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Enough kids for you!
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asmileaday




 
 
 


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 1:10 pm
I don't find that IRL people actually say it to your face. But if they do, of course it's rude.

Online is very different. Usually it's said when a poster has severe marital discord or is telling a story of extreme dysfunction and mentions she's pregnant plus has many little ones.

In a culture like ours where many view BC as assur (I know many don't, but there's still PLENTY that do) our knee jerk reaction to these posts is to suggest BC.
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amother




Salmon


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 1:22 pm
amother [ Cobalt ] wrote:
I agree. I work in child services and recently met a woman (nonjewish) who is pregnant with her 8th kid. Her first 2 are in a foster family (she didn't want them), the next 3 are in a government run foster care and only the last 3 will be living with her.
Noone said anything or reacted negatively. I was the only one who wanted to say: please take birth control.

If she was Hispanic or Afro-American or Asian or any other non-white group, I am not surprised that colleagues didn't say a word. PC is all and above everything these days.
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amother




Salmon


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 1:36 pm
imaima wrote:
I hate it. That‘s life. I found 4 kids to be a magic border after which everyone knows that you have had enough!

After a miscarriage one of the doctors commiserated with me until she found out that I already have a bunch of kids. As if it does not matter to me at all..


Depends on your circles. 4 kids is not even considered a full family over here. Less than 5 and you have a medical problem. 6 or 7 "average". 9 and you are praiseworthy. Double digit on the lower end and you have achieved very well. 15-16 kids and more: you deserve the highest accolades although some will say for sure you have a screw loose.
In short: you can never win.
From a person who has zero kids
Wink
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Israeli_C




 
 
 


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 1:39 pm
amother [ Powderblue ] wrote:
It isn't only strangers. A close relative, upon learning that I was expecting number 5 told me that now he knows what to get us for a baby present - a box of c0ndoms! Exploding anger

A close friend of mine was offered a TV by her parent because "you are obviously bored at night" shock At wits end


Oy!! Reminds me of when I told my parents that my 2 year old was throwing tantrums and DH was sleeping in his room every night. Their response; "Very good!! Maybe that'll put a stop to all these babies!!"
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amother




Teal


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 1:51 pm
asmileaday wrote:
I don't find that IRL people actually say it to your face. But if they do, of course it's rude.

Online is very different. Usually it's said when a poster has severe marital discord or is telling a story of extreme dysfunction and mentions she's pregnant plus has many little ones.

In a culture like ours where many view BC as assur (I know many don't, but there's still PLENTY that do) our knee jerk reaction to these posts is to suggest BC.


No it's really not only in extreme situations that people suggest BC here. You can ask something innocent like "What are some great indoor activities for young kids in the summer" and if someone hears you have little kids and are pregnant, birth control will definitely be suggested even though it's completely uncalled for.
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amother




Tangerine


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 2:18 pm
I can relate to wishing for a miscarriage. 7 or 8 months pregnant, going through a rough patch in Shalom Bayis, kvetchy mommy, kvetchy kids, financial stress.

But here's the thing: All that stress is and was temporary. B"H our Shalom Bayis got back on track after the intense work commitments were over, a few tweaks to household systems made me less stressed and a happier mommy (so happier kids too). The financial stress ain't changing, and one more or less makes very little practical difference. And B"H I gave birth to a delicious, very much desired child.

So my house isn't functional to society's standards. My kids are fed, more or less clean, clothed, educated, loved, enjoyed and valued.

I know BC exists. I know my family is "too" big. I know I could get a heter.

But I don't want one. I feel that having children is a mitzvah, and not always an easy one. But working on making it work is more rewarding than throwing in the towel.

If you're on BC? Happy you have what works for you. If you're not? You probably don't need to be. If you're in doubt, speak to someone older and wiser for perspective and if advised so, get a heter from a Rav. (If your Rav won't give a heter, go to a second Rav, repeat the first Rav's psak and ask his opinion.)

Children are a priceless gift. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
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sky




 
 
 


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 2:24 pm
I get it from my coworkers all the time.

When I tell them I’m expecting I get
“I thought you were done” and many other comments.

I am the only orthodox person most of them now so it is extremely unusual for them.
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amother




Cyan


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 2:28 pm
amother [ Tangerine ] wrote:
I can relate to wishing for a miscarriage. 7 or 8 months pregnant, going through a rough patch in Shalom Bayis, kvetchy mommy, kvetchy kids, financial stress.

But here's the thing: All that stress is and was temporary. B"H our Shalom Bayis got back on track after the intense work commitments were over, a few tweaks to household systems made me less stressed and a happier mommy (so happier kids too). The financial stress ain't changing, and one more or less makes very little practical difference. And B"H I gave birth to a delicious, very much desired child.

So my house isn't functional to society's standards. My kids are fed, more or less clean, clothed, educated, loved, enjoyed and valued.

I know BC exists. I know my family is "too" big. I know I could get a heter.

But I don't want one. I feel that having children is a mitzvah, and not always an easy one. But working on making it work is more rewarding than throwing in the towel.

If you're on BC? Happy you have what works for you. If you're not? You probably don't need to be. If you're in doubt, speak to someone older and wiser for perspective and if advised so, get a heter from a Rav. (If your Rav won't give a heter, go to a second Rav, repeat the first Rav's psak and ask his opinion.)

Children are a priceless gift. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Thank you for saying what I can't. I think it must be that a lot of posters here are just not having the right hashkafa.
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amother




Blonde


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 2:37 pm
amother [ Cyan ] wrote:
Thank you for saying what I can't. I think it must be that a lot of posters here are just not having the right hashkafa.


Just because it’s your hashkafa doesn’t make it the right one.
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amother




Salmon


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 3:02 pm
[quote="amother [ Tangerine ]"
Children are a priceless gift. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.[/quote]

Thank you!
Hug
In Israel when somebody says anything negative abt "too large families" one can always counter with "it's good religious Jews have many kids or you prefer the Arabs to have massive amounts and Jews only one or 2?
Works every time.
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imaima




 
 
 


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 3:18 pm
amother [ Salmon ] wrote:
Depends on your circles. 4 kids is not even considered a full family over here. Less than 5 and you have a medical problem. 6 or 7 "average". 9 and you are praiseworthy. Double digit on the lower end and you have achieved very well. 15-16 kids and more: you deserve the highest accolades although some will say for sure you have a screw loose.
In short: you can never win.
From a person who has zero kids
Wink


It was not a circle, it‘s a non-Jewish doctor in the hospital
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amother




Ivory


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 3:42 pm
amother [ Salmon ] wrote:
Thank you!
Hug
In Israel when somebody says anything negative abt "too large families" one can always counter with "it's good religious Jews have many kids or you prefer the Arabs to have massive amounts and Jews only one or 2?
Works every time.


Not sure that would work in some secular circles. Very non PC.
Btw the Arab birth rate has also gone down considerably. I think if the gov't wants to lower the Arab demographic, it should invest a lot in women's educations and careers. Usually brings birth rate down.
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amother




Forestgreen


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 3:50 pm
Unfortunately people will always throw comments at you. When I had my kids very close in age, I got comments that I should take BC. (Bh I was managing well and had lots of help.) When I had a 6 year break, I got comments when I'm having another one and if I'm enjoying my break. There will always be people that cannot mind their own business and have to stick their nose in everywhere.
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amother




Floralwhite


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 4:51 pm
amother [ Teal ] wrote:
No it's really not only in extreme situations that people suggest BC here. You can ask something innocent like "What are some great indoor activities for young kids in the summer" and if someone hears you have little kids and are pregnant, birth control will definitely be suggested even though it's completely uncalled for.


I have actually never seen that, and I'm here pretty often. I see people mention BC to women who are in clearly dysfunctional relationships and not coping. I would love for you to link to such a thread, where moms ask for activity suggestions and BC is suggested as a response.

As to amother tangerine, there are women here in serious shape and at the end of their ropes. A world where BC! is suggested too often in the hopes it reaches these women in desperate straits is preferable, in my mind, to a world where it's not suggested at all to women like you, who deep down, are really managing for the most part.

(PS- anyone remember the thread of a giyores with an advanced degree who was so destitute she was considering panhandling and her DH refused to work because of his misplaced concerns over stealing from his employer? Or a poster who is unable or unwilling to protect her children from a MIL who literally physically abuses them and a DH who protects, not the kids, but his mother? Amother tangerine, your concern should not be that people like you shouldn't hear BC suggestions. It should be that people in desperate need of help DO get to hear those suggestions).
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amother




Beige


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 5:22 pm
Someone said it to me and I was very hurt and resentful at the time.
But you know what? I took their advice and now I am the staunchest supporter of BC.
I still think she was obnoxious for saying it, but am really thankful.
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ectomorph




 
 
 


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 5:29 pm
amother [ Floralwhite ] wrote:
I have actually never seen that, and I'm here pretty often. I see people mention BC to women who are in clearly dysfunctional relationships and not coping. I would love for you to link to such a thread, where moms ask for activity suggestions and BC is suggested as a response.

As to amother tangerine, there are women here in serious shape and at the end of their ropes. A world where BC! is suggested too often in the hopes it reaches these women in desperate straits is preferable, in my mind, to a world where it's not suggested at all to women like you, who deep down, are really managing for the most part.

(PS- anyone remember the thread of a giyores with an advanced degree who was so destitute she was considering panhandling and her DH refused to work because of his misplaced concerns over stealing from his employer? Or a poster who is unable or unwilling to protect her children from a MIL who literally physically abuses them and a DH who protects, not the kids, but his mother? Amother tangerine, your concern should not be that people like you shouldn't hear BC suggestions. It should be that people in desperate need of help DO get to hear those suggestions).

Clearly you missed my dumping thread, and the other million thread s...
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amother




Cerise


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 5:43 pm
ectomorph wrote:
Clearly you missed my dumping thread, and the other million thread s...


I just read through your entire dumping thread. The only time bc was mentioned was by frantic frummie who followed it with just kidding! LOL Which was obviously a joke. Did I miss something?
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ectomorph




 
 
 


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 6:20 pm
amother [ Cerise ] wrote:
I just read through your entire dumping thread. The only time bc was mentioned was by frantic frummie who followed it with just kidding! LOL Which was obviously a joke. Did I miss something?

Maybe it was a joke? I was surprised someone would say that at all, or think it was in good taste. Could be I read it while tired, and didn't realize it was a joke.
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amother




Cerise


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 6:39 pm
ectomorph wrote:
Maybe it was a joke? I was surprised someone would say that at all, or think it was in good taste. Could be I read it while tired, and didn't realize it was a joke.


It was extremely obvious that it was a joke. She literally wrote:

First of all, go on birth control! LOL (just kidding)

And then she followed with helpful suggestions.
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amother




Floralwhite


Post  Mon, May 20 2019, 10:22 pm
ectomorph wrote:
Clearly you missed my dumping thread, and the other million thread s...


Ok so other than the OBVIOUS joke, kindly point me to some of the "million" threads where literally women are asking for activity ideas and they are told to go on BC as a response. So now it's both you and amother teal making this claim.

Waiting. Waiting Waiting
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