Social Work | Imamother

amother

Mistyrose

Thu, Dec 20 2018, 12:07 pm

amother wrote:

I work as a nurse and I do not envy the hospital social workers!

Case 1: woman with schizophrenia + 2 young children has a psychotic fit and physically attacks a nurse taking care of her child. Security is called and woman is forced into care but 1-2 days later after being medicated she is out and back in the ward. Guess who has to be present the whole time this woman is visiting her child? Social worker.

Case 2: a very difficult couple comes to my ward, the woman is hospitalized in a different ward so I don't know their full story, they just came to mine for a small procedure, takes a few hours but the while time they are yelling and sulking and demanding to be treated differently than all our other patients. I'm so happy to see them go and that I had minimal interaction with them. I see on the computer that during their stay they had met with a social worker several times.

I had imagined social workers helping meek, needy people, but sometimes they are called just because the rest of us don't know how to deal with psychotics and as$holes. I admire social workers and am very grateful for them. I would not want their job.

Is this what a psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner would need to do? Is it a 12-hour shift job involving the situations you outlined above?

momomany

Thu, Dec 20 2018, 12:23 pm

amother wrote:

Is this what a psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner would need to do? Is it a 12-hour shift job involving the situations you outlined above?

Psychiatric NPs assess and diagnose patients, provide psychotherapy and prescribe medication. They treat patients with diagnosed disorders, as well as those with family histories or other factors that increase the likelihood of potential mental illness.

google PMHNP roles to get more info.

this site is a start
https://frontier.edu/news/top-.....mhnp/

amother

Mistyrose

Sun, Dec 23 2018, 9:53 pm

I currently am halfway through my BA in liberal arts (done through TTI), which I wanted to apply for a masters in social work.

The field I am most interested in, is psychology and counseling. However, I opted to go for an accelerated social work degree and afterwards take advanced courses in the type of therapy module I am interested in. This was mainly due to financial concerns.

My financial situation is tight, I am divorced and have no financial support. I keep getting cold feet about the route I'm going because I'm nervous about the financial aspect. Besides for all the backlash and lack of job opportunities.

One poster recommended looking into a psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner. I did a bit of research, and I really am not interested in working in a nursing capacity. I am not interested in learning nursing, it's not a field I want to go into. However, I am wondering if I can get a job as a PMHNP, that may be more what I am interested in. However, it would mean starting over again, the BSN takes 3 years, and then I would need another 2 years to get my MSN. Which means investing at least 3 years without working.

On the other hand, the SW degree will also take 2 years to get my MSW, then at least another year of supervised experience. At the end of this time, with the PMHNP degree, I guess my salary would be better, but I don't know what my quality of life would be. I don't know if the PMHNP field has flexible possibilities so that I can be home for my kids emotionally as well as a somewhat flexible schedule.

What do you mothers think - which route makes more sense? If any of you have any other leads or suggestions, that would be a big help!!! Thanks so much!

amother

Powderblue

Sun, Dec 23 2018, 11:40 pm

I think, as some have posted, anyone in then freelance field which social work is, needs to have a good business sense and siyata dishmaya.

My husband got his degree via LIU Frum program & found the education on par or exceeded the others from mainstream colleges in his supervision group.

Yes it’s a tough couple of years till you can go private but we did it for both financial reasons and more importantly quality of life.

He was done with 9-6 jobs and wanted a life where he could set his own hours while being very fulfilled.

It’s true the field is flooded but the busy ones are full and BH making a great livingg

amother

Rose

Mon, Dec 24 2018, 9:51 pm

I had been looking for jobs on Indeed and was contacted by the corporate office of a chain of health centers. They emailed me about 10 questions (most were on my resume but ok). I have over 10 years of experience, have a clinical license, went to regular graduate school. After answering them, she emails me back, "Salary is $25 an hour. What are your thoughts?"
I didn't know whether to laugh or cry. There are non-Jewish and Jewish places that pay better especially for in-community work (going to people's houses)but you lose out by having to travel in addition to it being quite unpleasant at times and of course, no benefits, don't get paid if person cancels etc.

amother

Cobalt

Mon, Dec 24 2018, 10:25 pm

As a SW student who is starting grad school soon (already have a BSW) I'm finding this thread very disheartening! Are there any actual social workers on this forum that can give me a better picture of what the field *really* looks like for newbies? I would like to hear directly from the source rather than cousins of, neighbors of, etc.

amother

Rose

Mon, Dec 24 2018, 10:41 pm

I am a licensed clinical social worker and I'm sorry to dishearten you but I'm portraying reality.

amother

Babyblue

Mon, Dec 24 2018, 11:35 pm

amother wrote:

I am a licensed clinical social worker and I'm sorry to dishearten you but I'm portraying reality.

I'm an LMSW and I agree with this. The market is flooded no thanks to Reb. Bulka's program. It's hard to find a job that offers clinical hours and supervision that actually pays well. I'm in the field for 7 years and still have not managed to complete my hours for my clinical license.

nia73

Mon, Dec 24 2018, 11:51 pm

amother wrote:

As I stated before, I have a BS in Psychology, MSW, LCSW, PhD, & have 10 years of clinical experience. I am a qualified supervisor for those seeking licensure. The reality is very much an honest picture coming from this thread. MANY of the BSW students that I mentor have an unrealistic understanding of SW. Thinking: "I want to help people", "I want to be a therapist because so many people come to me with their problems", & "I love kids" .... all great attitudes. Do not get me wrong. But this is a gritty field that many leave due to burn out.

You really do not realize the ails of society until you are a social worker. Futher, you are over worked, under valued, and sent to "do the dirty work" as one of the nurse IMAs noted that most get compassion fatigue early on.

This does not mean to change career paths. It just means you need to know what you are getting into with eyes wide open. Feel free to pm me if you need a mentor/guidance/ support 🤗.

amother

Cobalt

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 12:35 am

Thank you to those who took the time to respond. Although I do not plan on quitting grad school because of this, I think it is healthier for me to break those unrealistic expectations now instead of later. That said, what in your professional opinion sets apart a good social worker from a great one (meaning one that is not only good people wise but also business wise) aside for being trained in a specific modality? What does one need to do to climb to the top in order to be able to eventually open a successful private practice?

ILOVELIFE

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 12:48 am

Finding this thread interesting.
While the field is flooded, as someone who interviews and refers to therapists, I still don’t have enough ppl

The good ones fill quickly and even new ones go to the top quickly if they’re good

Network hard with those in the field
Be humble
Keep learning
Hustle
Run a smart business

Like powderblue, my husband is in LIU and is BH in a great internship which will IyH continue for hours towards licensure

Those years pay peanuts but if you have the right supervision and good structure, you can take on a few private clients for private pay. It’s not for everyone and it needs great supervision but it can be done

amother

Babyblue

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 1:19 am

ILOVELIFE wrote:

Re: the bolded, I don't think this is legal. An LMSW is not allowed to see clients privately even while under supervision.

nia73

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:11 am

amother wrote:

Unlike other professions such as those in let's say business, accounting, and the like, the "ladder" does not exist in social work in those terms per say.

Case in point: Ok you have your BS in a social science (as required/suggested by most accredited MSW programs)... That was step one. Now, this means you pretty much are pigeonholed as a case manager clinically at best. These are the crumbs of the "peanuts" being paid. I'm talking $25k crumbs. (Do not confuse this with medical case management which typically requires licensure).

Moving on "up the ladder": You are in an MSW program. Now some are accelerated if you have a BSW specifically (think 1 year opposed to 2). Some would think this is the best option, but my clinical expertise says it depends. If you are older, have some substantial job AND real world experience/trying to re-train in another field then yes. But for the typical young student who has no work experience beyond summer/part-time jobs, internships, and the like, not such a good idea. Esp coming from the frum world if you have not been exposed/integrated in other cultures/worldviews/socioeconomic variations/etc. The value of 2 years gives both the theoretical as well as practical "practice rounds" to play with your population of choice all be it through (mostly unpaid) internships. (This luxury is not so affordable once you complete your degree). Truthfully, most end up being paper pushers as interns but smart ones take note and lay attention to work environment, networks, and are truely appreciating the training opposed to those rushing just to get out and on with their private practice aspirations or career shifts.

Fine. Step 2 is done be it 1 or 2 years...

Ladder step 3: Now MSW is in hand. Welcome to the real market flood of our day (before about 15 years ago, there was a gap of "grandfathered" SWs who were experts in their specialty because they were doing it away before NASW and the regs that were/are being established to be considered social work clinicians. This gap began to close as employers began to require minimal MSW, those veterans began to retire and the new (current) wave of social workers started to graduate. Most are not experts but have degrees (as is the case in most professions today... over educated, under qualified in clinical expertise).

OP of this question, you will join this pack. Simply by virtue of the time you are entering the field. It sounds like you have grand expectations BH. But without knowing you prior clinical experience and population of choice, I can say that you have aspired to have a booming private practice sooner than later. But this will take time.

Even if you have access to revenue head on, a marketing strategy already implemented, top tier financial networks/referral sources, a unique modality that you have been trained in extensively and plainly put "a name".... still takes time virtue the need to practice under a supervisor as a registered intern.

#4... big leagues clinically: LCSW (as defined I most states). Free to practice independently BH. But again... market is bottlenecking slowly but surely. Most positions (should you have to do like most of us and still have a regular full-time job) are asking you to conduct home visits, many are getting hipped to only hiring LCSWs as 1099 (independent contractors... I.e. as referrals come, no medical benefits, you pay taxes at the end of the year, and so on).

Now this is not bad esp. if you have other means of financial support and let us say need time with family, do not want to explain/ask for PTO during chagim/Shabbat and so in if working in non-Jewish sectors. Further, you skip the now blatant slavery people are being exposed to by being over worked with little pay/flexibility regardless of experience/degrees, etc.

And... that is pretty much your top lol.

Unless you move from clinical to more administrative. Slightly higher pay, little client/patient interaction. STILL over worked in most places.

And if you really want to do something else, you could do what I did which was add academia to the pallet. Or go the policy route which is not clinical at all but higher pay over all...

nia73

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 3:14 am

Sorry for long past. But another thing may be getting in good with the VA. I think that is the highest pay but the vetting of the applicants is hard and what I understand you need to know someone to get in since there are so many applicants. I would be interested to find out if this was indeed the case as several of my interns have tried many times but no such success.

amother

Khaki

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 8:59 am

amother wrote:

Thanks for saying that.
I am a hospital social worker and deal with all the stuff you mentioned plus suicidal and psychotic patients who are hospitalized for deliveries or other medical issues. I deal with abused children who have to be interrogated in the hospital without their parents knowing (play cat and mouse ever?), I support and listen and deal with crises.
I get paid about half of what nurses get.

amother

Red

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 9:27 am

cnc wrote:

Because it takes much longer.

It's worth it, she'll make much more money

amother

Rose

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 9:28 am

Nobody mentioned the joys of school social work. Unrealistic expectations by teachers and principals (fix up this mess of a child from a family of intergenerational dysfunction) or a lack of understanding of your role and the politics, mostly the politics (oh no! you offended a parent. ..no, we won't tell you which one because she doesn't want us to so you can't even repair it). On second thought, you are probably better just smiling and playing games a whole day, if your stomach can handle it. Then they can't blame you for anything but they might not rehire you the next year because they didn't see results.

momomany

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 9:54 am

Trying to get back to the crux of your question. As I understand, you feel that you would do well (and enjoy) in a field that would involve counseling and helping others. You are also seeking the shortest schooling possible and an end goal of the highest salary possible. As I see it, a Phd in psychology or PMHNP are the way to go.
Going for a BSN when you really dislike nursing is a bit problematic, but if you need to earn money fast and if paying for a higher degree is an issue, then nursing might be a good idea to think about. Its a "short" 3 years with financial aid (if you are in NY, think Pell and Tap grants) for a BSN. You can then earn 90K in a NYC hospital working as an RN. You can try for a job in a psych unit if that field interests you most. Most NYC hospitals will also offer varying amounts of tuition reimbursement to help cover your cost of the PMNHP degree while you work as an RN. Many (most?) PMNHP programs are geared to people who work.
Hatzlacha rabba!
I dont know much about the route (time, $, earning power as you move along etc.) to a Psych Phd so ill let others chime in to help you with that

amother

Red

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 10:11 am

amother wrote:

I'm in Europe not US , I started my second job this yearm have a master's in SW and I work in foster care. I get paid okay , could be better but I get a raise every year, when I'm pregnant I get full pay and don't have to work at all and my kids go to kindergarten for free. I like my job.

amother

Mistyrose

Tue, Dec 25 2018, 9:52 pm

Thank you so much to all of you who took the time and energy to respond. It seems like this will be a difficult decision to make.

I hear all the different sides, don't know what Hashem has in store for me, what I'm meant to accomplish and how, and of course where each decision will lead me and what the responsible thing to do is.

Do any of you know if and how a BA can be transferred to a BSN? Additionally, is the work as a LMHNP the same as a nurse in terms of shifts or is there more flexibility? Is there room for outpatient work in this field, say in a rehab program?

Thanks again and may we all be blessed with vision and heavenly guidance, in every aspect of our lives.