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Forum
-> Interesting Discussions
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amother
Aquamarine
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 Thu, Jun 28 2018, 7:26 am
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I am one of many children and when I was growing up we didn't even use plastic cups! My mother used to complain about all the glasses on the counter when she came home from work. And she told us to use one glass and not take a new one each time we took a drink.
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momofone613
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 7:59 am
I think the difference is that we
a) cook more/larger amounts
b) need to have separate pans for meat, milk and dairy. Whereas the non religious/Jews only need one set. We don't always have space/money to have 3 different sets, so makes sense if only need pareve (or dairy/meat) once in a while to buy disposable...
Also, shabbos cooking is crazy amount of food, so if u don't have enough "real" pans or want less of a clean up...
Just a guess.
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amother
Silver
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:26 am
| Frumwithallergies wrote: | I think that there is less environmental awareness in the frum world (not absence, just less). Bal taschit gets forgotten.
That being said, I buy disposables in bulk at pesach, really the only time I stock up, to use when I'm sending meals (after a friend delivers, or when a friend is sick c'v's. | [b]
The whole green environment theme is כפירה. Why? Because Hashem is the source of supply and he can save the world, not some crazy politicians that are scared the world is falling apart and they will save the universe. No, going green isn't a Jewish thing.
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pesek zman
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:34 am
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What I don't get is do people bring aluminum pans to the Shabbos table? Or do they transfer food to a serving dish or some kind? If it's the latter, then you're still doing dishes (or running dishwasher) Pyrex is the best in this way: oven to table!
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pesek zman
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:42 am
| amother wrote: | [b]
The whole green environment theme is כפירה. Why? Because Hashem is the source of supply and he can save the world, not some crazy politicians that are scared the world is falling apart and they will save the universe. No, going green isn't a Jewish thing. |
This is total BS. Like anything else (our health, our parnassah) we have to do our Hishtadlus! Of course Gd can save the world but we still have to do our part!
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amother
Blue
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:48 am
| pesek zman wrote: | | What I don't get is do people bring aluminum pans to the Shabbos table? Or do they transfer food to a serving dish or some kind? If it's the latter, then you're still doing dishes (or running dishwasher) Pyrex is the best in this way: oven to table! |
It is far easier to wash a serving platter than to wash a Pyrex with baked on kugel or chicken. Just saying.
(Perhaps if I was a better cook my food would never stick, but I have to live with my reality.)
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amother
Lavender
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 9:45 am
| pesek zman wrote: | | What I don't get is do people bring aluminum pans to the Shabbos table? Or do they transfer food to a serving dish or some kind? If it's the latter, then you're still doing dishes (or running dishwasher) Pyrex is the best in this way: oven to table! |
I wouldn't serve on aluminum pans or pyrex dishes so it would mean double clean-up for me.
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amother
Tangerine
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 11:25 am
| amother wrote: | | "enough said" implies that there is no further room for discussion here given the circumstances presented. Its actually kind of rude in a forum where people discuss things.(I noticed you removed it) | I originally wrote “enough said” because that reason alone is enough not to judge women of today’s generation in this matter. But I realized - there IS further room for discussion - that the reason I wrote is not the only reason - there are many more good ones - including the one I added on, that domestic help was very common. Also, if anyone is rude, it’s the poster who so flippantly declares that we are lazier than previous generations. I removed “enough said” because the one reason I provided didn’t do justice in defense of today’s women.
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Raisin
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 1:07 pm
| pesek zman wrote: | | What I don't get is do people bring aluminum pans to the Shabbos table? Or do they transfer food to a serving dish or some kind? If it's the latter, then you're still doing dishes (or running dishwasher) Pyrex is the best in this way: oven to table! |
I bring aluminium pans to the table if it is something like kugel.  I find it looks unappetising if cut up on a plate. (and wasteful if not eaten) Other foods get transferred to a plate.
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etky
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 1:53 pm
| Raisin wrote: | | I bring aluminium pans to the table if it is something like kugel. I find it looks unappetising if cut up on a plate. (and wasteful if not eaten) Other foods get transferred to a plate. |
There are decorative holders for disposable pans that make bringing them to the table more appealing. I've seen them in wicker and stainless.
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amother
Wheat
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 2:46 pm
| pesek zman wrote: | | What I don't get is do people bring aluminum pans to the Shabbos table? Or do they transfer food to a serving dish or some kind? If it's the latter, then you're still doing dishes (or running dishwasher) Pyrex is the best in this way: oven to table! |
If its just family, yeah, I serve in foil pans.
With guests, a Pyrex pan doesn't really look good enough for serving. Beside the fact that its often grease-splattered from cooking. Not to mention the fact that unless I use trivets -- which is a PITA -- it will burn my table, even through a tablecloth.
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amother
Black
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 2:57 pm
| amother wrote: | [b]
The whole green environment theme is כפירה. Why? Because Hashem is the source of supply and he can save the world, not some crazy politicians that are scared the world is falling apart and they will save the universe. No, going green isn't a Jewish thing. |
Here's a beautiful midrash, קהלת רבה ז:יג
בשעה שברא הקב"ה את אדם הראשון נטלו והחזירו על כל אילני גן עדן ואמר לו ראה מעשי כמה נאים ומשובחין הן וכל מה שבראתי בשבילך בראתי, תן דעתך שלא תקלקל ותחריב את עולמי, שאם קלקלת אין מי שיתקן אחריך
Rough translation:
When Hashem created Adam, He picked him up and showed him all the trees of Gan Eden. Hashem said, See My creations, how pleasant and wonderful they they are. Everything I created, I created for you. Take care not to spoil or destroy My world, for if you destroy it, no one can repair it after you.
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anon for this
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 3:01 pm
| amother wrote: | Here's a beautiful midrash, קהלת רבה ז:יג
בשעה שברא הקב"ה את אדם הראשון נטלו והחזירו על כל אילני גן עדן ואמר לו ראה מעשי כמה נאים ומשובחין הן וכל מה שבראתי בשבילך בראתי, תן דעתך שלא תקלקל ותחריב את עולמי, שאם קלקלת אין מי שיתקן אחריך
Rough translation:
When Hashem created Adam, He picked him up and showed him all the trees of Gan Eden. Hashem said, See My creations, how pleasant and wonderful they they are. Everything I created, I created for you. Take care not to spoil or destroy My world, for if you destroy it, no one can repair it after you. |
Thank you for sharing that.
In addition, we are commanded to avoid cutting down fruit trees when besieging a city. The Sefer HaChinuch states that this prohibition extends to wasting other resources as well.
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zaq
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 4:24 pm
| amother wrote: | [b]
The whole green environment theme is כפירה. Why? Because Hashem is the source of supply and he can save the world, not some crazy politicians that are scared the world is falling apart and they will save the universe. No, going green isn't a Jewish thing. |
Nonsense. Have you heatd of bal tashchit?
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amother
Blue
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 4:30 pm
Wasting something for no purpose is Bal Tashchis. Using foil pans to save 20 minutes scraping off burnt chicken from a Pyrex or paper plates to save another late night dishes session is not Bal Tashchis.
This is similar to the fact that it is not Bal Tashchis to throw away the rest of your ice cream cone instead of forcing yourself to eat it. (Obviously taking too much knowing you will need to throw half out WOULD be Bal Tashchis.)
There is of course a balance, but human dignity and sanity takes priority even over fruit trees.
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gamanit
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:37 pm
| amother wrote: | | The kosher reasons make sense. But plenty of non Jewish moms cook homemade food every night. I’m in some Facebook mom groups and I’ve seen that many cook just like we do. Though frum working moms need takeout or frozen food sometimes too. |
Yes, many cook as much as we do. I would say that a bigger percentage though does not. Also the ones I know that cook often are the ones that enjoy cooking and pyrex and reusable baking tins cook better. Most yidden cook for financial and kashrus reasons. Kosher takeout is really expensive and many don't trust ready made food from outside the home.
| amother wrote: | | Many religious Jews have two sinks for convenience, but that's not required. Sephardim often use only one dishwasher. And from what I've seen in Brooklyn and other neighborhoods, there are a lot of religious families eating takeout food. |
If you give me a choice between two sinks or a sink and a dishwasher I'll take two sinks any day. Our rav would certainly not allow us to use one dishwasher for milchigs and fleishigs so even if I'd have room for one it would only be for fleishigs. Yes a lot of people eat takeout but even more cook their own food- at least in my area.
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amother
Purple
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 10:11 pm
I am actually the owner of a...……..paper goods store! I've done quite a bit of market research and even some competitive intelligence.
Yes, disposable pans, are definitely more of a "jewish" thing. Go into a shop that serves the Jewish community vs. a "regular" store (supermarket, warehouse club, big box discounter) and more often than not, the selection in a "Jewish" store will surpass the other store. Obviously, it varies from store-to-store, but you get the idea.
For example, my local stores (supermarket, or target/Walmart) carry foil pans. But they have a much more limited selection: 9*13, roaster, square pan, round cake pan, muffin, and maybe a loaf pan. They tend to be expensive (at least 1.49 for a 2-pack). In my local Aldi-- they don't even sell foil pans, and another store only carries them around the non-Jewish holidays.
Compare to a Jewish store (like mine): 9*13 in various depths, 7 and 9" cake pans in various depths, bundt pans, loaf pans in a variety of sizes, challah pans in 4 different sizes, etc... For the popular sizes (9x13, mostly), I even carry various levels of quality--- economy, standard, and heavy-duty!
In regards to recycling, it honestly HURTS me the amount of paper that I use. But in my current stage of life, the foil pans are a big help....  In my city, we can recycle foil pans once they've been rinsed, which I usually do. Not sure how common that is.
What's ironic is that I was the girl who spearheaded the Recycling committee in my BY high school. It bothered me that so much paper and snapple bottles were being thrown out, so I asked my principal if we could start recycling --- this was at a time when it wasn't common outside of the house to recycle. My principal was happy to give me a job to keep me out of trouble! While others were Production head or GO Head, I was Recycling Head! I used to separate the metal from the glass--- that was my job! 
I'm sure I outed myself now....how many girls were Recycling Head?
Just a note about tevila on the foil pans: just becase a pan has a hechsher, it doesn't mean you don't need to toivel it. You have to find out what segment of the manufacturing process the hechsher is on. Some companies have a hechsher to let people know that the foil pan hasn't been covered with any non-kosher petroleum substance in the manufacturing process. (There are some people who wash foil pans without a hechsher for this reason. I do not, but I've heard from some of my customers that people do this. )
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amother
Lavender
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Thu, Jun 28 2018, 11:12 pm
| amother wrote: | I am actually the owner of a...……..paper goods store! I've done quite a bit of market research and even some competitive intelligence.
Yes, disposable pans, are definitely more of a "jewish" thing. Go into a shop that serves the Jewish community vs. a "regular" store (supermarket, warehouse club, big box discounter) and more often than not, the selection in a "Jewish" store will surpass the other store. Obviously, it varies from store-to-store, but you get the idea.
For example, my local stores (supermarket, or target/Walmart) carry foil pans. But they have a much more limited selection: 9*13, roaster, square pan, round cake pan, muffin, and maybe a loaf pan. They tend to be expensive (at least 1.49 for a 2-pack). In my local Aldi-- they don't even sell foil pans, and another store only carries them around the non-Jewish holidays.
Compare to a Jewish store (like mine): 9*13 in various depths, 7 and 9" cake pans in various depths, bundt pans, loaf pans in a variety of sizes, challah pans in 4 different sizes, etc... For the popular sizes (9x13, mostly), I even carry various levels of quality--- economy, standard, and heavy-duty!
In regards to recycling, it honestly HURTS me the amount of paper that I use. But in my current stage of life, the foil pans are a big help.... In my city, we can recycle foil pans once they've been rinsed, which I usually do. Not sure how common that is.
What's ironic is that I was the girl who spearheaded the Recycling committee in my BY high school. It bothered me that so much paper and snapple bottles were being thrown out, so I asked my principal if we could start recycling --- this was at a time when it wasn't common outside of the house to recycle. My principal was happy to give me a job to keep me out of trouble! While others were Production head or GO Head, I was Recycling Head! I used to separate the metal from the glass--- that was my job!
I'm sure I outed myself now....how many girls were Recycling Head?
Just a note about tevila on the foil pans: just becase a pan has a hechsher, it doesn't mean you don't need to toivel it. You have to find out what segment of the manufacturing process the hechsher is on. Some companies have a hechsher to let people know that the foil pan hasn't been covered with any non-kosher petroleum substance in the manufacturing process. (There are some people who wash foil pans without a hechsher for this reason. I do not, but I've heard from some of my customers that people do this. ) |
First time I'm hearing that people toivel foil pans. Is this really a thing?
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PinkFridge
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Fri, Jun 29 2018, 8:41 am
| amother wrote: |
Just a note about tevila on the foil pans: just becase a pan has a hechsher, it doesn't mean you don't need to toivel it. You have to find out what segment of the manufacturing process the hechsher is on. Some companies have a hechsher to let people know that the foil pan hasn't been covered with any non-kosher petroleum substance in the manufacturing process. (There are some people who wash foil pans without a hechsher for this reason. I do not, but I've heard from some of my customers that people do this. ) |
But if it b'feirush says, aina tzricha tevila?
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moonstone
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Sun, Jul 08 2018, 2:08 pm
Israel's addiction to disposables- very disturbing article!
Wow, I had no idea it was THIS bad! I agree with the person interviewed who said that there should be a high tax on disposables-- since supermarkets started charging for plastic bags, usage has gone down. Maybe the same would happen with disposables. We are really out of control, this is ridiculous!
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