ElAl sale, I'm so torn - miss school/work?

amother

Mauve

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 8:49 am

nchr wrote:

A teacher should not be preparing documentation on isru chag. The same material should be used annually and should be updated the summer prior. There should be a planner and the schedule should be followed. If I ask you for the work for the second week in March today, you should be able to give it to me today, although some stuff may change slightly or be added. I said to go on vacation and I'm a person who will send my kids to school with fevers, so...

Please stop sending your kids to school with fever. It is incredibly selfish.

amother

Pewter

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 9:40 am

DrMom wrote:

This. A teacher is in charge of a classroom of 20-30 kids.

A single student's absence does not impact the ability of the classroom to operate as usual.

Besides, in the end, we have to do what is best for us and our kids, and not what is best for our teacher. In making my choice, I would take into consideration the ticket prices, the ability to make up lost schoolwork, the educational value, etc -- NOT how the teacher personally feels about my child missing school.

Of course! My husband would never miss school just so we could take a vacation at a cheaper time. It simply means my kids have never been to Israel because we can never take time off in a cheap season. I know lots of people in our community are shocked our kids have not been to Israel.

With most other jobs you are not restricted to only take vacation the most expensive travel times of the year.

Simple1

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 9:46 am

amother wrote:

I'm writing as an administrator in a school --
Yes, you are sending a terrible message to the school and your children. Namely, your children's teachers who work so hard day in day out are of second importance. It is so so hard on a teacher and a school to have children leaving early and coming back late. And we will definitely talk about you behind your back, and treat your children differently because we disagree with your choices.
Sadly we are raising children today in a completely self-centered, selfish world where we justify things we do because they're convenient for us, without thinking of the consequences on anybody else.

I'll get bashed for saying it, but just telling it like it is...

(Rant over)

Is this for real ?! Treat them differently? Talk behind their backs?

SixOfWands

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 9:48 am

DrMom wrote:

I am a big proponent of prioritizing studies. As they get older, it will be difficult to miss school.

But 3 days? In lower primary school? Go for it.

Family is important, and travelling abroad -- to E"Y no less! -- is also educational. Smile

7 days. 3 days before the chag, 4 days after.

That's an awful lot of school to miss, and it is (IMNSHO) sending the message that school isn't really that important.

SixOfWands

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 9:52 am

DrMom wrote:

Of course the classroom will function without the student.

But then the student comes back and, having missed 7 days of school, has missed a good deal of material. The teacher will have to work with that student to get him or her caught up, or at least provide materials for the parents.

amother

Lime

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 9:52 am

amother wrote:

So I'll take part in the bashing, since you know its coming anyways.

I find this attitude among many principals. To them, school is life. On the priority list, it comes first. Everything and anything should be arranged around the school, first and foremost. Hence, the above attitude, the inconvenient scheduling of school events, kids performances and the many days off.

To me, school shouldn't be the life of the kid, it should be teaching the kids how to live the life. There are lots of things outside of school, and some may be of higher priority than the school. Teaching kids how we juggle such situations is a great skill for them to possess. And teaching kids how to analyze and prioritize situations in life, is another great skill for them to learn.

That last statement is mind-boggling. First, I find that the administration of most schools display that very attitude. Consideration for parents is hardly considered, it's only consideration for themselves. I can't read your thoughts or minds, but the actions of many school administrations are highly suggestive of it. Secondly, teaching the kids to prioritize family is anything but selfish. Demanding that parents consider the impact on the school over the benefit of the children does more than hint at self-centered behavior.

And as for talking behind parent's back, treating children differently based on their parent's decision - I have no words. Please find a different job.

trixx

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 9:55 am

I can't believe these responses. School, as much as we pay for it, is really not important especially in the younger grades. I say that as a mother, teacher and school admin, and under my own username. Kids would be far better off playing outside all day than sitting in the classroom. There are entire bodies of research that support this which is why unschooling and homeschooling and other free play methods have become the rage. Your kids will learn far more about anything important by taking a trip abroad, esperiencing different culture, spending time with family, sightseeing Israel etc than they ever could in school. I wouldn't even have a second thought about this (except for taking off as a teacher which no I wouldn't do that much time). Someone mentioned prioritizing - in my opinion school is not a priority. This is not to say that you shouldn't value the teachers and schoolwork and impress upon your children to do the same. It's not to say that you shouldn't let the teachers know far in advance and make whatever arrangements they want. But educationally they will gain far more from going.

icedcoffee

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:03 am

Quote:

No it shouldn't, reusing the exact same material over and over is horrible teaching practice. Every year I update my lessons based on what went well and what didn't last year, what the needs of this year's students are, what new strategies and approaches I've learned or created, what I've taken away from professional development, what new goals/visions are the focus of this school year. When I get observed and meet with my principal, I'm asked to explain how I've modified and improved my lessons from last year. I mean seriously as a parent, which would you rather hear: that your teacher has been rehashing the same exact lesson plan from 1997? Or that they're constantly updating and adapting based on this year's student needs, the class IEPs, new technology, feedback from administration, and relevant scaffolding and differentiation requirements? I have no opinion on whether OP should travel or not but come on. Every year we get at least one parent email along the lines "my student will be on vacation with us or the next 3 weeks, please give him all work for that time." We all laugh because there is no way.

amother

Magenta

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:03 am

amother wrote:

This argument makes no sense.

Sure, you can't just gallivant off for any cheap weekend. But, you can't do that in many jobs. And teachers have much longer holidays in general than other careers, many who can't even travel on chol hamoed, never mind a couple of days before yom tov.

amother

Mauve

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:09 am

SixOfWands wrote:

7 days. 3 days before the chag, 4 days after.

That's an awful lot of school to miss, and it is (IMNSHO) sending the message that school isn't really that important.

The message it send depends on far more than this one time event. In my family, kids go to school every day unless they're sick. They don't randomly take off or miss days. I look at the school schedule every summer and schedule all the well visits and dentist appointments for days off. Homework is done and signed every night, tests are always studied for, and projects are complete by the deadline. All of this gives my kids the message that school is to be taken seriously.

Then, when I book tickets for pesach to go to Israel and they miss school, the entire message is not undone. The message, which I tell them explicitly, is that we try not to miss school but going to Israel for YT is even more important. Because those are my values. And when they get back, we work hard to catch them up.

nchr

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:31 am

amother wrote:

Please stop sending your kids to school with fever. It is incredibly selfish.

I disagree. The majority of illnesses that cause fever are contagious prior to the fever, and children get fever for things adults would not (I.e. colds). A cold is not a reason to stay home and no teacher has ever complained about my children's behavior and they seem pretty normal when they have fever. I give them tylenol in school and they are just like an adult with a cold, who should not miss work or school. My pediatrician agrees with this. I have a live in so its not about not having someone to watch them, but rather a message I want to send my children about taking things easy, having a good work ethic, etc.

amother

Mistyrose

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:34 am

trixx wrote:

This.

nchr

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:36 am

icedcoffee wrote:

Quote:

I stated it should be updated the summer prior. The same companies release test books annually, with updates here and there, but the majority of the content is similar. So you should be covering about the same material each year, with minor edits from the Board of Ed. Come on. And yes, much is the same. Kid still generally pretty much learn Geometry in 9th, Algebra 2/Trig in 10th, Pre Calc in 11th and Calculus in 12th. They are still using the same text book companies from the early 2000s, but updated versions. If your child's math teacher needs to do major preparation a day prior to class, not reviews etc., that teacher should be spoken to.

proudmom8

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:40 am

amother wrote:

I can’t like this enough...well said!

rosey

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:42 am

amother wrote:

The message it send depends on far more than this one time event....
Then, when I book tickets for pesach to go to Israel and they miss school, the entire message is not undone. The message, which I tell them explicitly, is that we try not to miss school but going to Israel for YT is even more important. Because those are my values. And when they get back, we work hard to catch them up.

This, even if you can't do all the planning described in the omitted portion (I can't). Messages are much more overall experiences than individual events. We support teachers and school, make sure to be considerate of everyone's work, including teachers' throughout the year, and if something comes up we explain as appropriate, the considerations. I think this helps kids deal with life's realities more than hard and fast rules.

And just to add to the list of experiences, our dc's first grade teacher told us to take her out to see family no matter what (and this was to go from E"Y to ch"ul during Pesach one year. Hopefully, we won't be doing that again, but not because of any issues with school). And one particularly rough year with the same dc, we thought they really needed a break and took them out a few days to recuperate during a long part of the year. Yet this child knows school is important and even wants to be a teacher! You do what's good for your family, and it's different for eveyrone.

icedcoffee

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 10:44 am

I can't update 180 daily lesson plans the summer prior, because I have no idea what the kids this year need or what's going to happen as the year goes on (are we going to take longer on something and have to cut something else?). This year, the first few weeks of school, I did everything exactly the same as last year. It went horribly. The final assessment was a mess because these students were much lower level than the students from last year, and I had no way of knowing that until after summer, when I actually taught and assessed them. So for the next unit I had to completely restructure how I taught it. I couldn't assume they knew the basics like last year's cohort, so I had to create that from scratch. I realized many of them this year were visual learners as opposed to written, so I had to redo my lessons to incorporate that. I had to create group work so they could support each other because they weren't ready to work independently. Know what I mean? Things like that. So while yes, we are going to cover X Y Z topics every year, the actual lessons I do are different year after year and I'm constantly changing and updating.

nchr

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 11:09 am

icedcoffee wrote:

The final assessment was a mess because these students were much lower level than the students from last year, and I had no way of knowing that until after summer, when I actually taught and assessed them. So for the next unit I had to completely restructure how I taught it. I couldn't assume they knew the basics like last year's cohort, so I had to create that from scratch. I realized many of them this year were visual learners as opposed to written, so I had to redo my lessons to incorporate that. I had to create group work so they could support each other because they weren't ready to work independently. Know what I mean? Things like that. So while yes, we are going to cover X Y Z topics every year, the actual lessons I do are different year after year and I'm constantly changing and updating.

Shouldn't the previous grade's teacher have informed you of this? Don't teachers discuss each specific student prior to the commencement of the school year?

thunderstorm

Wed, Jan 16 2019, 11:46 am

OP, my DS is having his Bar Mitzvah this week. My sons choose a first time trip to EY over a nice affair in a hall. I make a small dinner at home and they go to EY with my DH. The plan was that they'd go Lag BaOmer time. However , with this great deal, my DH spoke to the menahel and he menahel said that is perfectly ok for my DS to take off a week of school for this. They will be going a few days after Purim. The airfare was free, my DH used his Sapphire points as part of the deal, and all the hotels he booked are with points as well. All he needs to spend money on is an apt in the Old City for Shabbos and their outings and some food. This trip is costing him less then $1500 for a week to EY. This is a huge savings and helped our wallet immensely.
I say, discuss it with the school and go for it. These are memories that will stay with your children forever.