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Forum
-> Relationships
-> Manners & Etiquette
bigsis144
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 Sun, Nov 18 2018, 9:09 am
K and I went to the same small (less than a dozen kids per grade) elementary school and were very good friends. We went to different high schools and seminaries, and drifted apart.
I probably last saw K in person 12ish years ago and maybe spoke to her once more like 9-10 years ago to wish her mazal tov before her wedding or something. We live in different cities and have pretty much lost touch.
But our parents still live in the same town and our mothers occasionally catch up with one another.
I just found out that K’s child was sick for a long time and died, R”L. This week is the shiva, and my mother forwarded me a community-newsletter-type email with K’s phone number, email and shiva info.
I can’t imagine what K must be going through. I want to be as polite, sensitive and thoughtful as possible. Is it okay to call “out of the blue” after 10 years just to say, “Hi, it’s bigsis, do you remember me? I heard your child died, I’m so sorry. HaMakom Yenachem...” ?
Any advice?
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grace413
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 9:15 am
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BDE. Perhaps under the circumstances email would be better.
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ROFL
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 9:21 am
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An email today and a call after shiva - unless you can have someone go to shiva and if there are no other people then you can call at that time.
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dankbar
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:18 am
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I'm not sure she would appreciate that all of a sudden you're here
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amother
Natural
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:23 am
I think you should. It will be awkward, and your friend probably won't say much,but she'll appreciate that you reached out.
When I sat shivah for a parent and a girl from the grade above me (this was after HS. I was married.) called, I was touched.
If you'd rather email, that is fine too.
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amother
Natural
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:26 am
You can just say,
This is bigsis, K. I just heard about your loss and I feel terrible. I don't know what to say. I'm so sorry.
(Pause and see if she responds. If not, continue with:)
Hamakom....
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amother
Periwinkle
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:30 am
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It’s so awkward when someone calls during shiva. There is nothing to say, just say the pasuk and hang up. I remember I got phone calls 2/3 weeks later and people just want to comfort me it was so special.
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sunflowershine
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:31 am
YES! YES! YES
Would mean so much to her
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Zehava
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:34 am
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You don’t have to but if you want to it wouldn’t be abnormal. Many people show up out of the boondocks at shiva even though they couldn’t be bothered to attend any simcha.
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amother
Purple
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 10:38 am
I lost my father yound and didn't take everyone's phone calls.
Losing a child cannot compare.
But an email would be a tremendous form of condolences.
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Ruchel
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 11:39 am
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My mom is just out of shiva. Cemetery was today. Do NOT call. Email, text...
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ra_mom
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 11:41 am
I would probably mail a heartfelt card.
But you can call if you're comfortable. Whatever you do to reach out is ok and the right thing to do.
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zaq
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 11:49 am
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Make the call. Nichum avelim is always awkward but it will make your friend feel good that you cared enough to call.
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leah233
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 2:34 pm
My husband was in the exact same situation.
In the end, after plenty of ruminating, he felt awkward and didn't go be menachem avel or call.
Lo and behold two weeks later he met the old friend. It was a lot more awkward than had he gone or called...Not only that, the friend told him that a lot of old classmates did make the trip to the other city to be menachem avel. Despite not having spoke to the father in the past twenty years.
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amother
Scarlet
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 3:30 pm
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I would say where were you when her child was sick & they needed the help? I am dealing with disease of child last few years. Some really showed they care & are true friends that helped me immensely.....some people who are even close family members didn't give a hoot & it hurts.
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bigsis144
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 3:41 pm
| amother wrote: | | I would say where were you when her child was sick & they needed the help? I am dealing with disease of child last few years. Some really showed they care & are true friends that helped me immensely.....some people who are even close family members didn't give a hoot & it hurts. |
I am sorry you are going through this situation with your child, and wish them a Refuah Sheleima. May you see yeshuos soon!
I clarified in my OP that I simply fell out of touch - we live in different states, and *neither of us* made a huge effort to maintain regular contact. So I had no idea she was going through this, nor did I live close enough to find out from other sources or offer any practical help. I feel so terrible that I never even knew a name to daven for!
I still think fondly on the closer friendship we had decades ago, though, and I hope that whatever condolences I can offer are a comfort to her. Hence, my request for advice on how to do so with sensitivity and tact.
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simcha2
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 3:46 pm
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I think you should definitely try and be menachem avel, by phone, letter or email. Also, I think it would be appropriate to send a condolence note to the grandparents. I think because someone isn't sitting Shiva we sometimes forget that they have also had a loss.
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amother
Scarlet
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 5:52 pm
Big sis I didn't mean anything against you. I am just trying to say, that you are the only one that knows the relationship you had with her, while you were growing up. You would know if she'd be ok if you just picked up the pieces now. People grieve differently. Some people like to do it privately, in peace & are not interested in every random person showing up by shiva. Others like to share their pain with others & talk. What is your friend's personality like?
I imagine that losing a child chas vsholom is most probably the most difficult shiva for the mourner & for the visiters. I would think a quick call or text/email during shiva is ok.
The rule about visiting a shiva house is if you would make an effort to come when they make a simcha say a wedding that means you are close enough.
Also depends on a class. In my class, it is expected for all classmates to pay a shiva call, whether you are close to classmate today or not.
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amother
Scarlet
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 5:55 pm
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I sat shiva as teenager (nisht mer gedacht). I remember that close people you want to be there for support. Stam strangers is not always beneficial
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amother
Taupe
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Sun, Nov 18 2018, 6:13 pm
I recently posted a thread about needing to be menachem avel someone but not feeling comfortable enough to do it. In the end, I went with someone and when she said hamakom I just said it after her and left - wondering whether I had done the right thing or should have stayed to actually speak to the avel. It was awkward (for me at least!) and I felt stupid. Fast forward a few weeks and I recently spoke to her - the first thing she did was thank me for coming to shiva. To quote the avel “while not unexpected it was very much appreciated”
Make the call. It doesn’t need to be a long conversation. You won’t regret doing a good deed
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