Article in the Ami (Abt: sealed windows)

elisheva25

Wed, May 22 2019, 8:07 am

mammala120 wrote:

Wether some of you believe this or not doesn’t matter because experience talk louder then what people think. We have moved into a home bought from a [gentile]. First owner closed of 3 windows. He lost a son. Second owner lived there for 22 years with no issues. Us the third owner had tradegy. Why I don’t know. Why no one ever thought this to community... I don’t know. Thankyou elisheva25. You really opened my eyes. We will be making 3 holes with vents Thankyou.

You are welcome ! I am still myself shaken up over this, but I am glad it’s helping someone

elisheva25

Wed, May 22 2019, 8:14 am

ra_mom wrote:

Exterior doors and windows.
You can move your oven to clean it and replace it. There's an issue with moving the gas/electrical lines and changing the placement of the oven permanently when renovating.

I think you are right , but not 100%. I think interior matters to. You can’t seal off, not close but seal off a door or a window that existed. In my case, on the exterior you still have the frames and what looks like used to be a window that’s partially covered, but on the inside of my house the previous owner build a wall, no what used to be a window is completely sealed off. While Baruch HaShem x100000000, we have had no real tragedies, of the magnitude described on this thread for that I am eternally grateful. Yet, we have had enough issues in this house, for me to be seriously concerned about this wall that’s blocking what used to be a window. My understanding is that anything that used to be window, door (interior ) still has to have some sort of an opening.

Rubber Ducky

Wed, May 22 2019, 8:18 am

I do residential and kitchen design professionally, and this comes up fairly often.

Usually, when closing off a window we just leave a tiny hole and put cotton in it and/or tape over it. Shaidim can fit through small spaces Smile

Regarding ovens, if you're getting a new oven and putting it in a different location, this should not be a problem.

Also... the Rambam wrote that there are no more shaidim.

There is a question on whether Yehudah hachasid wrote about this for his family only. Here is a detailed article from Kaf-K in theyeshivaworld.com about closing up windows and moving ovens: https://www.theyeshivaworld.co......html

elisheva25

Wed, May 22 2019, 8:19 am

MomMe wrote:

I'm really confused about this...
Are the doors and windows we have to worry about only EXTERIOR ones? Or even doors and windows to the inside of the house matter?
Also how are you supposed to clean around and under your oven if you can't move it?

Hi, so I think it’s interior also, because clearly that’s what’s the issue in my house . Because once you seal off a window or door on the inside, seal off not just close... you are creating a blockage at least on one side . That space that used to be a window is no longer permeable. I think real issue is that A. People like me who have no clue about this .B. Moving into an old house where you have no idea what renovations were done .

amother

Slateblue

Wed, May 22 2019, 9:27 am

From what I was told it involves anything interior and exterior. About the oven, I was told this refers to the brick ovens that were used many years ago.
I did read the article and it reminded me that when I moved 3yrs ago I closed off a door. The handyman clearly stated he will leave hole but I was never able to see it. I am now thinking the painter may have closed it unknowingly.
Oddly ever since we have moved we have been plagued by serious financial trouble and it has gotten really bad. I have brought this up with my husband this morning and he says he forgot to tell me that his partner recently discovered a blocked window in his apt. I will now be looking into making the new hole.
Thanks op for bringing this up.

yksraya

Wed, May 22 2019, 10:14 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

I am totally confused about the oven thing. There are demons living under my oven? What do I do if I want to remodel and buy a better oven? What do you do if your oven breaks?

I did hear that sheidim hang out under the bed, and you can't store food or water there. I have no idea why. Do they get hungry?

If you go to abandoned places at night, you're much more likely to be attacked by crackheads than you are by demons.

I can see needing accessible windows as a precaution against carbon monoxide poisoning, or as a fire escape route.

I just can't see that correlation is the same as causation. If the moon is full and I stub my toe, does the full moon cause toe stubs?

I never heard of sheidim under beds. Food gets temei under the bed as it's temei under a sleeping person. If food was under the bed only during daytime and no one slept there, the food is ok.

I do remember as a newly wed, someone discussed making a hole at a closed opening after construction. I thought of it as extreme and weird. But guess it is a thing.

amother

Lilac

Wed, May 22 2019, 11:45 am

Rubber Ducky wrote:

Do you mean if I throw out the old oven and put in a new one, it's okay? Is it ok to move the old oven to a new location when remodeling a kitchen?

Also is it okay to move the old cooktop to a new area in the kitchen when remodeling?

I worked with a professional designer. I can't understand why she didn't bring this up.

urban gypsy

Wed, May 22 2019, 11:45 am

elisheva25 wrote:

Also apparently doors!!

https://shulchanaruchharav.com.....ndow/

https://www.google.com/amp/www...../amp/

Thank you! There is a list of about 80 things!!!!! Some of them are straight up demonology and some are more like bad luck. For those who didn't scroll all the way down here are some highlights:
-opening up graves (that's pretty intuitive)
-stacking coffins
-kissing a dead child
-a women who practicing witchcraft or vapirism needs to have her mouth filled with earth before she is buried (but not a man???? what gives?????)
-When the dead invite a live person to come with them respond, “The Holy One Blessed Be He does not wish me to do so.” (wild!!!!)
-Not to accept anything from the dead in a dream nor to swear anything to him
-Not to build a bathhouse in his home
-When one leaves the house on a trip not to return if one forgot something
-Not to drink open water from a house where someone passed away
-Not to remove the Mezuzos when one moves
-Must have intimacy with spouse on night of immersion

The only one of these I've ever heard of is that one must sleep with a spouse on the night of immersion. If one's spouse is out of town, a woman should sleep with a knife to guard against demons.... maybe even incubi???? Yikes!!!

What I find mildly annoying about all this is that it is pretty obvious that some of these beliefs are clearly derived from Slavic pagan traditions. The demons under the stove, and the demons in the bath house are well known traditions of Russian peasants that probably filtered into Jewish beliefs. I am quite sure that Sefardic Jews don't have traditions of this kind, and probably have a bunch of traditions derived from the Muslims societies where they originated. (I myself am of Russian background and studied Russian folkloric traditions in college so I'm more familiar with the Slavic and Christian superstitions)

I don't believe in non-Jewish superstitions, but I do believe in the existence of demons. I would love to learn more about authentically Jewish beliefs regarding demons, dating further back to pre-exile times.

ShishKabob

Wed, May 22 2019, 11:55 am

imasoftov wrote:

“Everyone knows that dragons don’t exist. But while this simplistic formulation may satisfy the layman, it does not suffice for the scientific mind. The School of Higher Neantical Nillity is in fact wholly unconcerned with what does exist. Indeed, the banality of existence has been so amply demonstrated, there is no need for us to discuss it any further here. The brilliant Cerebron, attacking the problem analytically, discovered three distinct kinds of dragon: the mythical, the chimerical, and the purely hypothetical. They were all, one might say, nonexistent, but each non-existed in an entirely different way.”

― Stanisław Lem, The Cyberiad

Not necessarily true. They may have existed before the mabul like the dinosaurs.

That being said, there is something to this with blocking off an opening that was there before. Just like with chopping off a fruit tree. They're both from the tzavaah from Reb Yehuda Hachasid.
You don't have to believe it, it's not one of the 13 principals of faith. However, if you go thru enough hardships and it gets resolved when you take care of these specific issues, you got your proof the hard way, and you could've avoided or prevented so much pain and tzaar.

elisheva25

Wed, May 22 2019, 11:56 am

urban gypsy wrote:

I do agree some def sound like Russian superstition stories . And I am certainly not knowledgeable in this area to even begin to comment . You can pm me for some info that I won’t post public. But to stay on topic, whether we choose to believe it or not... just on this thread alone there are enough stories with windows/doors that makes you wonder. I believe there are Rabbonim out there who have answers we as women don’t have on this thread . I think it’s important at least for me to thoroughly check out my house ( including blue prints) and to make necessary changes under the guidance of a Rav .

urban gypsy

Wed, May 22 2019, 11:59 am

elisheva25 wrote:

I think the window/door belief is actually common to most (if not all) traditional cultures... which to me indicates it's probably true! Wink

elisheva25

Wed, May 22 2019, 11:59 am

ShishKabob wrote:

Yes, I agree whole heartedly .

urban gypsy

Wed, May 22 2019, 12:09 pm

elisheva25 wrote:

And I know I am venting, and I know I sound like a cry baby. But isn’t that what this site is for ???
But I just can’t believe I’ve lived in this house for 5+ years, not even being remotely aware of this concept . That’s 5+ years of heartache and diff issues that could of been avoided . Like I just can’t wrap my head around it ??

Try not to beat yourself up about it. Look at it this way: Hashem led you to this information because he doesn't want you to suffer anymore and wants to give you a tool to stop it and bring down brachos into your home.