S/O Appropriate Boundaries with Male Colleagues

Boca00

Sat, Mar 24 2018, 11:11 pm

The other thread had me thinking that young women that grow up not used to talking to boys, might not have appropriate boundaries when they enter the workforce and suddenly need to work closely with men. They may not know what is ok to say and discuss, and what is crossing the line.

I think the same goes for young men out of Yeshiva, entering the workforce for the first time.

At one job, I worked with a married man who was super friendly and told everyone I was the best girl. He was appropriate but very friendly.
Another married man I worked with became very possessive over me (though he was not my superior) and would also often kick off his shoes and come into my office to schmooze.

At my current workplace, I am extremely careful with a male colleague I work closely with and don't say ANYTHING that is not 100% business related. Like I literally don't say "Good Shabbos" or "Welcome Back", which would be totally fine, but he doesn't, either, so...

What are your personal boundaries when you must work closely with men?

Last edited by Boca00 on Sat, Mar 24 2018, 11:24 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Firebrick

Sat, Mar 24 2018, 11:21 pm

I work with someone who is super friendly to everyone so I never really thought twice about our very friendly relationship. But when he mentioned that he always deletes our texts so his wife won’t see them, that didn’t sit right with me. That’s the short version of our relationship. I am very careful around him and don’t go out of my way to be particularly friendly, but some very frum young married women are so overly friendly with him, and I truly don’t think they realize.

Boca00

Sat, Mar 24 2018, 11:31 pm

amother wrote:

I would hate to work in an office where my colleagues don't wish me a good shabbos or welcome me back after a break. The solution to inappropriate boundaries isn't refusing to interact - it's learning to behave appropriately.

Great, can you go into more detail?
And just to be clear, it's not refusing to interact- we will talk for 2 hours sometimes, but all completely business related.

amother

Floralwhite

Sat, Mar 24 2018, 11:34 pm

Boca00 wrote:

Great, can you go into more detail?
And just to be clear, it's not refusing to interact- we will talk for 2 hours sometimes, but all completely business related.

I'm not really sure what you mean. The idea is to treat co-workers of both genders as people, politely.

Boca00

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 12:00 am

amother wrote:

I'm not really sure what you mean. The idea is to treat co-workers of both genders as people, politely.

For sure. I guess I've had unpleasant experiences when I was just-regular-friendly with men I've interacted with in the past so I'm super careful now. Honestly, he's the same way so it's not like he's getting insulted.

It does make we wonder what is standard in other workplaces though. Like will you ask how yomtov was? Ask to see pics of his kids?

amother

Floralwhite

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 12:27 am

Boca00 wrote:

I'll ask how you tov was, but not to see family pictures. However, if he just made a wedding and is showing photos all around, I'll look happily.

Not everything can be quantified and put into rule books. You just have to use common sense.

momnaturally

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 1:09 am

I would say it depends on your personality and looks too as well as the nature of your coworkers. Basically if you find that male coworkers seem to be finding reasons to talk to you or seem to be enjoying being with you as opposed to just working with you that tells me back off from them much more and show even a slight disinterest in talking to them when not business related. If they don't display any of the above signs then I would be more "polite" but I try never to be "friendly" there is a very fine line between the 2 but I think those words are good descriptions of what is appropriate. I find one good way of knowing how "polite" to be to someone is by comparing how they talk and treat a male coworker as opposed to me or another female coworker. If it's just about being polite they won't be acting differently.
If there are even subtle differences it means its time to be less polite.

amother

Lemon

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 7:04 am

Ive been working all my ‘working’ life (27 years) in secular environments
There are def unseen boundaries that are a must to be kept during work hours.

A big one (for me anyway) is no to texting. To opposite $ex co workers. Ever. (Unless a dire emergency). During work hours there is no need. & after work hours there shouldn’t be a need for that either. If one needs to reach a colleague then call and speak on phone.

Texting is a very familiar way to communicate which is inappropriate for frum women & men to do with one another. Whether one is not Jewish or Jewish & not frum or both frum. In my book it does not matter.

Texting can lead to g-d knows what.
I speak from experience (my dh)

Other than that one needs to have common sense and realize that we need to be friendly and nice to our co-workers but that’s it. Some things u can’t put on paper. Like I said, common sense. We need to Know our place at work. It’s a job. Not our home.

amother

Apricot

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 7:26 am

amother wrote:

I work at a frum place in Israel and we text all the time. Mainly whatsapp. The one colleague who has a kosher phone is seriously out of the loop.
In many workplaces texting is a must. I definitely dont want to have to answer the phone everytime a colleague has something to communicate.
We text all day (the workplace is large and no one is going to waste time to physically find me if they can whatsapp). And unfortunately are expected to be somewhat responsive to whatsapp after work too.
I agree though that some people can get too close when texting. It's easy to put a stop to it though usually, if one wants too.

amother

Yellow

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 9:04 am

amother wrote:

I also work in a frum company, but in the U.S. I very often whatsapp or text with male coworkers when I'm not at work. I work less hours then them and there are often issues that they have to ask me a quick question about. I actually feel less comfortable speaking to them on the phone out of work, somehow I feel like texting is one step away from speaking, although I do speak to them when I need to.

At work we will have superficial friendly conversations. How was Shabbos, is your baby feeling better etc. But we never get very friendly.

DrMom

Sun, Mar 25 2018, 9:08 am

amother wrote:

This post is unnecessarily alarmist. The communication channel (texting) is not the issue, the content is.

We use texts/whatsapp quite frequently between work colleagues. Example:

Just last week, my boss was supposed to join a Skype conference call at 8pm our local time, but after 5 minutes of waiting, he was not on the line, so I whatsapped him, "Yaakov, we are speaking with John and Bill from Seattle now. Are you joining?" Reply, "PC crashed; Restarting. Please lead the conversation and start without me. I will join soon."

How is that inappropriate?