To the mother who dressed her daughter as Vashti...

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Forum -> Yom Tov / Holidays -> Purim

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amother

Natural

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:07 pm

To those saying that it’s inappropriate to dress up like “bad people”, oh please. I dressed up like Haman when I was 4 - over 30 years ago. And my (very straight and yeshivish) parents thought it was so independent of me not to choose the typical queen/kalla (Which I did subsequently dress up as for the next few years).

Shoshana37

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:23 pm

My daughter asked few years to be dress as vashti she was 7 . Her reason was she didn’t want to be another princess or Esther at the party she wanted to be different and fun. So we let her be. It was never to offend anyone😳

Blessing1

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:26 pm

Op, please don't take it personally, I'm sure they didn't even think about offending anyone by dressing up as Vashti.
On the other hand, my neighbor knocked on my door I opened she exclaims " what happened to your face? You're almost like vashti you're just missing a pimple on your nose!!!" I shut the door & couldn't calm down! This happened a while ago & I'm still so pained by this! A Middle Aged mother said this to me!! As if I chose to have acne & im not doing All I can to get rid of it!!

amother

Firebrick

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:29 pm

I once dressed up as a headless Vashti. No acne because I was headless LOL

A bit macabre, I know. I was Morticia Addams the following year LOL

amother

Aqua

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:39 pm

amother wrote:

Hugs op, I feel for you, I suffered with the most severe acne for years and it ruined my life by destroying my self esteem and yes kids asked me why I had pimples like Vashti and the pain was excruciating.. I ended up taking accutanne, still have acne but much less and other crazy issues in my life took over this pain

I b'H don't have acne anymore. I went off sugar and wheat and some other food items that I had an intolerance to. b'H I'm now back on all food.
I'm just very sensitive to other peoples feelings so I was 'offended for them'.
me personally- I was never self conscious about my looks and always 'wore' my pimples with pride.

amother

Indigo

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:41 pm

amother wrote:

As a former severe acne sufferer I was very offended. I can't imagine what teenagers seeing your daughter felt like. its enough when little kids name-call people with acne as vashti, you don't actually have to 'spell it out'.

Thank you for understanding

Hi op.
I would love to know what kind of response would have validated you and made you feel like your op was heard.
Can you help me out and share?

amother

Aqua

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:42 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

ouch. this reminds me, in 7'th or 8'th grade I had a big pimple near my nose and my classmate wanted to know "what happened to you"?!

amother

Indigo

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 10:44 pm

amother wrote:

You feel offended for imaginary people who may or may not feel hurt, and therefore posted publicly about what someone else did in a way that made it sound offensive.

How is that helpful to you? I have someone in my life who does the same, and I have trouble understanding, and providing this person with the support and validation they seek. Can you help me out by explaining yourself?

I would so appreciate it.

amother

Fuchsia

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 11:00 pm

I teach preschool and I try very hard to use my words carefully teaching about Vashti because one of my daughters had a horrible acne challenge as a teenager.
I use lots of descriptive words like dots and spots and splotches and rashes. I davka avoid the word pimples.

amother

Chocolate

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 11:04 pm

As an "older single" I found little girls dressed as brides triggering. It was really cruel of the moms.

was an older single. joking about the triggering

solo

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 11:14 pm

Every year I wonder bout those dressed as old people. Did They never love or care for an elderly grandparent?! Even as kid, dressing as old lady or man seemed insulting and disrespectful

amother

Green

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 11:27 pm

Bizzydizzymommy wrote:

I'm referring to bad people in Jewish history. We didn't want to be a rasha even for a day. That was something I learned in kindergarten

The first time I saw little boys dressed as Cossacks, I was horrified. And yet that's acceptable. Go know.

amother

Green

Sun, Mar 04 2018, 11:29 pm

amother wrote:

The spots aren't even in the megillah. Isn't it enough to just say that she didn't want to come?

Merrymom

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 12:08 am

The schools are teaching that she was covered in pimples so I don't see how this can be avoided.

This does make me think of a good laugh we got one year though. My young teenaged daughter was covered in red dots to look like a comic book superhero character but when my neighbor saw her she asked her "Who are you, Vashti?" so you just never know...

amother

Green

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 12:25 am

Merrymom wrote:

The schools are teaching that she was covered in pimples so I don't see how this can be avoided.

It can be avoided by teaching what's actually in the megillah - that Vashti said no because she didn't want to come. Period.

Teomima

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 1:58 am

Call me ignorant, but I had never heard of a correlation between Vashti and acne before. I've also never thought of her as a villain, rather as a poor victim who was tired of being a slave, constantly at her husband's beck and call. So as a child one year I did decide to dress up as the poor forgotten queen (though everyone probably just thought I was Esther anyways). It was of my own initiative and honestly, I doubt any 11-ish year old would let their parents choose. Kids at that age are independent and free-willed enough to decide what they want to be on their own.

If it makes any difference to OP, I also had major, severe acne throughout my teenage and young adult years.

amother

Wine

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 1:59 am

When I was in preschool we made a purim play and I was vashti. I was all excited for my beautiful princess costume but was pretty upset getting pimples on my face. I think I was jealous of Queen Esther. Now looking back at the pictures I must say I looked adorable even prettier than Esther and you can't tell that I have pimples on my face, but back then it did bother me.

amother

Mauve

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 2:17 am

solo wrote:

Every year I wonder bout those dressed as old people. Did They never love or care for an elderly grandparent?! Even as kid, dressing as old lady or man seemed insulting and disrespectful

My son dressed up as a 'sabba' - he even borrowed his sabba's hat, and he lent it to him happily.
As long as they're not dressing up as a helpless sick old person in a geriatric ward(not sure how you'd go about doing that) - then I think it's fine - to be a smiley elderly man with a long white beard, suspenders and a cane - reminds me of all the friendly old gentlemen with a twinkle in their eye, who give out candies to the kids.

ETA, a friendly (no so old) man in shul, with a white beard even said to him - look at me! I'm the same as you, and I don't even need a costume Smile

Iymnok

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 2:26 am

As I understand, no one says pimples, rather a horn, tail, or tzara'as. A bad smell and lesions may also be mentioned.
I did see a teen this year wearing horns on a headband, a tail and spots on her face with a long dress.

Dandelion1

Mon, Mar 05 2018, 9:04 am

Teomima wrote:

My experience is similar. Growing up in a modern orthodox day school environment we were taught that the king wanted Vashti to come to his party and dance for the guests and that she did not want to do that because it was not modest. I always saw vashti as a bit of a hero actually, albeit a victim who was punished by the bad king unfairly. Later on, I heard the parts about her not wanting to come because of her pimples, or a tail (?!), which was confusing to me because I had been taught that she didn't want to come because the king wanted to parade her around in front of his male guests. We learned that from very young, and it made perfect sense to us.

I'm so tempted to post anonymously because I'm embarrassed to say that I never really clarified any of this in my mind. I still have this divide between the impression I had as a child and this (to me) new stuff about pimples and tails. Was that added and why? Wasn't it enough to explain that Vashti did not want to come to the king's party to be presented immodestly to his guests?

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