The insanity of cooking suppers for someone who had a baby

33055

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:42 am

I just posted this on the supper thread.

boat wrote:

Did you sign up tonight to make supper for your postpartum neighbor?

Quote:

My community doesn't do meal trains or have a place to sign up. It is an automatic response to bake something for someone who had a baby or to visit them in a kimpertunim home. Occasionally, a rebbetzen I know will call me up and ask me to cook which I gladly do. It is always for a stranger.

For the most part, the ladies in my circles take care of themselves and their families. They give birth, and their freezers are well stocked. Often the kids are away the first several days.

In short, there is no need.

I have been peeking into this thead periodically.

I don't know if this was mentioned, but these suppers for ladies who have babies are definitely dependent on group norms.

I never head off a meal train until a Chabad friend of mine showed me the application. A friend in Fairlawn also does meal trains. Many people in my circles don't have smart phones even. And they take care of themselves.

A nice thing to do for the moms when they come home is to order a breakfast for them. There is a places in Williamsburg and in KJ that do this for the new moms. It helps them feel loved.

Ema of 5

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:45 am

amother wrote:

I think it's important that people are self sufficient. It's nice to have help when you NEED it.
If 2 adults decide to have a baby, I hope they know that there will be a birth, the woman will need to rest and the family still needs to eat *gasp*.
Once the woman finds out she's pregnant, she has 7-8 months to prepare for this birth and the 2 weeks after. She's also hopefully not a single mom and has a husband who should care enough about hair wife and possibly kids to ask if he can cook sometimes.
If I ask someone for help it's 1. My husband , if he can't do it 2. My parents or siblings, 3. My friends and 4. Neighbours.
It's really not my neighbours problem, that I decided to have a baby and didn't prepare for it. That's my opinion. I have 14 and I've gotten food from neighbours over the years but I've always made it clear that I cook in advance and my husband cooks aswell.
What I like to do for my friends when they are sick or have babies, I invite their kids over for dinner, so the mother can actually rest.
Also if I know someone is super overwhelmed, had a complete bed rest pregnancy etc. Then they need food obviously. That's a need. Not someone who just couldn't care less, because why should I, everyone will send food.

Here’s the thing though. My husband can’t help me out, not really. He can take off the day I have the baby, and while I’m in the hospital he can come home early, but that’s about it. His morning schedule doesn’t allow for prep, and he doesn’t get home until after my kids are in bed.
I don’t know ANYONE who gets meals after having a baby who doesn’t cook becasue hey just couldn’t care less. What an awful thing to think. I personally don’t get meals after having a baby,
If you want to talk about what’s helpful for the new mom, thats totally a case by case basis. For me, what would actually be more helpful is for someone to do homework with my kids and make sure they are showered/bathed. I don’t think any neighbors are going to do that though. Like I said, I don’t get meals for my family, so while it would be nice if a friend or neighbor invoted my kids for supper, it wouldn’t exactly be helpful. Like I tell my husband, it’s only helpful if it’s something I need help with, otherwise it’s nice.

southernbubby

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:46 am

I think that much of the resentment came from organizers who put people on the spot and don't take "no" for an answer.
When you spend lots of time on imamother you realize that many people can barely feed their own families but don't want the world to know. There are many families who don't cook but who pop fish sticks in the oven for their own kids but are now expected to peel vegetables for someone else's. The mother who can barely manage her own brood is now expected to do that for someone else.
Every community is different but some communities are better off concentrating on Shabbos meals for a couple of weeks with each member of the community making one or two dishes. Raising the bar sometimes means fewer participants.

amother

Cerulean

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:49 am

Squishy wrote:

I just posted this on the supper thread.
I have been peeking into this thead periodically.

I don't know if this was mentioned, but these suppers for ladies who have babies are definitely dependent on group norms.

I never head off a meal train until a Chabad friend of mine showed me the application. A friend in Fairlawn also does meal trains. Many people in my circles don't have smart phones even. And they take care of themselves.

A nice thing to do for the moms when they come home is to order a breakfast for them. There is a places in Williamsburg and in KJ that do this for the new moms. It helps them feel loved.

I think you're referring to a community where the norm is to go to a kimpeturin heim/ have lots of family assistance/ send out older children after a birth. It makes sense that under those circumstances there is less of a need for assistance with day to day things like dinner for the family right after birth.

(I am not searching all the pages to see what I posted several years ago, but I personally don't take meals even though my community offers them for two weeks as standard practice. I have gladly made meals for close friends or for those who don't necessarily have family or many friends locally, both after birth and in times of other medical need. I will push myself to do it for a close friend even if it's challenging for me, otherwise I definitely don't pressure myself. My own family comes first and they definitely take the fallout when I overextend myself.)

SuperWify

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 8:53 am

I wish we could rename this thread, every time I see the word “insanity” I cringe. Doing chessed for others and taking care of yourself after birth is NOT insane in any way!!! 😤

Also, people keep saying that DH should cook. Most DH I know are very busy especially after birth (caring for the older children, bris arrangements, doing the shopping and cleaning besides for their regular duties). Now I’m all for woman rights but I do believe that some men can’t do everything a woman can. My DH can only cook cholent, grill cheese, and he very proudly just learned how to warm up frozen pizza. Yippedo. Sorry but I really don’t want to eat all that after a baby for two weeks!

Once I tried to teach him how to boil pasta. He asked me a million questions it drove me mad. I was frustrated and much rather preferred to do it myself then bother with teaching him.

amother

Pink

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 9:00 am

I was turned off of the whole idea when asked to prepare part of a meal for someone for Shabbos - I came over with the food to find two adult single cousins there helping out. They needed my food like another hole in the head! After that when I was asked, I said no. We have a lovely take out place where one can get good food for Shabbos. Other communities have many such places. Part of having a baby is realizing that paying for take out food, if you need it, is part of the cost. One of my kids was born on Pesach so obviously, stocking my freezer would have been difficult then. Otherwise, many can freeze small items like meatballs, etc. My sister lives a few blocks away from me and my mother lived close by as well. They never cooked for me (why should they have?) and I never got a meal from anyone. (Possibly community members thought my family was cooking for me.)
In any event, cooking suppers for community members made sense when you couldn't buy ready made food. It goes back to the years before refrigeration. I would say with few exceptions, it is not necessary and some people have a hard time saying no because they don't want to look unfriendly/cheap/selfish or whatever. People are asked too many times for no reason and then they may say no when there actually is a reason.
Frankly it is often the same with sitting shiva. A well off member of our community was sitting shiva recently. The family certainly had the money for take-out and all the children were grown and out of the house. The man's wife or close friends couldn't get take out for him? Why did the person in charge of meals ask community members to make meals for him? Let them ask for meals for people who cannot afford takeout. This "lo plug" attitude is absurd.

33055

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 9:03 am

amother wrote:

It is not just the ones that go to kimpertunim home and have lots of family assistance. The non-chassidum or the ones that can't afford kimpertunim homes don't take meals either, nor do they send out their kids, and I don't see too much family assistance. All already have large families in my circles. Meal trains never gained traction here.

What I am trying to say is that this is dependent on group norms. It may sound like a bit of insanity to cook for everyone for weeks after they give birth. Sometimes, I will have 6 or 7 friends expecting at once.

My group will cook when someone is sick or sitting Shiva.

southernbubby

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 9:40 am

For Shiva, only the first meal after the funeral has to be provided by the community. Obviously not all Shiva situations involve the loss of someone elderly, unfortunately (and may all Yidden be spared) and then the community needs to respond as much as possible for tragic situations.
I was told that I could cook for my family when I was sitting for my mother.
Not everyone can multitask. Some can marry off a kid and make supper for a new mother all in the same week but no one else should be held to that standard.

Ema of 5

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 9:49 am

southernbubby wrote:

I can tell you right now that even if I’m allowed to, I won’t be able to cook for my family while I am sitting shive. My parent should both live to 120, and Nashua has should come before, and I should never have to go through that test!
About your last sentence.....I’m going to edit it a little. Some can’t marry off a kid and make supper for their own family all in the same week.
Meals should not be EXPECTED after one has a baby, but there is no reason not to appreciate them. If you are unable to make a meal, say so. Stand up for yourself. It’s not a cheesed if you are resentful. If you don’t want to receive meals, say so. Don’t expect someone else’s husband to be able to pick up the flack just because yours is able to. Don’t expect that my mother or mother in law is going to take care of me because yours take care of you. Are you seeing the theme here?

amother

Orange

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 10:06 am

SuperWify wrote:

Also, people keep saying that DH should cook. Most DH I know are very busy especially after birth (caring for the older children, bris arrangements, doing the shopping and cleaning besides for their regular duties). Now I’m all for woman rights but I do believe that some men can’t do everything a woman can. My DH can only cook cholent, grill cheese, and he very proudly just learned how to warm up frozen pizza. Yippedo. Sorry but I really don’t want to eat all that after a baby for two weeks!

Once I tried to teach him how to boil pasta. He asked me a million questions it drove me mad. I was frustrated and much rather preferred to do it myself then bother with teaching him.

I don't think that's the norm. Most men today know how to do a lot more than boil pasta.

I have no problem with the concept in general, especially if the idea is to strengthen community, but like some others have said, I think it's outdated.

It's not like it was once upon a time, in some cultures, where the other women of the community had more free time and could cook. Most women work now, many of them f/t, and they are making the most basic dinners for their own family. Asking them to make a three course dinner in the middle of the week for someone else is often too much.

Second, there is often adequate take out, at least if you live in an established Jewish community.

Third, as I said, most men today can cook. Definitely at least basic food. If they come home at six and the kids are in bed by seven, then they can cook the evening before, just like most women need to do anyway.

southernbubby

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 10:29 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

I see the theme but in some communities, there may be numerous people who could use meals for various reasons all at the same time and maybe not so many people who could provide those meals. If it is a communal effort and not just what each individual decides to do, shouldn't there be some kind of triage?
A woman who gives birth to twins (or more!) needs more help than a mother who has one baby and so on.
How often can the community rely on each woman to provide meals? Once a month might be reasonable for most women. Are communities expecting more than that?

Ema of 5

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 11:00 am

southernbubby wrote:

But that’s just it. Unless you are inside their lives and houses, how can you know who needs more help? Maybe the woman who had twins has full time help now, and no other kids, but the one with a single had a very hard labor and deliver, 5 other kids at home, and no help.
It’s not about who needs more. It’s about who can help out. If you can help, you help. If you can’t, you don’t.
Yes, there will be times when women fall through the cracks, but I think for the most part the two weeks, or even one week, gets filled.

southernbubby

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 11:15 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

At the same time, how do we judge what the givers can give? If the meal trains are filling up, then great, it means that people can do it but what about when it doesn't?

ShishKabob

Thu, Mar 14 2019, 11:47 am

amother wrote:

I disagree with you on all accounts.
Maybe it's because I'm a little older and I've seen many things that many younger people didn't get to see yet, only due to living life a little longer.
Wishing you well on all accounts as well.