S/o: Hatzala transportation - only Maimonides?

out-of-towner

Sun, Mar 17 2019, 6:31 pm

I live in Far Rockaway, and the nearest hospital has a bad reputation. When I've called Hatzalah, both times with a child with a potential head injury, they have taken me to LIJ Children's Hospital at my request, and have brought me into the ER and gotten me taken care of ASAP. I have only the greatest Hakaras HaTov to them! (And BH both times my kids were okay. )

amother

Cerise

Sun, Mar 17 2019, 9:53 pm

In the last two years, Hatzalah has taken me to NYU and Cornell, for a condition that I had as a result of a Maimo Medical Error and was having complications with. They understood that going back to Maimonides made no sense, and didn't think twice about taking me to Manhattan hospitals. Tzadikim.
Even at the initial call, they knew that I'd have better chances of being diagnosed amd treated at a Manhattan hospital, and it was their decision, not mine, to go to NYU.
Also, They usually go to Lutheran for severe trauma vs. Maimonides.

gamanit

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 11:41 am

Hatzala follows state BLS protocol of transporting to the closest hospital capable of dealing with your emergency. Burns get taken to nearest burn center which is in Staten Island, traumas to Lutheran, etc. They're not doing anything other than what the protocol states. They'll sometimes go to better hospital at patients request but that's really against protocol. Also "better" hospital isn't necessarily "better" for every case.

amother

Orchid

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 12:47 pm

By law, an ambulance cannot bypass a local hospital. It actually only makes sense. Hatzola members are volunteers, not your private car service. If you are stable enough to travel further, you can drive there yourself or arrange your own transportation. Monsey hatzola has the same policy. I'm surprised that people have the nerve to be upset at these men that are volunteering their time and expect them to give them more time to be their private transportation. How entitled.
And hatzola will never ever charge a patient for their services. If a patient is well enough to talk, they will ask for their insurance info to help cover the transport, but you can refuse. I see nothing wrong with that.

amother

Pewter

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:10 pm

amother wrote:

I am also somewhat surprised at what kind of medical condition would require an ambulance with trained medical personnel but would also not be critical enough so that being stuck in Manhattan (or other NYC traffic) didn't matter.

It really is a kind of chutzpah to use a volunteer EMERGENCY AMBULANCE service in lieu of having family or friends drive you - or having Uber or a car service take you. An emergency is not a medical condition that can wait an hour or more to be triaged.

And I am somewhat surprised that Hatzala will actually transport non-emergency patients to the medical provider of their choice. Again, I can't imagine a true emergency that wouldn't need to be treated at nearest facility - presuming that facility was able to treat that condition - I.e. not all emergency rooms are equipped for severe burns for example.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:13 pm

amother wrote:

There is a feeling that arriving by ambulance allows them to jump the line in the emergency room.

ra_mom

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:14 pm

Do people realize that some of us and our family members have been subjected to medical negligence at certain medical centers and fear getting stuck there in an emergency with no way to transfer out? It's really sad when the closest hospital is not up to standards and the ambulance won't drive another 10 minutes to another hospital in the same city.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:15 pm

amother wrote:

I was quoted a fee for hatzoula to take me to Manhattan.

Amarante

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:35 pm

ra_mom wrote:

It is not 10 minutes from Brooklyn to Manhattan even with no traffic.

The point is not which hospital people want to use - the point is that theoretically ambulances are to transport people with true emergency conditions for which minutes are life or death in terms of outcome.

If you can chance delaying medical treatment to be transported to a distant hospital, then it's not a medical emergency requiring you to use the services of volunteer emergency workers.

I am in Los Angeles and would certainly go to Cedars-Sinai instead of Olympia Hospital because both are essentially equal distant. However, I would not have myself transported to UCLA or Santa Monica for a medical emergency.

I have taken a number of people for emergency care (unfortunately). In my experience, the admissions nurse triages you immediately. If you are presenting with ANY symptoms that are theoretically life threatening, you are diagnosed immediately and seen by a doctor - whether I have driven someone because the doctor says to take to the ER and driving would be as fast as waiting for ambulance or calling 911 for emergency help.

Last edited by Amarante on Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:36 pm; edited 1 time in total

twogees

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:36 pm

I live in a oot community and have needed hatzolah on a Friday night for my son. I requested to go to a larger hospital and not the one less than a mile from my house because I had heard bad things about that hospital. I was very happy with the care I had at the larger hospital. Another time when we needed hatzolah for my son I requested strongly to be taken to the children hospital in the downtown area of my city mainly on the request of my pediatrician who I was in touch with before I called to see if we should go in to the ER.

ra_mom

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:38 pm

Amarante wrote:

It is not 10 minutes from Brooklyn to Manhattan even with no traffic.

The point is not which hospital people want to use - the point is that theoretically ambulances are to transport people with true emergency conditions for which minutes are life or death in terms of outcome.

If you can chance delaying medical treatment to be transported to a distant hospital, then it's not a medical emergency requiring you to use the services of volunteer emergency workers.

I am in Los Angeles and would certainly go to Cedars-Sinai instead of Olympia Hospital because both are essentially equal distant. However, I would not have myself transported to UCLA or Santa Monica for a medical emergency.

I have taken a number of people for emergency care (unfortunately). In my experience, the admissions nurse triages you immediately. If you are presenting with ANY symptoms that are theoretically life threatening, you are diagnosed immediately - whether I have driven someone because the doctor says to take to the ER and driving would be as fast as waiting for ambulance or calling 911 for emergency help.

I meant within the same boro like Lutheran or Methodist - an extra 10 min drive.

The Manhattan incident had to do with post op care. You don't just show up at a random hospital - best post op care in an emergency ls received by the group of doctors who know how the surgery went.

Last edited by ra_mom on Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:39 pm; edited 1 time in total

SixOfWands

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:39 pm

amother wrote:

I am pretty sure they triage the patients by their medical condition rather than how they arrive in the emergency room.

Indeed. Although it may seem otherwise, as more serious cases arrive by ambulance more frequently.

All of that said, Hatzala transports to the nearest hospital unless there is an overwhelming reason to go elsewhere. There are a limited number of ambulances and volunteers. If they transport Malka to a more distant hospital, that means that they may not be their to help Shloimy when he needs it.

amother

Orchid

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:41 pm

Ra-mom, it's not the hatzola volunteers responsibility or problem that one has been subjected to medical negligence in certain hospitals. Hatzola has nothing with the hospitals. But if a hospital is known for it's bad care, they will take you to a better hospital.
Burn vicitims will never be taken to maimonides. If a trauma/accident vicitm is stable enough, they will be taken to Bellevue trauma center. But if your child broke a leg and you want to go to a city hospital, there is no reason why you cannot drive there yourself.

Amarante

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 1:44 pm

ra_mom wrote:

I meant within the same Boro like Lutheran or Methodist.

The Manhattan incident had to do with post op care. You don't just show up at a random hospital - best post op care in an emergency ls received by the group of doctors who know how the surgery went.

I didn't think these posts were about being transported to hospitals that were more or less the same distance but going from BP to NYU in Manhattan.

As for post-op complications, there are always exceptions but this thread seems to be about having the user determine which hospital to be taken to - including hospitals in Manhattan because the care is perceived as better.

I am not familiar with Brooklyn hospitals and obviously Manhattan is the center of excellence which is why people often travel to Manhattan to see doctors or have elective procedures done. But it is difficult for me to understand justifying using emergency resources to transport people for what seem to be non-emergency situations because they want to use a further medical facilities.

It's ironic because the law requiring taking (and being admitted) to the nearest hospital is intended to prevent dumping of patients. So if you are close to Cedars-Sinai hospital, the ambulance can't transport you a long distance to County USC Hospital and Cedars can't refuse to treat an emergency patient.

Again, my familiarity is with Los Angeles medical care and health providers.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 2:01 pm

amother wrote:

Amother, my dad is a paramedic for hatzola for over 25 years now, I've never heard of anyone being ask by hatzola for money for their transport. I cannot believe that hatzola outright asked you to pay for your transport.

They absolutely did. Different hatzoulas may have different policies.

Besides, it's your father who is with hatzoula, not you. It is possible you don't know the policy of every hatzoula.

amother

Olive

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 2:02 pm

Referring to my post on page 2, I just heard that Maimonides currently has no ENT on call. I haven't verified this info 100% yet, but if it is so it makes me a lot more upset about last weeks incident.

And to those saying that if you have the 20 min to drive into city then why abuse hatzala, go on your own- don't you realize that there is a difference between a broken bone and wanting to go to a better hospital, than a patient with a condition receiving care at a specific hospital and needing to get there urgently?

Of course if patient is dying you go to nearest hospital, but often there is a 20-30 min window of getting patient to where he will get best care for specific condition and if patient goes with uber for example 1) it will take him longer to get to hospital (note I did not say to be triaged. From personal experience I've plenty of times walked into ED myself sans Hatzala and triaged immediately bec dr called ahead or bec the situation warranted immediate triage/care)
2)if you need oxygen, monitoring or given fluids etc en route you are better off going with hatzala then getting stuck on highway with an urgency gone emergency- turning life threatening.

Last edited by amother on Thu, Jun 20 2019, 7:50 pm; edited 1 time in total

ra_mom

Mon, Mar 18 2019, 2:08 pm

amother wrote:

Who calls hatzalah for a broken bone?