle names to each of her daughters but in each case she didn't like the name she was naming after so changed it to something vaguely similar but in two cases it was a name that was just similar sound and not even the same meaning. I felt that that kinda defeated the purpose of naming after the person.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 25 2011, 2:38 am
Last names, as in surnames? what about your mother's side? your grandmother's?
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amother


 

Post Mon, Jul 25 2011, 2:55 am
Ruchel wrote:
Last names, as in surnames? what about your mother's side? your grandmother's?


In our community it is quite unusual for girls to be named after relatives, only boys and only after relatives in the male line.

It would make more sense IMO to name girls after relatives in the female line but my DH and I have decided not to do this. Here, girls take ther fathers surname and don't change it on marriage.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 25 2011, 2:57 am
This is fascinating, now I'm dying to know who does it!!
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