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ectomorph




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 7:15 pm
"male and female he created them"
A man cant become pregnant
And a woman cant become pregnant without a man to impregnate her...


Race you can be mixed but you cant be a boy and a girl at the same time
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 7:15 pm
amother wrote:
You're confusing z3x (why can't we use that word???) with gender.

Z3x is biologically determined. Gender refers to socially constructed roles, behaviors, activities, and attributes.

Many societies have traditionally recognized more than 2 genders. Bugis society recognises five genders: makkunrai, oroané, bissu, calabai, and calalai. for Navajo, there were four genders: man, woman, masculine female-bodied nádleeh, and feminine male-bodied nádleeh.

But the real question is, why do you care?

With respect to race, unless you're Rachel Dolezal, none of this probably applies to you.


How about if you inject yourself with tanning stuff to darken your skin and insist your baby's become black?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/fe.....black.html

Why is it ok for blacks to pass as white but not the converse? Double standard?
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allthingsblue




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 7:19 pm
Squishy wrote:
How about if you inject yourself with tanning stuff to darken your skin and insist your baby's become black?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/fe.....black.html

Why is it ok for blacks to pass as white but not the converse? Double standard?


I don't think it is ok. Blacks would get a lot of hate if they tried to be white.
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amother




Babyblue


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 9:37 pm
allthingsblue wrote:
No, I am not being an opportunist.
I am genuinely wondering about this.
Not that I would want to become a man or a different race, but I wonder why it's so accepted for a man to become a woman but if a white person would try to become black, they'd be ridiculed.


What does it mean to 'become black'? are you talking about a shade of skin?
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amother




Babyblue


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 9:38 pm
Squishy wrote:
How about if you inject yourself with tanning stuff to darken your skin and insist your baby's become black?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/fe.....black.html

Why is it ok for blacks to pass as white but not the converse? Double standard?


What does it mean to "pass as white"?
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 9:58 pm
allthingsblue wrote:
I don't think it is ok. Blacks would get a lot of hate if they tried to be white.


They have traditionally tried to do that. Now it is advantageous to claim to be black. You get preferential treatment.
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:02 pm
This whole discussion is...meh. People change how they identify simply because they can and that’s all there is to it.

Advances in science allow bigger or smaller breasts, diff body shape, and even changes in chromosomes sometimes. Advances in belief systems allow us to change religions, advances in travel allow us to change nationalities and languages etc.
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Fox




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:08 pm
marina wrote:
This whole discussion is...meh. People change how they identify simply because they can and that’s all there is to it.

Advances in science allow bigger or smaller breasts, diff body shape, and even changes in chromosomes sometimes. Advances in belief systems allow us to change religions, advances in travel allow us to change nationalities and languages etc.

Agreed. I find it an interesting, though, to examine what we do and don't consider "immutable" characteristics as well as what we consider it ethical to change.

A common discussion I've seen over the years is, "If you could take a pill and become X, would you? Why or why not?"

A real-life case developed with the introduction of cochlear implants. Prior to cochlear implants, there was a thriving "deaf culture." Now, much of that is being lost because there are fewer people who are excluded from the hearing world. That caused a lot of discussion about whether deaf people "should" abandon (or never be introduced to) deaf culture.
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:09 pm
Squishy wrote:
They have traditionally tried to do that. Now it is advantageous to claim to be black. You get preferential treatment.


yep just read about all that preferential treatment minorities got at that GM plant. Nooses, slurs, Whites-Only signs. So fab. Where do I sign up?


Last edited by marina on Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:14 pm; edited 3 times in total
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:11 pm
Fox wrote:
Agreed. I find it an interesting, though, to examine what we do and don't consider "immutable" characteristics as well as what we consider it ethical to change.

A common discussion I've seen over the years is, "If you could take a pill and become X, would you? Why or why not?"

A real-life case developed with the introduction of cochlear implants. Prior to cochlear implants, there was a thriving "deaf culture." Now, much of that is being lost because there are fewer people who are excluded from the hearing world. That caused a lot of discussion about whether deaf people "should" abandon (or never be introduced to) deaf culture.


yes the deaf culture debate is fascinating as an example of a minority group that isolated itself to protect what it sees as the glue holding the community together.
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amother




Silver


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:12 pm
marina wrote:
yep just read about all that preferential treatment minorities got at that GE plant. Where do I sign up?


There's a law in the US about affirmative action. This is an actual law, followed by colleges and government agencies. Even companies who are not required to follow this often try to hire minorities as a PR gesture.
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:17 pm
amother wrote:
There's a law in the US about affirmative action. This is an actual law, followed by colleges and government agencies. Even companies who are not required to follow this often try to hire minorities as a PR gesture.


Well, since you’re referencing a law applying to colleges, go ahead and cite it then. Full cite plse for law requiring colleges to give preference to minorities in admissions. THANKS SO MUCH.
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dancingqueen




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:43 pm
ectomorph wrote:
"male and female he created them"
A man cant become pregnant
And a woman cant become pregnant without a man to impregnate her...


Race you can be mixed but you cant be a boy and a girl at the same time


As amother said you’re talking about zex not gender.
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:44 pm
marina wrote:
yep just read about all that preferential treatment minorities got at that GM plant. Nooses, slurs, Whites-Only signs. So fab. Where do I sign up?


I had a friend who started law school as a self identified Puerto Rican. She adamantly denied she was black throughout college. Her skin was just dark until she found out blacks get half scholarships in her law school automatically. Being white gets nothing. Puerto Ricans got a quarter scholarship. The kicker is they called it a merit scholarship. They should have called it a black scholarship. So not only do the minorities get money, they get an unearned boost on their resume.

Then she found out that blacks got preferential hiring at the DA's office. This is a really fair system when the deck is stacked against white people.

You are aware that minority owned businesses get a boost also. I have been approached to front as an owner for a female owned business for preferential treatment. There are hiring quotas for minority owned businesses.

Right now it is better to be black than Asian to get into Harvard.
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amother




Babyblue


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 10:59 pm
Squishy wrote:
I had a friend who started law school as a self identified Puerto Rican. She adamantly denied she was black throughout college. Her skin was just dark until she found out blacks get half scholarships in her law school automatically. Being white gets nothing. Puerto Ricans got a quarter scholarship. The kicker is they called it a merit scholarship. They should have called it a black scholarship. So not only do the minorities get money, they get an unearned boost on their resume.

Then she found out that blacks got preferential hiring at the DA's office. This is a really fair system when the deck is stacked against white people.

You are aware that minority owned businesses get a boost also. I have been approached to front as an owner for a female owned business for preferential treatment. There are hiring quotas for minority owned businesses.

Right now it is better to be black than Asian to get into Harvard.


So to "pass as white" means nothing?
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amother




Silver


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 11:02 pm
marina wrote:
Well, since you’re referencing a law applying to colleges, go ahead and cite it then. Full cite plse for law requiring colleges to give preference to minorities in admissions. THANKS SO MUCH.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik.....ted_States

https://www.npr.org/sections/t.....on-program

ETA: Affirmative action is not the law for colleges, only for government agencies and those that work for government agencies, but in practice it is often done. And in corporations as well.

Check out college scholarships- tons for women, blacks and minorities, zero for white males.
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Ravenclaw




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Jan 21 2019, 11:49 pm
Squishy wrote:
I had a friend who started law school as a self identified Puerto Rican. She adamantly denied she was black throughout college. Her skin was just dark until she found out blacks get half scholarships in her law school automatically. Being white gets nothing. Puerto Ricans got a quarter scholarship. The kicker is they called it a merit scholarship. They should have called it a black scholarship. So not only do the minorities get money, they get an unearned boost on their resume.

Then she found out that blacks got preferential hiring at the DA's office. This is a really fair system when the deck is stacked against white people.

You are aware that minority owned businesses get a boost also. I have been approached to front as an owner for a female owned business for preferential treatment. There are hiring quotas for minority owned businesses.

Right now it is better to be black than Asian to get into Harvard.


The funniest part is that people who support affirmative action use the defense that most minorities come from poorer communities. So then why do we need to base it on race? Help the poor and automatically you will help minorities without jumping into the racial fray.
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Jan 22 2019, 12:26 am
amother wrote:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action_in_the_United_States

https://www.npr.org/sections/t.....on-program

ETA: Affirmative action is not the law for colleges, only for government agencies and those that work for government agencies, but in practice it is often done. And in corporations as well.

Check out college scholarships- tons for women, blacks and minorities, zero for white males.


Just to be clear there is no law requiring universities to give preference to minorities.

And yes there’s a reason very little private scholarships are awarded to white males- that’s because they are traditionally the group that needed them the least.


Last edited by marina on Tue, Jan 22 2019, 12:41 am; edited 1 time in total
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Jan 22 2019, 12:36 am
Squishy wrote:
I had a friend who started law school as a self identified Puerto Rican. She adamantly denied she was black throughout college. Her skin was just dark until she found out blacks get half scholarships in her law school automatically. Being white gets nothing. Puerto Ricans got a quarter scholarship. The kicker is they called it a merit scholarship. They should have called it a black scholarship. So not only do the minorities get money, they get an unearned boost on their resume.

Then she found out that blacks got preferential hiring at the DA's office. This is a really fair system when the deck is stacked against white people.

You are aware that minority owned businesses get a boost also. I have been approached to front as an owner for a female owned business for preferential treatment. There are hiring quotas for minority owned businesses.

Right now it is better to be black than Asian to get into Harvard.


It’s pretty difficult to comment on your friend’s honesty because you never really clarify if she’s AA or Puerto Rican or both.

As for universirt admission policies, I just want to point out that almost every single university gives preference to legacy kids-
children of alumni. Which is to say, historically, white kids. And that boost in admissions is considerably higher or equal to anything others for being poor or minority or even getting a perfect score on the SATs.

Does that bother you? White kids get a nice admissions push as legacy applicants.
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marina




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Jan 22 2019, 12:39 am
Ravenclaw wrote:
The funniest part is that people who support affirmative action use the defense that most minorities come from poorer communities. So then why do we need to base it on race? Help the poor and automatically you will help minorities without jumping into the racial fray.


that is in fact what plenty of schools do. But some schools also want racial diversity in their classes, and that’s not a bad thing. I might legitimately want a larger sample of native american physicians in my medical school if I specifically want my graduates to serve native american populations and so I might specifically court those applicants and offer them scholarships. I genuinely fail to see what’s wrong with that.
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