Bilha and Zilpah? | Imamother

causemommysaid

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 6:47 pm

amother wrote:

We learnt in school that Bilah and Zilpah where not tzedaikos. I'll ask my hub to explain it better to me.

Please explain

Seas

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 6:50 pm

amother wrote:

My great-grandma was a Zilpah. None of us would use it—it sounds too much like Zelda, with apologies to all Zelda’s. I assume that in F Scott Fitzgerald’s day it was considered a lovely name. Today, not so much.

Names come and go and their popularity or lack of it has little to do with how good or important the original character was. Huldah was a neviah no less than Avigayil, but do you know many—or any— Huldahs? Does anyone even know or care who she was? Yoel and Yonah are pretty popular, and Ovadiah has the Sefaradi market locked up, but were they any more deserving than Tzefaniah, Chagai and Chavakuk who appear in the same volume of your Tanach? Why Daniel and not his comrades -in -fire Mishael and Azariah?

Because that’s how it worked out. Don’t look for logic or reason in fashion.

And I know several people named Yehosuha but not one named Shoftim.

amother

Chartreuse

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 6:51 pm

Seas wrote:

And I know several people named Yehosuha but not one named Shoftim.

That's because Yehosuha was a person. No one was called Shoftim. Same way we don't name anyone bereishis.

Seas

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 6:52 pm

amother wrote:

That's because Yehosuha was a person. No one was called Shoftim. Same way we don't name anyone bereishis.

Dry humor doesn't always come across very well in writing.

amother

Denim

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 7:15 pm

Bilha and Zilpa are almost anonymous in the torah.
I would love to hear an explanation according to Zohar.
Things are not always what they seem. I think Leah and Rachel each had harder lives than
the two of them.

amother

Denim

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 7:19 pm

dbw wrote:

Here's a link that addresses this question:

https://www.chabad.org/parshah.....s.htm

thank you for the link. May hashem bless you with all good.

gold21

Wed, Nov 14 2018, 10:47 pm

I do actually know a zilpah, lol!

Anyway, such a great question, one that I have wondered about. Why are Bilhah and Zilpah not considered Imahos if they birthed a number of the shevatim?

Definitely would love to learn more on this topic.

cbsp

Thu, Nov 15 2018, 12:57 am

They are mentioned in a kinah we say on Tisha b'av... I guess because their descendants were going into Golus - which would imply that they did not completely relinquish their respective children to Rochel and Leah

IIRC, one of Yosef's complaints about the other shvatim was that they taunted Dan, Naftaly, Gad, and Asher by calling them "bnai hashfachos."

Last edited by cbsp on Thu, Nov 15 2018, 7:16 am; edited 2 times in total

Sleepymama

Thu, Nov 15 2018, 1:45 am

dbw wrote:

Here's a link that addresses this question:

https://www.chabad.org/parshah.....s.htm

Beautiful answer on chabbad 👆. Thanks for sharing!

etky

Thu, Nov 15 2018, 1:48 am

cbsp wrote:

They are mentioned in a kinah we say on Tisha b'av... I guess because their descendants were going into Golus - which would imply that they did not completely relinquish their respective children to Rochel and Leah)

IIRC, one of Yosef's complaints about the other shvatim was that they taunted Dan, Naftaly, Gad, and Asher by calling them "bnai hashvachos."

They are referred to as the children of the shfachot in the text itself (see parshat Vayishlach for example), and this identification carries through to chazal and onwards. This lesser status is also reflected later in the story of the tribes' settlement of the land (sefer Yehoshua and Shoftim). The leading tribes (mainly Yehuda, Levi, Efraim, Menashe and Binyamin) were those descended from Leah and Rachel. Asher, Naftali, Gad and Dan were peripheral (and, in the case of Dan,problematic) both in terms of leadership and in terms of their nachalot.

imasoftov

Thu, Nov 15 2018, 4:13 am

Seas wrote:

And I know several people named Yehosuha but not one named Shoftim.

The late cartoonist Dudu Geva had a character named Yehoshua Shoftim.