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Forum -> Yom Tov / Holidays -> Pesach
Vegans invited themselves for Pesach... and we're chabad
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Another mom




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 2:04 pm
WhatFor wrote:
Fantastic. Tell DH since this all sounds so easy for him, he can handle this and that you'll booked a room for yourself at Dead Sea for the last days and will pump some bottles so he can feed the babies. Win-win-win all around!

LOL
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turca




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 2:15 pm
I hope someone here could reach out to op and her husband irl... from all her posts, it looks like they are part of a cult...
Edited to add:
Maybe some chabad couple in their area? They need guidance.
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simba




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 2:21 pm
Why not make it simple. Ask a Rabbi and Dr. if you are allowed to knowingly expose your dc to unvaccinated individuals during an outbreak.

That should do the trick.
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amother
Crimson


 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 2:47 pm
turca wrote:
I hope someone here could reach out to op and her husband irl... from all her posts, it looks like they are part of a cult...
Edited to add:
Maybe some chabad couple in their area? They need guidance.


The vegan non-vaxers sound part of a cult. What makes people do this? If they don't love their kids, don't impose yourself on people who love theirs. They should go sponge meals off other crunchies.
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amother
Lawngreen


 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 2:49 pm
amother [ Crimson ] wrote:
The vegan non-vaxers sound part of a cult. What makes people do this? If they don't love their kids, don't impose yourself on people who love theirs. They should go sponge meals off other crunchies.


Can't not be part of a cult and try?


Last edited by amother on Fri, Dec 04 2020, 12:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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DVOM




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:08 pm
Ideally, a husband and wife prioritize thier safety of their kids above all else. They also look out for each others needs. So, my husband is protective of my kids, and protective of me. I'm protective of my kids, and look out for the needs, wishes, and comfort of my husband. We take care of each other, and both of our needs get met. Conflicts come up, of course, but this is a really beautiful and comfortable way to live.

But when your spouse can't or won't protect you or your kids, your priorities don't change. Your own protection and the protection of your children is still your first priority. These come before the needs, wishes, and comfort of your husband. I counsel lots of women who live with difficult, clueless, immature, or self centered spouses. Yes, there is a lot of compromises that these women can make for the sake of shalom bayit. The rule of thumb is to let everything you can slide. Don't fight if you don't need to. Your spouse wants the kids to wash netilas yadayim from age 1 week old? OK. Your spouse wants you to buy kosher for pesach garbage bags? no problem. Your spouse is dissapointed or angry if there aren't homemade cookies always in the freezer? I'd prioritize baking cookies for the sake of shalom bayit. The exception to this rule is any behavior on the part of your spouse that will land you or your kids at a doctor, hospital or therapists office. When your spouse does things that put your or your children in mental or physical danger, you need to stand up for yourself. Your children's and your own protection and safety is still first priority. I think exposing your babies to measeals falls squarely under this catagory.
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Seashell




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:10 pm
simba wrote:
Why not make it simple. Ask a Rabbi and Dr. if you are allowed to knowingly expose your dc to unvaccinated individuals during an outbreak.

That should do the trick.


Very sound advice.
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rainbow dash




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:18 pm
Just say no, no explanation needed.
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amother
Crimson


 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:30 pm
nchr wrote:
We're vegan and pro vax. Is that crunchy?


Vegan is ok by itself. Actually, crunchy is ok by itself. It is the nerve of the anti-vaxers freeloading in the home of vulnerable children that upset me. Anti-vaxers should be isolated. Maybe when they find opportunities closed to them, they will get their kids vaccinated.
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mammale




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:39 pm
DVOM wrote:
Ideally, a husband and wife prioritize thier safety of their kids above all else. They also look out for each others needs. So, my husband is protective of my kids, and protective of me. I'm protective of my kids, and look out for the needs, wishes, and comfort of my husband. We take care of each other, and both of our needs get met. Conflicts come up, of course, but this is a really beautiful and comfortable way to live.

But when your spouse can't or won't protect you or your kids, your priorities don't change. Your own protection and the protection of your children is still your first priority. These come before the needs, wishes, and comfort of your husband. I counsel lots of women who live with difficult, clueless, immature, or self centered spouses. Yes, there is a lot of compromises that these women can make for the sake of shalom bayit. The rule of thumb is to let everything you can slide. Don't fight if you don't need to. Your spouse wants the kids to wash netilas yadayim from age 1 week old? OK. Your spouse wants you to buy kosher for pesach garbage bags? no problem. Your spouse is dissapointed or angry if there aren't homemade cookies always in the freezer? I'd prioritize baking cookies for the sake of shalom bayit. The exception to this rule is any behavior on the part of your spouse that will land you or your kids at a doctor, hospital or therapists office. When your spouse does things that put your or your children in mental or physical danger, you need to stand up for yourself. Your children's and your own protection and safety is still first priority. I think exposing your babies to measeals falls squarely under this catagory.

Very well put!
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momsrus




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:42 pm
turca wrote:
I hope someone here could reach out to op and her husband irl... from all her posts, it looks like they are part of a cult...
Edited to add:
Maybe some chabad couple in their area? They need guidance.


I agree. Every post is and we’re chabad. Chabad has nothing to do with your problems.
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sky




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:51 pm
momsrus wrote:
I agree. Every post is and we’re chabad. Chabad has nothing to do with your problems.


In this case Chabad would indicate they use very little food on pesach.
Probably no lettuce and tomatoes and many other veggies making it almost impossible to host vegan.
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momsrus




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 3:54 pm
sky wrote:
In this case Chabad would indicate they use very little food on pesach.
Probably no lettuce and tomatoes and many other veggies making it almost impossible to host vegan.


This minhag is not at all exclusive to Chabad.
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trixx




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 4:18 pm
sky wrote:
In this case Chabad would indicate they use very little food on pesach.
Probably no lettuce and tomatoes and many other veggies making it almost impossible to host vegan.


But she's not simply asking for recipes bc she doesn't mind hosting and just needs some ideas. She has way bigger problems that she is ignoring in the name of "being chabad".

(BTW - most people do use romaine and also just peel their tomatoes)
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finallyamommy




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 4:55 pm
Israeli_C wrote:
RE the whole question of DL etc - it's a big question, the differences are largely political. I'm living in a community where 90% are dati leumi (the majority 'torani' / 'chardal' - ie right wing DL). The only time it's an issue is in terms of kashrut, since most, if not all, of our DL friends eat machpud meat, Beit Yosef products etc and we don't. Our vegan friends are more lenient than most of the people in our community (in terms of kashrut they get a lot of organic foods, Asian or other foreign imported products with unclear kashrut status which is problematic for us). They're ashkenazi but started eating kitniyot during pesach because basically vegan ashkenazim don't have many options foodwise. I can't cook kitniyot in my pesach kitchen.

As for needing to get a backbone- I can understand totally why someone would tell me this. If I was an outsider looking in, I'd say the same, if not something stronger. However like most women I like to keep DH happy and, especially coming up to the chag when he'll have a (VERY rare) 1 week vacation from work, I really don't want to spoil the atmosphere. He's very sincere and loyal to friends (even those who, like this family, already moved away) and sometimes it comes at the price of shalom bayit, unfortunately.


NO NO NO NO NO NO NO.

I didn't even read the rest of the thread yet, but I had to respond to this.

You do NOT put your friends ahead of shalom bayis and expect your wife to put up with it. Your wife is a part of yourself. Ishto kegufo. Family comes first always.

What would you say if this was your daughter, burdened with four small children under 4 with absolutely no help, and her husband just kept putting more and more on her without offering to help, and she just felt like she needed to keep the peace even at risk of her losing it?

And the non-vaxing thing is also a dealbreaker. Plenty of people I know just aren't leaving their house these days--aren't sending babies out to sitters, aren't going to indoor gymborees etc.--and will only socialize outside where the risk is far less. I'm not saying you should do that, but it is BEYOND reasonable to not want a non-vaxxer inside your house.

(By the way, I think you could get a separate pot and cook kitniyos in that, especially if it's on Shabbos/"8th day" when the rest of you could eat it too. But that's not the point, and I hope your husband doesn't think to suggest it.)
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 4:57 pm
It's not just measles you have to worry about. There are many other illnesses out there, and babies are so vulnerable! Even a really bad cold could get passed around the family and turn into bronchitis or even pneumonia.

OP, you really must find your inner mamma bear, and stand up for your children.

If DH won't listen to you (which is a huge problem in itself) then he needs to find a rav with seichel who will talk some hard sense into him.
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Raisin




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 4:59 pm
I don't think the vegan thing is such a big deal. Its 2 days. Difficult but not insurmountable, especially with advance notice. If these were OPs loving relatives or friends she loved, she would work it out. Lots of avocados, nuts, veg soups, salads, dips, roast veggies. I'm happy to share a recipe or two I have.

The vaxx thing is a much bigger deal.
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amother
Maroon


 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 5:05 pm
I've said this before on your threads and it bears repeating. You and your husband MUST get a mashpia ASAP! These situations will only keep happening and getting worse if you aren't being guided on how to deal with them. Forget vegan or anti vax, this is your marriage and sanity at stake, you both need to be proactive and figure this out.
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finallyamommy




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 5:06 pm
Okay, I read the rest of the thread. Can't remember who said it, but can we not accuse OP of being part of a cult? That's against the rules of this site.

But I do agree with a lot of people that "we're Chabad" has nothing to do with it.

And OP, I stand by what I said. Marriage is the responsibility of both parties, and your DH needs to put in some effort too. Putting his friends before his family is absolutely unacceptable.
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amother
Olive


 

Post Wed, Apr 17 2019, 5:18 pm
Sounds like the husband here thinks that being Chabad requires them to have these guests (and to be out of the house all day on shabbos, and other behaviors that cause hardship). So even though the issue is not about Chabad per se, it's about his messed up perceptions of it. He needs someone to give him a reality check.

And op, you have to put your foot down. You need to protect yourself and your children. Just because your husband thinks something is religiously required doesn't make it more important than your safety and sanity.
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