Frustrated with our schools

amother

Puce

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 12:49 pm

Orchid wrote:

You do your prep work on Erev YT? Or the week leading up to Pesach?
Many of the days off are not to make up for all the time you spend at home preparing. It's just a perk. Nice if you can get it.

My favorite comment I hear from all my teacher friends, "so what are you doing this summer?" Whatever I do in the winter, buddy.

I am not off in the week leading up to Pesach (though my kids are). No, I don't do prep on erev Y"T because my kids are off and I can't do prep when they need to be taken care of. I do my prep at night when they are sleeping. Like I said in my other post, I am not here to debate what days should be school days and which days not. Most of the days that people are complaining about are days that my school has school and my children are off. I would rather work on erev Y"T and have flexibility to take off a day here and there when my kids have school because I can't get work done when my kids are home. Obviously many teachers would feel differently but I can only speak for myself.

amother

Burgundy

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 1:21 pm

Orchid wrote:

How does what a teacher does eruv pesach effect you? I have rushed to mark papers and tests to get grades out eruv Pesach because the students want them. Does that make you feel better that I am not sitting with my feet up relaxing? What possible difference could it make to you?

Orchid

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 8:22 pm

amother wrote:

Teachers should not say they need time off to mark and grade when they are not using that time off to mark and grade (such as erev YT). Getting erev YT off and using it to prepare for YT is a perk. A nice one. Which is fine. I get some nice perks at my job too. But a teacher saying she "needs" that day in "order to mark and grade" is dishonest. Call it what it is- a perk.

lucky14

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 8:51 pm

I have been a teacher and have also worked in quite a few other fields of employment and I can tell you that the vacation days we get are extremely helpful. Trust me you do NOT want your children's teachers feeling burned out. I'm not going to comment on how hard it is for working parents to have to find someone to watch their children on those days off, only that for those who are saying all jobs are stressful and everyone could use more time off...just remember these days are helpful for our well-being and we are able to be better teachers and have more patience due to them. Trust me you want us to have those days "off". (oh and btw I LOVE teaching and love the kids and I still feel this way).

gold21

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 9:22 pm

I'm pretty sure that all US schools are legally required to have a specific minimum number of school days- both public schools and private schools. If you tally up the total number of school days in any given school year in any given school, it is usually the same number.

Nobody is being tricked or cheated out of school days. All schools follow the same Bd of Ed rules regarding # of school days, including Jewish schools.

I personally don't know many women who work full time with inflexible schedules. So to say that it is "the way of the world" in 2018 is perhaps representative of your community, but not of mine. Most women I know have one of the following work situations:

Flexible work hours- for example, speech therapist. (So many speech therapists!!!)

Follow the school system: p3, seit, teacher...

Work full-time with full-time nanny in the home (Nanny is usually home with a baby under age 2... Not sure how it works when there are no more babies at home)

Stay at home mom (I know quite a few)

I understand the frustrations being expressed on this thread, it is very stressful to have to struggle to find coverage for your kids while you're working. I completely agree that it's a legitimate issue and in no way do I want to minimize your struggles ... I'm just sharing another point of view. Good Luck!!

amother

Burgundy

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 9:49 pm

Orchid wrote:

The teachers are using their time off to mark and grade. They are also using their time off to bond with parents because parental support is found to increase children's progress.

How a person distributes their time is not your concern. Whether they are marking on a particular day or going for a monogram or enjoying a day with DH or cleaning, it is their time which does not have to be accounted to you.

How is it your concern what goes on in another's household?

amother

Puce

Sun, Aug 12 2018, 10:34 pm

Orchid wrote:

I think you were originally responding to my post. I said that I am not trying to make a point about specific days being school days or off days. Just that overall I wouldn't be able to teach without a calendar that allows time to prep and do the other work (grading papers, communicating with parents, etc.) required of me. If I need erev Y"T to prepare for Y"T it is often because I didn't have time on nights and weekends because I was doing my work for my job. Personally, if I couldn't manage a job that involved tons of work at home and very limited days off. But I am also not saying that specifically Erev Y"T should be a day off from school. For me it is mostly about having the summer off because I can send my kids to camp and have time to prepare.

amother

Amethyst

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 3:26 am

amother wrote:

Again, every school is different but EVERY SINGLE TIME our parent body freaked out over a date change, no one bothered calling the office to find out why. And guess what? After bad mouthing every school administrator on Facebook and whatapp, someone decided to call and yell in person and when the explanation for the date change was given, the response was a sheepish, oh Ok, I guess that makes sense. Well of course it makes sense! We use our heads!

Now I'm not saying every school administration makes all the right choices, but please don't assume we are all terrible people till you pick up the phone and call.

Is there any reason that the explanation for the date change can't be communicated to the entire parent body? They are not mind readers. They are paying tuition and have every right to understand the process.

amother

Burlywood

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 3:58 am

Most teacher friends and family I know (in Israel) do not use the summer to prepare. They spend time with their kids, some of the teachers travel abroad. It's a time to recharge, and it keeps many of the teachers sane during a very challenging work year.

Legally, schools in Israel are currently only allowed to have one day of school meeting prep at the end of August.

I am not going to debate whether teachers 'deserve' this time off, or whether it's only necessary if they spend all their vacations marking papers. I am also sure that there are other very difficult jobs that deserve better conditions.

Apparently teaching is not a gold mine if 25% of teachers (in Israel) leave the field within the first five years of teaching. The numbers are staggering.

For those I know, at least, teaching is such an intense position, that they would not stay if the 'perks' of vacation were cancelled or significantly decreased. Let's put it this way, the salary would then need to be significantly increased to make up for it. But everything is supply and demand. You can change the conditions for new teachers entering the field (you can't change them for veteran teachers nearing retirement), and see what pool of teachers you are left with after a few years.

rzab

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 7:32 am

amother wrote:

First of all, it is incorrect that you are only allowed one meeting a summer. My school has three full days of meetings. One in the beginning of July and two at the end of August. And by the way, it is not like the teachers are given these dates before hand. They tell us the dates at the last minute and they are not very accommodating if it conflicts with travel plans.

Second of all, while teachers do take part of the summer to recharge, relax and spend time with their family, I have never met a teacher who does not spend time preparing for the following year. The only difference is that they are more flexible about time and when they can sit and do it. And that is for the (israeli) teachers who are not taking anywhere between thirty to sixty hours of histalmuyot (continued education classes). Which you need to do if you ever want to go up in pay scale or maintain your teaching license.

I do agree with your end point though. Like I said up thread, no one in any profession would stand for losing vacation days without an increase in pay and teachers should not be expected to either

Orchid

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 8:28 am

amother wrote:

This statement was made upthread: "teachers need erev YT off in order to mark and grade."

True of false?

My entire post was pointing out this was not true. Unless it is true?

Nowhere did I insist that during time off teachers must spend their time only on prep or that I deserve any sort of accounting of their time off Rolling Eyes

. I was commenting on that one statement only, which we all know is mostly not true. That's all. No other commentary on what they do during time off.

amother

Burlywood

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 8:29 am

rzab wrote:

Your school is probably doing something illegal, if it is a public school. Both the irgun and histadrut unions have stipulated over the past few years that only one day of school meetings is allowed at the end of August. I do not believe that changed this year.
You can call your union rep to inquire.

amother

Burlywood

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 8:32 am

rzab wrote:

Second of all, while teachers do take part of the summer to recharge, relax and spend time with their family, I have never met a teacher who does not spend time preparing for the following year. The only difference is that they are more flexible about time and when they can sit and do it. And that is for the (israeli) teachers who are not taking anywhere between thirty to sixty hours of histalmuyot (continued education classes). Which you need to do if you ever want to go up in pay scale or maintain your teaching license.

Agree. Teachers do spend time on prep. I was just saying that they dont need to dedicate all their summer to it in order to justify their vacation.
And yes, those hishtalmut courses are annoying time consumers that teachers have to fit in their schedule too.

amother

Burlywood

Mon, Aug 13 2018, 8:42 am

Orchid wrote:

. I was commenting on that one statement only, which we all know is mostly not true. That's all. No other commentary on what they do during time off.

In Israel most of the workforce is off erev yom tov, so it's a moot point.
I dont complain about the bank tellers cooking on erev yom tov and therefore I cant do my bank business.
Again, if there is a big demand and you pay everyone more they will probably be willing to work erev yom tov.
At the very least go to your school administration and organize camp or babysitting days for those problem days, on school grounds. It will still cost you but not as much as retaining the teachers those hours.

Schools are not such lucrative businesses, otherwise I would say it would be a great business venture to open a school that teaches all year round. Demand would be high. But no one can offer that, apparently; schools are struggling as is.