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S/o no shidduch crisis if you have emuna



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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 7:32 am
So theres a lot of back and forth in that thread...

Some say the girls are too picky..its their fault...does that mean they are being punished bec of their bad choices?? Others say it will happen when hashem decides...someone even wrote that she did all her hishtadlus and only got married at 40 so clearly hashem willed it at that time...

But I want to apply this to other areas of life... example parnassa.. if I drive kids everyday and the days I that the kids are fighting and refuse to sit down are stressful for me. I want to quit but I need the money but other days I have a great time bec im driving and the kids are behaving so is it my bad choice that im in this stressful job and maybe im supposed to switch or maybe hashem specifically decided the kids will act up so as to give me the tzara im supposed to have or hashem can just make it that they behave everyday and im not stressed??, I dont even think we can know the answer bec we are not privy to hashems plsn .

Or if my friend took treatments for fertility and the dr gave up. Shoukd she adopt and say well hashem doesnt want her to have children or should she go to a different dr and keep trying different treatments??? Hashem could make anything happen and its just as miraculous for the fertility treatments to work as for some to have a baby naturally so do we say she made the wrong choices of dr who made the wrong choices of treatments??? I think since we dont know hashems plan we cant make judgements but its clear hashem decided she has tzara in this area of life and yet ppl judge harshly...

Life is very confusing because we are not in control but most ppl do hishradlus and blame them when they dont get results...I think thatcis a lack of emuna..because dont blame the ppl...instead recognize its part of hashems plan!!!

I know some wives who support their families because their husbands were laid off and then couldnt find a job and then was only able to get part time low paying job despite them trying to get more hours and try to get better jobs. ....is it the men who are making the wrong choices or is it hashem who decided those men and their wives will suffer in the area of parnassa but the wives will be able to make enough for basics...I think afyer all hishtadlus and still no good results, it means its hasheks plan

In school and shiurim and even books there are stories of ppl who "just believed" or "just did a mutzva like covering hair or..." and they had kids or parnassa or....BUT MOST PPL I KNOW DONT EXPERIENCE THESE CAUSE AND EFFECT AS "DO A MITZVA AND SEE THE SAVING FROM SUFFERING"....no, real life is a lot of suffering for ppl who are doing mitzvos, razon hashem....

Back to shuduchim, who are we to judge an older single?? Are u upset they didnt take your suggestion bec they said hes short??? But, maybe hashem put that in their head to say bec there wouldve been other reasons they dont connect? Look at all the "nonpicky" women who are divorced or in misrable marriages! Maybe they shoukdve been "pickier"?? No!! We cant judge!! The singles do settle when its the right one which means its not just about short or tall or.. but we dont know hashems plan....yes we definitelt have to have more opportunities for mingling bec ppl should meet face ti face and ....

But life is complex we can make choices and many times hashem says no!!! Or are you saying our bad choices makes hashem take away his plan?? But if so, who has a right to say that?? Only hashem knows that information.

In my life, no matter how much hishtadlus I made im not successful. Ppl know me as a hardworking person, but I know hashem has a plan and I keep telling hashem to help me get through this tzara and am hoping for my yeshua so too I wish all singles get a yeshua. Because as long as they do hishtadlus its up to hashem...
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mig100




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 8:30 am
op- I didnt read your whole post. I just skimmed through it. I think your whole post boild down to the basic - very complicated and confusing questions of hishtadlus

how much hishtadulos to we have to do?
does our hishtadlus effect the outcome?
if not, (everything is predestined to be as its meant to be) then why do any effort at all?

I can post more on these questions later. there was a recent thread discussing this that you may find interesting in the meantime https://www.imamother.com/foru.....57437
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yerushamama




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 9:58 am
My understanding of Hishtadlus is that it is approximately the same as "reasonable effort". A lot of people seem to be mixing up the hishtadlus concept with that of "bashert". Puting in Histadlus in anything means actually putting in the effort required in this world to accomplish the goal. Whether or not we see the results are a different issue altogether.

I don't remember the exact details, but I remember hearing a story of someone who put a tremendous amount of effort into something which did not work out for him. He went to his Rav to ask "but I did my hishtadlus - what happened?" The Rav showed him how his efforts had caused other positive things, even though he didn't get what he wanted out of it.
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 9:58 am
mig100 wrote:
op- I didnt read your whole post. I just skimmed through it. I think your whole post boild down to the basic - very complicated and confusing questions of hishtadlus

how much hishtadulos to we have to do?
does our hishtadlus effect the outcome?
if not, (everything is predestined to be as its meant to be) then why do any effort at all?

I can post more on these questions later. there was a recent thread discussing this that you may find interesting in the meantime https://www.imamother.com/foru.....57437


Thanks for responding.

I guess I wasn't clear. I'm basically saying is it okay to say "ploni is not successful at -----(getting married or having kids or making parnassa or......) so therefore he didn't do something correct....??? I don't think we can judge others just because they were not successful"" just bec. They didn't get the outcome they wanted....I think its all part of hashems plan that they need to suffer in that way and we can't understand...yet ppl are judging based on outcomes without putting hashem in it.
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amother
Pewter


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 10:05 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks for responding.

I guess I wasn't clear. I'm basically saying is it okay to say "ploni is not successful at -----(getting married or having kids or making parnassa or......) so therefore he didn't do something correct....??? I don't think we can judge others just because they were not successful"" just bec. They didn't get the outcome they wanted....I think its all part of hashems plan that they need to suffer in that way and we can't understand...yet ppl are judging based on outcomes without putting hashem in it.


People shouldn't be judging period.
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amother
Peach


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 10:08 am
I have a good career but barely work. Emotionally I’m just not cut out to do this work full time. Does that mean I’m not doing my hishtadlus? I’m just not the type of person who manages that well I guess. I try to be a good person and help others and do what’s right, and I trust that Hashem will take care of me and give me what I need. After all, He is the one who created me this way.
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yerushamama




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 10:12 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks for responding.

I guess I wasn't clear. I'm basically saying is it okay to say "ploni is not successful at -----(getting married or having kids or making parnassa or......) so therefore he didn't do something correct....??? I don't think we can judge others just because they were not successful"" just bec. They didn't get the outcome they wanted....I think its all part of hashems plan that they need to suffer in that way and we can't understand...yet ppl are judging based on outcomes without putting hashem in it.


I don't think anyone has the right to judge how much hishtadlus someone else has done or should do. Unfortunately, when it comes to shidduchim, people are very quick to tell a single "Do your hishtadlus - go out with him/her." We need to be more sensitive in how we speak or even think of others, but singles (and all others in need of a yeshua) need to ask themselves from time to time whether the hishtadlus they are doing is enough/too much/in the right direction. It is up to each individual (with the help of their Rav, as necessary) to determine what the correct hishtadlus is in their situation.
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iyar




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 10:16 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks for responding.

I guess I wasn't clear. I'm basically saying is it okay to say "ploni is not successful at -----(getting married or having kids or making parnassa or......) so therefore he didn't do something correct....??? I don't think we can judge others just because they were not successful"" just bec. They didn't get the outcome they wanted....I think its all part of hashems plan that they need to suffer in that way and we can't understand...yet ppl are judging based on outcomes without putting hashem in it.


No, it's not okay to judge another person. If you care about the person you can daven for them.
You're not G-d. You don't know what's inside that person's heart, you don't know what, if anything, he's doing wrong and you certainly don't know G-d's plan for that person.
It is okay to judge yourself. If I'm not successful at something I can make an effort to figure what, if anything, I should be doing differently.
When it gets a little sticky is when you're close with someone and you see they're having a hard time with something and you have an idea of what they might do to have a better outcome. - Do you say something?
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 11:22 am
Thanks for the replies ...I guess I felt that ppl who say you are picky and that is why you didnt get married" is judging and is a lack of emuna because hashem wanted that person to suffer in that way and we are not privy to the reason hashem made it that way.
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 11:24 am
amother [ Peach ] wrote:
I have a good career but barely work. Emotionally I’m just not cut out to do this work full time. Does that mean I’m not doing my hishtadlus? I’m just not the type of person who manages that well I guess. I try to be a good person and help others and do what’s right, and I trust that Hashem will take care of me and give me what I need. After all, He is the one who created me this way.


But is your dh is the one with the responsibility to work for finances...unless someone is not married..then it falls on the woman ....
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 11:45 am
If I want to buy a new house with all the perks but only want to pay half of the asking price, it will be a miracle if I get the house.

I was talking to a man who has a daughter with an appearance issue that is limiting her shidduch possibilities. They saw a guy that seemed right for her until they found out that he is a smoker. Now this girl and her family don't exactly have the best health habits but at least they don't smoke. Now I don't blame her for not wanting a smoker but the men are not exactly breaking the door down to go out with her. She has a right to her choices but does that guarantee that she will be able to find someone to marry or is she better off to make peace with a smoker? Why is Hashem giving her such inferior choices?
Again, I can't judge her because I also didn't marry a smoker ( or a man shorter than me) but what can a person do if their choices are limited?
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giselle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 12:14 pm
southernbubby wrote:
If I want to buy a new house with all the perks but only want to pay half of the asking price, it will be a miracle if I get the house.

I was talking to a man who has a daughter with an appearance issue that is limiting her shidduch possibilities. They saw a guy that seemed right for her until they found out that he is a smoker. Now this girl and her family don't exactly have the best health habits but at least they don't smoke. Now I don't blame her for not wanting a smoker but the men are not exactly breaking the door down to go out with her. She has a right to her choices but does that guarantee that she will be able to find someone to marry or is she better off to make peace with a smoker? Why is Hashem giving her such inferior choices?
Again, I can't judge her because I also didn't marry a smoker ( or a man shorter than me) but what can a person do if their choices are limited?


It’s like someone I know who is nearing 40 and really wants to get married. But some of the things she’s told me sound absolutely outrageous. I don’t want to write details as it’s not my story to tell, but I do want to shake her and show her what she’s doing. Is that judgment? I don’t know.
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amother
Peach


 

Post Tue, Jun 04 2019, 12:17 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
But is your dh is the one with the responsibility to work for finances...unless someone is not married..then it falls on the woman ....


Right but we can definitely use more money that we could have if I worked more. Or maybe not. Maybe Hashem would have my husband make less then. It’s hard to know if we’re putting in the right amount of hishtadlus. But I also have to take care of my mental health (there’s a lot more going on than just the job).
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