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My SIL expects me to help her with her kids
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amother




Jetblack


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 5:12 am
Rappel wrote:
She's family. These are your nieces and nephews.


Don't you want to take care of them???

Um, no, I don't. My own kids are enough to take care of, thanks. I have precisely zero interest in looking after other people's kids, including my own nieces and nephews. I love my nieces and nephews very much, and I enjoy spending time with them, but no, I won't take care of them.
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amother




Apricot


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 5:19 am
Israeli_C wrote:
This is absolutely none. of. your. business.
Your SIL's contraceptive choices are HER business, not yours.
I don't even see the relevance of you comparing yourself to her.
And yes, even if you resent her for asking for help, it's still none of your business.
If you don't want to help, say so politely. That's derech eretz.


It is OP's business once sil imposes the burden of her kids on OP.
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Israeli_C




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 5:25 am
amother [ Apricot ] wrote:
It is OP's business once sil imposes the burden of her kids on OP.


No, it's not, and it's irrelevant. There are two different topics which should NOT be mixed up-
Her complaint that her SIL is burdening her with her children
Her SIL is apparently giving birth to more kids than she can handle, unlike 'smart' OP who knows how to space her kids.
She can complain all she wants about her SIL burdening her with her children, but that gives her no right to hint that her SIL shouldn't have had so many kids.
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Metukah




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 5:40 am
Israeli_C wrote:
No, it's not, and it's irrelevant. There are two different topics which should NOT be mixed up-
Her complaint that her SIL is burdening her with her children
Her SIL is apparently giving birth to more kids than she can handle, unlike 'smart' OP who knows how to space her kids.
She can complain all she wants about her SIL burdening her with her children, but that gives her no right to hint that her SIL shouldn't have had so many kids.


Said SIL has lost any right when she imposes her kids on op. She doesn't want hints or opinions on family size? don't burden others with those children.
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Israeli_C




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 5:58 am
Metukah wrote:
Said SIL has lost any right when she imposes her kids on op. She doesn't want hints or opinions on family size? don't burden others with those children.

Nope, can't agree with this. There's no situation where OP has the right to impose her family planning opinions on her SIL. It's between her and her husband, period.
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Metukah




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 6:02 am
Israeli_C wrote:
Nope, can't agree with this. There's no situation where OP has the right to impose her family planning opinions on her SIL. It's between her and her husband, period.


As is the child rearing, but she seems to think others need to be involved. She can't chose. It's either all or nothing.

For some reason I have no sympathy for sil. Maybe it's because I had similar experiences to op.

You want to have a kid every year? Go ahead. Not at my expense. Don't want me to comment? Don't ask me to look after them.
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amother




Azure


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 6:05 am
Metukah wrote:
As is the child rearing, but she seems to think others need to be involved. She can't chose. It's either all or nothing.

For some reason I have no sympathy for sil. Maybe it's because I had similar experiences to op.

You want to have a kid every year? Go ahead. Not at my expense. Don't want me to comment? Don't ask me to look after them.

So if she DID space them out, it wouldn't bother you if she expected you to take care of them?

Israeli_C is right. There are two issues here. And the size of her family is NOT one that anyone else should be mixing into.

It is perfectly reasonable to say NO to her, very appropriate to refuse to watch her kids, and just fine to expect her to take care of her kids herself. But it is NOT okay to make decisions about whether or not she shouldn't have had any of them.
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amother




Denim


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 6:05 am
Israeli_C wrote:
Nope, can't agree with this. There's no situation where OP has the right to impose her family planning opinions on her SIL. It's between her and her husband, period.


I agree with Metukah. Someone who comes with 7 or 8 children under the age of 9, and expects everyone else to pitch in looking after them - is just asking for comments on family size.
Once you assume everyone else is going to share your burden, then everyone else also has a right to comment on why you are increasing 'their' burden indiscriminately.

Not that it's polite to comment out loud about family size....but to think it, when you're frustrated at having to spend another supposedly restful holiday running after other people's preschoolers? Only natural.
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DVOM




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 6:08 am
amother [ Jetblack ] wrote:
Um, no, I don't. My own kids are enough to take care of, thanks. I have precisely zero interest in looking after other people's kids, including my own nieces and nephews. I love my nieces and nephews very much, and I enjoy spending time with them, but no, I won't take care of them.


I'm finding these posts a bit sad to read. Yes, in a situation where someone is constantly feeling taken advantage of, there needs to be limits and bounderies. But that wasn't the feeling I got from the OP. Does your sister contribute nothing in your relationship? Is there any reciprocity? If there is, perhaps you can think about the help you giver her a bit differently.

I love my spacy, dreamy, not-quite-living-in-the-real-world sister, and my love extends, often, to taking care of her kids.

This comes up on holidays when we're together and even more so in the bungalow colony. My sister has a very relaxed attitude about meals in particular. Practically, this usually means I am making scrambled eggs and pancakes for many more than just my own kids each morning and cutting up chicken for 10 instead of 4 on days when the seuda is going to start late and the kids are staaaaarving and can't wait. On long holiday afternoons, my husband and I end up taking all the kids to the park, not just our own.

It's ok. I know how to say no when I need to. But most of the time I can and do help her out. I know that she is not going to pay me back tit-for-tat. It's not in her nature to cook, or clean, or be organized. I value her for what she brings to my life: empathy, unconditional acceptance, true love for me and my family, a madcap sense of humor and spontinaity and sillyness. My children love her and her husband, and feel very loved and valued by them. She is a wonderful listener, and my kids will often sit and talk with her. There may not be any food in the fridge, a sink of overflowing dishes, a tornado of laundry and toys strewn everywhere... but my kids know they are always truly welcome in her home. I love her kids so much. And our closeness has created a bond between our children, who are first cousins but in some ways are being raised like siblings, that is beautiful and special.

So she plans the trips, I pack the lunches. It's not an even trade, but I don't think it has to be.
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 6:14 am
Knock on the door of the sleeping parents and say that their kids are up and you are busy with your own. It is unreasonable to expect anyone to watch all of those kids day after day.

There was always a rule in our house that one parent per family has to get up with the kids. Kids wake up needing the bathroom and to eat.

Get your parents to make that rule.

You also have to insist that your kids need your attention.
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causemommysaid




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 6:20 am
Israeli_C wrote:
Nope, can't agree with this. There's no situation where OP has the right to impose her family planning opinions on her SIL. It's between her and her husband, period.


I'm sure you feel very strongly about this because you probably get comments all the time about your kids and how you space them but the fact is that if someone imposes themselves on others then they lose their rights. Chazal say "soneh matanos yichyeh" live your life hating gifts. The reason they say that is because you lose your autonomy when you take from others. That is the reality. You dont have to like it.
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amother




Tan


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 7:08 am
southernbubby wrote:
Knock on the door of the sleeping parents and say that their kids are up and you are busy with your own. It is unreasonable to expect anyone to watch all of those kids day after day.

There was always a rule in our house that one parent per family has to get up with the kids. Kids wake up needing the bathroom and to eat.

Get your parents to make that rule.

You also have to insist that your kids need your attention.


She never said SIL was sleeping. Just changing a diaper. Or asking to share meal time. Very different.
Personally if you resent it I’d say stay home and not cause machlokas.
You spaced your kids and are so much smarter so it shouldn’t be too hard.
I don’t think it’s fair to make your parents cook and prepare for your kids.
Everyone has different strengths. I have a SIL who has tons of kids and it falls on all of us. But at night she is the one who cleans up the house and preps the meals and helps MIL a lot. I have to see when you are in someone else’s house it is a bit of s partnership. Not vacation. It doesn’t sound like she is taking advantage tom your boast. Just you think you have it more together.
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abound




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 7:24 am
I know a lot of ppl that have lots of children close together, and I agree with the sentiment that this is two different issues. I also know a lot of people who have 2 children and expect that since they only have two kids, it is no big deal and dump their children on the ones with the big families, "since she is anyway busy with kids"
This is two separate issues and the amount of children she has should not factor in your decision if you want to help her.
If she only had 2 or 3 kids that were spaced out, would you care to keep watching her kids? You probably would...........but what difference does it make to how many children she has?
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amother




Apricot


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 7:25 am
amother [ Tan ] wrote:
She never said SIL was sleeping. Just changing a diaper. Or asking to share meal time. Very different.
Personally if you resent it I’d say stay home and not cause machlokas.
You spaced your kids and are so much smarter so it shouldn’t be too hard.
I don’t think it’s fair to make your parents cook and prepare for your kids.
Everyone has different strengths. I have a SIL who has tons of kids and it falls on all of us. But at night she is the one who cleans up the house and preps the meals and helps MIL a lot. I have to see when you are in someone else’s house it is a bit of s partnership. Not vacation. It doesn’t sound like she is taking advantage tom your boast. Just you think you have it more together.


Tan,

You are reading a lot in that's not there. It doesn't sound like sil is an elf cleaning and doing her share after eveyone is asleep. Telling OP not to come because she resents mothering another family is wrong. Maybe her in laws want to see OP's family and doesn't want overburdened sil to drive them off.

OP is looking for a workable solution to share space with someone who is looking to OP to be a free nanny when she has her own children to raise.

Do you think it is fair for sil to use OP like that?
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amother




Apricot


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 7:33 am
abound wrote:
I know a lot of ppl that have lots of children close together, and I agree with the sentiment that this is two different issues. I also know a lot of people who have 2 children and expect that since they only have two kids, it is no big deal and dump their children on the ones with the big families, "since she is anyway busy with kids"
This is two separate issues and the amount of children she has should not factor in your decision if you want to help her.
If she only had 2 or 3 kids that were spaced out, would you care to keep watching her kids? You probably would...........but what difference does it make to how many children she has?


The difference is how many kids she has. One or two children may not require her burdening OP.

I have a friend with 15 kids and no money. She expects her sisters to marry off her kids in designer stuff. One or two kids, they wouldn't resent, but when it is year after year, and they have their own children, it is a hard burden for them.
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 7:41 am
amother [ Tan ] wrote:
She never said SIL was sleeping. Just changing a diaper. Or asking to share meal time. Very different.
Personally if you resent it I’d say stay home and not cause machlokas.
You spaced your kids and are so much smarter so it shouldn’t be too hard.
I don’t think it’s fair to make your parents cook and prepare for your kids.
Everyone has different strengths. I have a SIL who has tons of kids and it falls on all of us. But at night she is the one who cleans up the house and preps the meals and helps MIL a lot. I have to see when you are in someone else’s house it is a bit of s partnership. Not vacation. It doesn’t sound like she is taking advantage tom your boast. Just you think you have it more together.


Right, it was another poster who said that they always got breakfast duty.

There are articles in Jewish publications every Pesach about people who expect the parents or siblings, particularly teenage girls, to exhaust themselves in order that the mom of the big family gets a vacation. This creates lots of tension because the "charm" of unruly children is not appreciated by the aunt's and uncles.
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abound




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 7:44 am
so say no after marrying off two, the amount of kids should not matter. You want to only give breakfast to two kids say, I can only take care of Chaya and Rivka. You do not want to take care of any or not interested in telling her that you can do two, then say, sorry I cannot.......Smile and move on. Dont judge!!
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Rappel




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 8:01 am
amother [ Jetblack ] wrote:
Um, no, I don't. My own kids are enough to take care of, thanks. I have precisely zero interest in looking after other people's kids, including my own nieces and nephews. I love my nieces and nephews very much, and I enjoy spending time with them, but no, I won't take care of them.


You sound like someone who was never isolated. If that's the case, then I'm glad for you. I'm also glad that we're not sisters in law. We have very different perspectives.


Last edited by Rappel on Mon, Apr 15 2019, 8:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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Israeli_C




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 8:06 am
causemommysaid wrote:
I'm sure you feel very strongly about this because you probably get comments all the time about your kids and how you space them but the fact is that if someone imposes themselves on others then they lose their rights. Chazal say "soneh matanos yichyeh" live your life hating gifts. The reason they say that is because you lose your autonomy when you take from others. That is the reality. You dont have to like it.


There's also a better known dictum of "veahavta larecha kamocha".
OP fully has the right to refuse to childmind for her SIL, I'm absolutely not denying that. She can also do it in a manner which is firm, assertive and polite.
HOWEVER, catty and unhelpful comments regarding her family planning are totally uncalled for. Nobody 'loses their right' to be treated with dignity. What exactly is she trying to achieve? The children are already HERE. Her comments aren't coming from a place of kindness or genuine concern for her SIL. She's venting, and if she makes them to her SIL's face, she's downright ignorant and rude.
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Mon, Apr 15 2019, 8:20 am
Rappel wrote:
You sound like someone who was never isolated. If that's the case, then I'm glad for you. I'm also glad that we're not sisters in law. We have very different perspectives.


She loves them but doesn't want to take care of them. She comes away from these visits tired and annoyed. It does not seem like helping with the kids is reciprocal.

Maybe she is making a mountain out of a molehill but if the kids are really challenging, I can't blame her for loving them but not wanting to take care of them.

Maybe you are a wonderful aunt or have a SIL who is one.
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