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Anybody use Dr Daum? Please share your experience

 
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myym




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 10:02 am
I am thinking of using him for training my six year old child with down's syndrome. Please let me know your experience! Thanks for your help.
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nyer1




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 10:45 am
I hope this all comes across clearly, please feel free to PM me if you have questions.

I was desperate. my 3.5 year old was completely trained for urine but would REFUSE to pass a bowel movement in the toilet. he would poop in his underwear and wouldn't even care, OR, worse, he would hold the poop in for days at a time. it became a vicious cycle. it clearly would hurt him to poop because he had held it in for days. was feeling like I couldn't leave the house with him because he would poop anywhere and didn't care! how awful to have to change my 3.5 year old (who is tall enough to be 5) into either a new diaper or soiled underpants. it was becoming this awful power struggle and I was scouring the internet to find answers.

mind you, the whole time, my husband kept trying to reassure me that it was just a phase and that he would grow out of it. meanwhile, my son will soon be 4, which means he finally must be trained for school / camp.

my internet search came up with encopresis, which is the disorder that (could) develop from stool withholding. I found an online support group on facebook for this, and kept seeing dr. daum's name pop up, from parents who had TREMENDOUS success.

further research via google led me to his program that claims to train your child for $450. knowing how desperate I was, my mother offered to pay for it, since she knew my husband would never go for it, as he felt that paying this kind of money was extreme for something that could turn out to be a non-issue.

nevertheless, I signed up. I was contacted the next day, and was told that since I live closeby to his office (long island), I wasn't eligible for the phone program, but would instead attend his seminar, and see him in his office, just like any patient, which would go through insurance. I just had to pay $75 for the conference.

the conference was great and very informative and I was convinced he was the expert.

saw him in his office and my husband and I agreed to try the program.

day 1 involved a "party room"... essentially spending the ENTIRE day in the bathroom. it was fun for a while but my son was too smart to believe this was a party. he felt trapped and I felt awful. after the 6 EX LAX that he had to take, my son WAS pooping, but would have rather done it on the floor than on the toilet. I was told by dr daum to HOLD HIM ON THE TOILET. which I did. success? I guess. the poop landed in the toilet, but since it wasn't self initiated, day 2 would be AGAIN in the party room.

day 2 -- no self initiation. did he poop? yes. in the toilet? I think once. again, because I held him there. this , in my mind, only made the power struggle worse.

day 3 we were allowed in the rest of our apartment. still no self initiation

all this time, I spoke to the dr. every night about the next day's plan. so far, in my mind, it wasnt successful yet, although dr. daum felt that we were making progress by the sheer fact that he was pooping. except, he was only pooping WATERY STOOL because the ex lax dose was so strong.

but here's the real kicker. some time on day 2, my son developed a fever and told me his ears hurt. dr. daum instructed me NOT TO GO TO THE DOCTOR because I shouldn't "RUN TO THE DOCTOR EVERY TIME MY KID HAS A FEVER"...dr. daum was speaking to me on the phone at this point in such a demeaning way. he asked me if I wanted to give up and told me to stop acting like a baby. thank god I went with my motherly instinct and took him to the doctor anyway (across the street).. my kid had a double ear infection with a fever of 103.

I was so upset and so distraught by day 4 when I wasn't seeing any progress and my son was begging me to go to school. I posted on the SUPPORT GROUP about my plight.

would you believe he had the audacity to call me and SCREAM AT ME for posting? how was I supposed to know that he reads the board? who does he think he is? its a free country!! I explained to him that I was in no way bashing him but instead looking for some emotional support. he INSISTED I take it down or he would refuse to continue working with me. at this point I was so upset and hurt but I DID listen to him, even though I saw nothing wrong with my post.. I just felt that after 4 days, I wanted to see this thing through to the end.

by day 5, still no self initiation. he basically told me at this point that I should seek psychological help for my son, or ABA therapy, or something.. and that I should come back to him in a few months after that.

to clarify, and to get to the point, the whole reason why I posted to other parents going through this issue is because he has a VERY TOUGH personality. my pediatrician is very soft -- very much the opposite and I needed some comfort during a very stressful time, especially since my husband didn't really agree with doing the whole program in the first place.


you might have TREMENDOUS success with Dr. Daum, as many people have, but my advice to you if you DO go to see him, is just know that he has an extremely rough personality, and if you can't handle it, go elsewhere. I've heard great things about Dr. Tuvia Marciano, who is in the same practice.



as an aside, a few weeks later, when I learned to just lay off a little bit, my son has now started pooping on his own, in the toilet, self initiated.

Smile
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sourstix




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 11:48 am
to nyer1 I had the same issue with my child. the same words you wrote I can write word for word about my child.
I had a terribe experience with dr daum. and I saw it online other pp complaining about his personal attacks on ppl
I also started the program and didnt succeed. hes agressive with his program to say the least. the amount of laxative is insane. noone does that.
when I told dr daum my son is crying from pain bec o so much laxative he told me I should tell my son "to shut up". hes an aggressive person when things dont exactly go how he wishes.
we make jokes about him after we went to his seminar. he claims that children can be trained at 12months if I remember clearly. lol, my gosh.
he might be more patient with disabled children I dont know for sure. but he cant deal with normal children that have this issue.
I sincerely I dont understand how he is successful but I guess special children are different. beware that the large amount of laxative isnt the trick to the problem. its more.
fast forward, I have been using dr ritu verma from childrens hospital of phila. and she is great!!!!!!! she deals with this and she uses a much more sensible approach. she speaks to the child. I mean I dont have enough words to say about how good she is for this particular issue. she is considered the top in pediatric GI in lakewood.
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myym




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 12:09 pm
op here, Thank you all for posting! my goodness it sounds dreadful!!!! I had read online that some people said he was rough but what you both wrote sounds horrible .if anyone has any further advice...
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sourstix




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 12:16 pm
and he made my son take a whole package of exlax in a short amount of time. all to down in an hour if I remember correctly. also miralax a whole bottle in a short amount of time and it did nothing, just tons of diahrea and he didnt anitiate at all. it all didnt help. I dont know what to tell you about the success. I guess it wasnt for us.
he also told us to shmear my son up with desitin all over his body bec he will defacate at night bec he will have diahrea from the laxatives, and to make sure it doesnt burn his body!
bec if he doesnt go to the bathroom at night and the diahrea will sit on his skin too long it can burn his skin. so I had to check him in middle of the night.
does that sound remotely normal?
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amother




Powderblue
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 12:57 pm
Sorry, this doctor sounds sadistic and abusive, and his techniques are probably borderline malpractice. He is a sick person. It sounds like his techniques can cause lasting psychological damage as well. If you love your child, stay far away.
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working hard




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 31 2015, 2:13 pm
Quote from him to me "You are stupid and I am smart, that is why you came to me"
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amother




Aqua
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 12:00 am
I know this is old but would love to hear what you all did to get past it. Im going through this with my daughter and need help asap.
Someone mentioned this dr but after all negative comments im afraid to do this(which btw I tried same idea with laxatives) and didnt work. How did you successfully train your child in the end. Any advice greatly appreciated.
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Surrendered




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 12:20 am
I'm trying to train my son with DS 4.5, I also need to train my almost 3 year old son.
I don't have the energy and they really don't care.
The technique I received on training from Dina Friedman (Chanoch Lnaar course) is: give lots of water. Mentioned NOTHING to the child about going to the bathroom. Every 10 minutes that the child is dry, you give them a little treat, like jelly or chocolate chip, m&m...
If they do go to the bathroom, you make a big deal and he gets a mini treat.
According to this method, she claims it's a 2 day training.
It didn't work for me as of yet cause, I'm not 100% dedicated to it, and they really don't care.
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amother




Mauve
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 8:06 am
Go to a social worker. This is an anxiety issue. and a contol issue.Not a medical one.
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amother




Apricot
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 8:57 am
Surrendered wrote:
I'm trying to train my son with DS 4.5, I also need to train my almost 3 year old son.
I don't have the energy and they really don't care.
The technique I received on training from Dina Friedman (Chanoch Lnaar course) is: give lots of water. Mentioned NOTHING to the child about going to the bathroom. Every 10 minutes that the child is dry, you give them a little treat, like jelly or chocolate chip, m&m...
If they do go to the bathroom, you make a big deal and he gets a mini treat.
According to this method, she claims it's a 2 day training.
It didn't work for me as of yet cause, I'm not 100% dedicated to it, and they really don't care.


This is similar to the book toilet training in a day.
It also uses a doll that wets itself. And child wears large underwear.
It really worked for unmotivated older child
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amother




Aqua
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 9:04 am
My issue is with just going dirty. Shes totally fine wet. This is going on for 9 months where I change her 1-2 times a day dirty. Im lost. I tried every method and nothing worked. This past shabbos I tried to "retrain " her by keeping her bottomless and giving fiber n some miralax nothing worked. She just doesn't care its definitely behavioral/ fear.
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amother




Cobalt
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 9:29 am
Im so happy I found this thread. It gives me chizuk to see others have similar issues to my dd 3.5. She has been peeing on a toilet since last pesach before she was 3. She does on her own, wipes, flushes, washes. But when it comes to pooping its a nightmare. She won't go in a pull up or have accidents so the only option is the toilet yet she resists it like crazy which makes me think its painful for her Crying
She has held it in for days at a time which led to terrible constipation but at this point shes been on a half cap full of miralax daily for months already with no light at the end of the tunnel. When she feels the urge to go she clenches her butt cheeks and jumps up and down and screams sooo loudly. Then shell tiptoe while still clenching to the bathroom and scream (out of pain?) On the toilet for a min or 2 and hold it in as hard as she can. After nothing comes out shell jump off the toilet and repeat this exact scenario 15 times before it finally explodes out of her. The yelling and screaming that goes on by her morah and alllll afternoon DAILY until she finally poops is enough to put a sane woman in an asylum!! Thanks for letting me vent!
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sky




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 9:33 am
amother [ Cobalt ] wrote:
Im so happy I found this thread. It gives me chizuk to see others have similar issues to my dd 3.5. She has been peeing on a toilet since last pesach before she was 3. She does on her own, wipes, flushes, washes. But when it comes to pooping its a nightmare. She won't go in a pull up or have accidents so the only option is the toilet yet she resists it like crazy which makes me think its painful for her Crying
She has held it in for days at a time which led to terrible constipation but at this point shes been on a half cap full of miralax daily for months already with no light at the end of the tunnel. When she feels the urge to go she clenches her butt cheeks and jumps up and down and screams sooo loudly. Then shell tiptoe while still clenching to the bathroom and scream (out of pain?) On the toilet for a min or 2 and hold it in as hard as she can. After nothing comes out shell jump off the toilet and repeat this exact scenario 15 times before it finally explodes out of her. The yelling and screaming that goes on by her morah and alllll afternoon DAILY until she finally poops is enough to put a sane woman in an asylum!! Thanks for letting me vent!


My almost 4yr old acted similarly after months of being toilet trained. In the end we found she was horribly constipated. It took months to get her body back to normal and get rid of the fear. It was so hard. And the more they are afraid to go the worse it gets.
We used mineral oil to help the stool come out. I gave it every day.
Lots of drinking.
Also used bactriban on her behind if bleeding otherwise aquaphor to soothe any pain.
It took so much patience to get rid of it.
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amother




Cobalt
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 9:41 am
sky wrote:

We used mineral oil to help the stool come out. I gave it every day.


Thanks so much for the reply. Yes her issues definitely stem from constipation. And it takes a ton of patience and we can not forgot a single day or miralax. We travel with it. I drive it to her morah if I forgot in the morn.
Do u by any chance have an Amazon link to the mineral oil you use? And do you add it into food or do you give it straight?
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sky




 
 
 
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 10:32 am
amother [ Cobalt ] wrote:
Thanks so much for the reply. Yes her issues definitely stem from constipation. And it takes a ton of patience and we can not forgot a single day or miralax. We travel with it. I drive it to her morah if I forgot in the morn.
Do u by any chance have an Amazon link to the mineral oil you use? And do you add it into food or do you give it straight?


I got an off brand at a local pharmacy.
I find mixing in applesauce is best.
When I gave it in drinks it separated.
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amother




Cobalt
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 10:48 am
sky wrote:
I got an off brand at a local pharmacy.
I find mixing in applesauce is best.
When I gave it in drinks it separated.


Amazing thank you! Im sure this will be helpful!
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amother




Aqua
 

Post  Wed, Jan 22 2020, 12:00 pm
So my dd issue is not constipation cuz she goes no issue in her underwear. The problem is doing it on the toilet. Any wise imas here with tips. Im going crazy for 9months changing dirty underwear daily.
Please someone help Can't Believe It
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