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W. what jobs can you do well w/o college, despite findings?
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amother


 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 7:54 am
Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
College Degree Worth Extra $23,000 a Year
by Stephen Ohlemacher, Associated Press


How much is a bachelor's degree worth? About $23,000 a year, the government said in a recently released report.

That is the average gap in earnings between adults with bachelor's degrees and those with high school diplomas alone, according to data from the Census Bureau.

College graduates made an average of $51,554 in 2004, compared with $28,645 for adults with only a high school diploma. High school dropouts earned an average of $19,169 and those with advanced college degrees made an average of $78,093.

"There appear to be strong incentives to get a college degree, given the gaps that we observe," said Lisa Barrow, senior economist at the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago.

The income gap narrowed slightly from five years earlier, when college graduates made nearly twice as much as high school graduates. But the differences remained significant for men and women of every racial and ethnic group.

Eighty-five percent of people 25 and older have at least a high school diploma or the equivalent, compared with 80 percent in 2000 and a little more than half in 1970.

Twenty-eight percent have at least a bachelor's degree, compared with about 24 percent in 2000 and 11 percent in 1970.

"I think we've done a very good job of getting individuals into college," said Cecilia Rouse, professor of economics and public affairs at Princeton University. "But we don't fully understand why we don't do as good a job of graduating them."

Chester Finn, president of the Thomas B. Fordham Institute in Washington, said too many high school graduates are unprepared to succeed in college.

"If you don't emerge from high school having done at least the equivalent of advanced algebra, you are not going to be ready for college math," Finn said. "You can make similar points about English."

Among the other findings in the report:
Minnesota, Utah, Montana, New Hampshire, and Alaska had the highest proportions of adults with at least a high school diploma--all at about 92 percent.


Texas had the lowest proportion of adults with at least a high school diploma, about 78 percent. It was followed closely by Kentucky and Mississippi.
Connecticut was the state with the highest proportion of adults with at least a bachelor's degree, nearly 37 percent. It was followed closely by Massachusetts, Maryland, and New Jersey.


Nearly 47 percent of adults in Washington, D.C., had at least a bachelor's degree.


West Virginia had the lowest proportion of college graduates, at 15 percent. It was followed at the bottom by Arkansas, Kentucky, and Louisiana.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 8:08 am
there are many jobs out there that you do not need a college degree to pursue and will make good money.

the first example that I thought of was a plumber. they make a loooot of money and did not recieve a diploma.
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challi




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 8:56 am
I think that the only reason people with degrees make so much more is because they have it not because it makes them better at their job.

This doesn't apply though to jobs like dr's, lawyers, dentists, nurses etc. However there are many people who can run fantastic businesses without an mba, can teach amazingly (btw some of my favorate teachers never went to college), can do graphics just bcz they have a flare for it, taught themselves programming out of a book and just took off with it, and the list goes on.

Anyone with a talent for a specific job can do it well and really succeed at it, the problem is getting an in into the field that you want to do. All thats standing in your way is the diploma.

OK now fire away...
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chocolate moose




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 10:09 am
Oh, I understand all right.....however, I have a ds sitting home since Labor Day b/c he can't find anhything, with just a h.s. diploma.
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redhot




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:12 am
For the most part, to earn a decent living one NEEDS atleast a bachelors degree today. For a BETTER job, you need a master's degree. This isnt to say that one cant be succesful in starting up his own business, but if you wont be your own boss, why should some other guy hire you with just a high school diploma when he can hire someone with a college degree??

And if he does hire you, he will pay you a lot less for the same work because you dont have the B.A. or B.S.

The only good job I can think of offhand that do not need a college degree is owning ones own business.

All other jobs need atleast some form of training or certification (I.e. plumber, makeup artist, shaitel macher,). I guess a receptionist or babysitter doesnt need training, but you woudnt be earning much in that profession Confused

I have no pity for anyone who wont go to college and then complains that they cant get a job or cant make a decent living. I worked like crazy earning my bachelors and masters degree (married with kids) and I earned the right to make what I make!! Anyone can do it if they choose to.
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shopaholic




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:29 am
I found a great job due to my office & computer experience, no degrees. DH has a programming degree & owns his own business. I guess the degree helped a bit. He is fantastic at setting up all his stuff online etc, but no real programming there.
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redhot




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:39 am
momof3 wrote:
I found a great job due to my office & computer experience, no degrees. DH has a programming degree & owns his own business. I guess the degree helped a bit. He is fantastic at setting up all his stuff online etc, but no real programming there.


You are fortunate then. But if I may add, 'great' is a relative term.
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amother


 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:45 am
sthillmom wrote:


Anyone can do it if they choose to.

Not true, I've got loads of talents, but I would never be able to sit through years of college and further education. Not everybody is cut out for it.
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redhot




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:51 am
In my opinion, anyone who is determined to go to college and earn a degree CAN do so. I have seen people who are not particularly brilliant and who struggle to keep up in school,work hard and get into a good graduate program. So I stand by my statement that in my opinion anyone who wants to, can do it.
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Esther01




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:52 am
amother wrote:
sthillmom wrote:


Anyone can do it if they choose to.

Not true, I've got loads of talents, but I would never be able to sit through years of college and further education. Not everybody is cut out for it.


she said if they choose to, you choose not to.... I can understand both sides.
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hey its me




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 3:10 pm
my dh grew up in israel, after leaving yeshiva he got earned himself a high school diploma, through a cousin of ours he entered a very well known company and trained on the job in the foreign exchange prime brokerage field!! b'h he got paid well enough WITHOUT a degree!!

he has since left that company and works in manhattan for a larger company in the same field and b'h we are living on his wage!!

I personally think this college degree outlook is so overrated, my dh tells me every day about the shmerels he works with who have been through college and constantly screw up!!

I think getting a decent paid job w/out college is luck but is possible!
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redhot




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 3:17 pm
hey its me wrote:
my dh grew up in israel, after leaving yeshiva he got earned himself a high school diploma, through a cousin of ours he entered a very well known company and trained on the job in the foreign exchange prime brokerage field!! b'h he got paid well enough WITHOUT a degree!!

he has since left that company and works in manhattan for a larger company in the same field and b'h we are living on his wage!!

I personally think this college degree outlook is so overrated, my dh tells me every day about the shmerels he works with who have been through college and constantly screw up!!

I think getting a decent paid job w/out college is luck but is possible!


EXACTLY! it can POSSIBLY happen, but most likely it will not. Why take the chance??
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amother


 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 3:42 pm
sthillmom wrote:
hey its me wrote:
my dh grew up in israel, after leaving yeshiva he got earned himself a high school diploma, through a cousin of ours he entered a very well known company and trained on the job in the foreign exchange prime brokerage field!! b'h he got paid well enough WITHOUT a degree!!

I think getting a decent paid job w/out college is luck but is possible!


EXACTLY! it can POSSIBLY happen, but most likely it will not. Why take the chance??




"through a cousin of ours he entered a very well known company and trained on the job"-


It's not what you know, it's who you know.
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redhot




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 4:05 pm
amother wrote:
sthillmom wrote:
hey its me wrote:
my dh grew up in israel, after leaving yeshiva he got earned himself a high school diploma, through a cousin of ours he entered a very well known company and trained on the job in the foreign exchange prime brokerage field!! b'h he got paid well enough WITHOUT a degree!!

I think getting a decent paid job w/out college is luck but is possible!


EXACTLY! it can POSSIBLY happen, but most likely it will not. Why take the chance??




"through a cousin of ours he entered a very well known company and trained on the job"-


It's not what you know, it's who you know.


who you know might get you an interview but if you dont know anything it wont get u the job
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hey its me




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 9:25 pm
yes it deff helped that our cousin was high up in the company!

but he was also taking a risk, he was taking a 20 yr old boy who grew up in israel with sadly no secular education (but a very smart head on his shoulders! Very Happy ) I guess he saw through my dh and realized this was a person who could make it! so he took the chance and we can say b'h he did gr8!

but here I am with no college, which as far as iv seen in my experiences here in the states, no college = a crappy job!!

with the exception of the lucky smart pple like my dh!
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roza




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 10:57 pm
See top 100 something jobs in USA

http://money.cnn.com/magazines......html
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anon




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:09 pm
Sthillmon, maybe most people can get a bachelors if they choose to, but not everyone can go through a more grueling, competitive master's program. Some ppl really just aren't cut out for that. You need to be at least a decent student with decent writing skills and a decent ability to do well on tests! You're gonna say that everyone can do that?
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Crayon210




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:22 pm
And I've seen lots of college graduates with all kinds of degrees who have no job.

So what?
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redhot




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 16 2006, 11:31 pm
anon wrote:
Sthillmon, maybe most people can get a bachelors if they choose to, but not everyone can go through a more grueling, competitive master's program. Some ppl really just aren't cut out for that. You need to be at least a decent student with decent writing skills and a decent ability to do well on tests! You're gonna say that everyone can do that?


I really think that anyone who is motivated enough can earn a bachelors degree. I dont htink that e/o is cut out for graduate degrees though and I didnt say otherwise. When I said I have no pity for anyone who chooses to not attend college, I dont mean those who are not smart enough or scholastic enough to earn a b.a. I do feel badly for those individuals. I just find it frustrating that so many men and women are out there who are so so smart and are not encouraged or allowed to get educated or trained (so they dont!) and are stuck with very few possibilities for earning a living.

IM KIND OF TIRED SO IM NOT GETTING MY THOUGHTS OUT CLEARLY
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chavamom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Nov 17 2006, 12:42 am
Crayon210 wrote:
And I've seen lots of college graduates with all kinds of degrees who have no job.

So what?


The 'so what' is that MORE people with college degrees ON AVERAGE make MORE money than those without. Yes, there are exceptions. I think that lots of people go to college without a plan also. They get a degree just to get a degree and expect 'someone' to hire them without really knowing what they want to do, where they want to look, etc. Which leads to the kid with a BA and no job. But you cannot deny that a degree opens more doors to more jobs with higher income. That is not rocket science. For those who don't want to get a degree, generally they need some type of training to make a reasonable income and even then they are limited in their earning potential unless they go into their own business.
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