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Interesting Article Re: Measles and the Jewish Community

 
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lcraighten




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 8:51 am
I was fascinated to read this article. After all the heat we have been throwing at each other, it would be quite interesting if the statistics were true here!

The Epoch Times

What do you think?
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:12 am
I think that Bill Gates should get some wealthy friends to produce more vaccines and vaccinate everyone in developing countries because they are vectors for the disease everywhere else.
Maybe a booster needs to be given before young adults attend college.
Infectious diseases of all types probably spread faster in insular communities.
The massive study in the Netherlands showed no increased statistical risk of autism in immunized children but individual medical records were not examined so we don't know what the children with autism in both the immunized and non-immunized had in common, other than the diagnosis of autism.
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ladYdI




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:26 am
Thanks for posting this great thought provoking article! Let the comments begin!
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youngishbear




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:28 am
southernbubby wrote:
I think that Bill Gates should get some wealthy friends to produce more vaccines and vaccinate everyone in developing countries because they are vectors for the disease everywhere else.
Maybe a booster needs to be given before young adults attend college.
Infectious diseases of all types probably spread faster in insular communities.
The massive study in the Netherlands showed no increased statistical risk of autism in immunized children but individual medical records were not examined so we don't know what the children with autism in both the immunized and non-immunized had in common, other than the diagnosis of autism.


I know some colleges require immunization records. I think it should also be part of prenatal/postpartum care.
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:36 am
youngishbear wrote:
I know some colleges require immunization records. I think it should also be part of prenatal/postpartum care.


College students probably need a booster so records of baby shots don't completely protect students.
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youngishbear




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:41 am
southernbubby wrote:
College students probably need a booster so records of baby shots don't completely protect students.


True. We need more research into this process. Should we check for titers after vaccination to catch those with primary vaccine failure? Why do adults lose immunity? I think we need more research on this.

We also need more research on how to identify those at risk for "vaccine injury," to calm fears.
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nchr




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:50 am
It is possible the vaccination status of Orthodox Jews as a whole is similar to the rest of the state; however, the numbers of unvaccinated individuals in a single community or particular physical area are much greater because of the family sizes. So out of 100 homes, if two non Orthodox families do not vaccinate, you have 0-4 or maybe 6 children that are not vaccinated in two homes versus 7-20+ kids that are unvaccinated so if that block is exposed, you'll get more cases in the Orthodox population.

In addition, Orthodox Jewish and especially Hasidic community norms encourage the spread of disease - crowded classrooms, attending social community events - should- etc. It is true that non Orthodox people do that as well, but not in the same numbers.

You also have a situation where many Orthodox individuals are used to disregarding government or police input brushing it off as "modern" culturally so you have some individuals willing to send their children to school or to events or to play outside even if they should be home because they are unvaccinated and were exposed to measles. Likewise, you have some parts of the population who are unaware of basics of disease such as germ theory, statistics or the reality of complications so while their non Orthodox counterparts may vaccinate in an outbreak, they may choose to instead expose their children at measles parties.

So an Orthodox population innately has more unvaccinated individuals quantity wise even if their vaccination rate is similar and coupled with the sociocultural aspects it makes outbreaks harder to contain or to have large numbers.

Rockland County has details on how many individuals were vaccinated or not and the outbreak is exactly as we'd expect it, consisting undoubtedly of more individuals who were unvaccinated or undervaccinated. Also, keep in mind the thousands of vaccinated individuals who have been exposed and for whom two vaccines is just 97% effective so for every 100 of that population you'll get about 3 measles cases. If the vaccine was not working we'd literally be looking at thousands or tens of thousands of cases right now.
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 9:54 am
youngishbear wrote:
True. We need more research into this process. Should we check for titers after vaccination to catch those with primary vaccine failure? Why do adults lose immunity? I think we need more research on this.

We also need more research on how to identify those at risk for "vaccine injury," to calm fears.


It could be that other infectious diseases such as strep or influenza erase the immunity to VPDs. It also could be due to the fact that people get vaccinated for more illnesses today and that weakens the immunity to some of the diseases.
Titers are not always accurate but I used the results to make the decision to receive the MMR vaccine last month (I now need a second MMR) at age 64.
We currently have only one manufacturer of the MMR for the US and some of the research that they have done for Gardisil was suspect so more research may be necessary.
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Ruchel




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 11:52 am
Orthodox and Jews a s a whole are very into doctors ime
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ora_43




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Apr 30 2019, 12:57 pm
I think this is exactly what was being said earlier.

Quote:

The health department told The Epoch Times that city schools have a 98.6 percent vaccine compliance rate and that some yeshivas are indeed at this rate. It also said some yeshivas are at 80 percent but didn’t specify how many schools fall into each category.
...

“Williamsburg … has one of the lowest rates of vaccine coverage among young children, ages 19 to 35 months, in the city,” wrote Belluz.
...

Corroborating this, an April 27 report in Outbreak News Today (ONT) said that of 60 measles cases reported in adults in NYC, 17 cases were in vaccinated individuals. In other individuals, vaccination status was unknown.

Consistent with reports of parents choosing to delay the MMR, ONT said that a majority of measles cases in children have occurred in those who are unvaccinated. Citing NYC health officials, it also reported that 26 (out of 330) cases have been in vaccinated children.

The article is basically just saying "hey, if you thought the problem was that those ultra-orthodox Jews are all anti-science and unvaccinated, that's not true! Most do vaccinate!" It's good that they're clearing that up, for people with zero familiarity with the community who might have thought otherwise.

But I don't think anyone on this site thought that was the problem.

The article is not saying that vaccination is a non-issue. The majority of the cases have been among non-vaccinated people (to be fair, a few dozen of those were babies who weren't old enough to be vaccinated - but even if you ignore those cases, it's still true). It's still very possible - likely, even - that it's those pockets where 80% are vaccinated that are where the illness started, and are a big part of the reason it's still spreading.

If all of the statistics here are true, it doesn't change a thing about what anyone was saying on any of the other threads.
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