Feminism | Imamother

happyness

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 6:48 pm

If I were a feminist, would one of my beliefs be that women are equal to men, as in I don't need a man's help, I can do it on my own just the same? I have equal strengths and can do anything he can do?

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 6:53 pm

delicious wrote:

Feminism means equal respect in the sense that a person doing X job should get paid the same regardless of gender. This is why I don’t understand why a woman wouldn’t be a feminist.

It doesn’t mean you are both equally good at the same things - if you compare two women it is unlikely that they will be equally strong in all areas so why should a man and a woman be?

amother

Blush

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 6:56 pm

delicious wrote:

Everyone needs help at some point.

Very few things other than procreation specifically require a man. (Leaving religion out of this).

pesek zman

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:06 pm

For me, yes. This is part of it. I have a very very difficult time asking for (and/or accepting) help from a man (even my husband)

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:13 pm

You will find different flavors of feminism out there. Some women take an extreme view, such as you describe. Others, probably most, focus more on societal issues as described by Red. Why do you ask?

amother

Yellow

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:15 pm

I'm a post-feminist. I used to be a feminist. I dont like to ask for help either. Sometimes I need it, for big things like a death in the family, health issues, raising kids in a healthy way. BH I have good men in my life now, family and career wise, who respect women and men, are feminists without the lingo. I now see there is potential for all people. I'm more a humanist.

I still feel and act staunchly feminist around my misogynist relatives, though. They and their wives are in the dark ages....

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:18 pm

pesek zman wrote:

For me, yes. This is part of it. I have a very very difficult time asking for (and/or accepting) help from a man (even my husband)

Being a feminist doesn’t mean you think you can or should do everything or that you shouldn’t ask for help from a man. It just simply means that you don’t want there to be gender discrimination.

amother

Tangerine

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:18 pm

delicious wrote:

No that’s not feminism, it’s stupidity. Women are not as physically strong as men.

amother

Chocolate

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:27 pm

amother [ Tangerine ] wrote:

No that’s not feminism, it’s stupidity. Women are not as physically strong as men.

Feminism (among other things) means that people aren't targeted into stereotypes of capabilities.

There are some women who are STRONGER than some men physically so a blanket statement such as this is stereotyping and hiring only men for positions which require physical strength would be an example of an illegal hiring practice.

In terms of the original question, a man is just as likely to need help on some things as a woman. What doesn't and shouldn't define people are the genders. It used to be a "fact" that woman weren't logical and therefore weren't good at math or science. Or actually that any type of learning would harm a woman's procreative abilities.

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:35 pm

amother [ Tangerine ] wrote:

No that’s not feminism, it’s stupidity. Women are not as physically strong as men.

Speak for yourself. I can lift things that are the same or greater weight than my DH can. 💪

But that isn’t feminism, that is merely brute strength.

pesek zman

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:35 pm

amother [ Red ] wrote:

Perhaps that’s all it means for you. That’s not what it means for me.

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:38 pm

pesek zman wrote:

Perhaps that’s all it means for you. That’s not what it means for me.

My definition is in line with what it says in the dictionary “the advocacy of women's rights on the ground of the equality of the sexes.”

Equality. Meaning being treated the same. It isn’t about not needing help. Everybody needs help. You have a hard time asking for help, I understand this totally as I am very self-sufficient and hate to rely on others. But that is a personality trait, not feminism.

amother

Seagreen

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:55 pm

amother [ Tangerine ] wrote:

No that’s not feminism, it’s stupidity. Women are not as physically strong as men.

On average, women are not as physically strong as men (just as on average, women are not as tall as men), but any individual woman may be stronger than any individual man (just as any individual woman may be taller than any individual man). And most women are strong enough to do many things that men do for them.

I am pretty strong (because I work out) and I am very independent, so I hate taking help from anyone (man, woman, child, cocker spaniel, etc.)

nechamashifra

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 7:56 pm

pesek zman wrote:

For me, yes. This is part of it. I have a very very difficult time asking for (and/or accepting) help from a man (even my husband)

I liked feminism when it was about women having the right to vote, or equal pay rights etc. Lately though, it seems that it has become more about competition and a little anger (the popular "a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle" comes to mind). What's wrong with needing a man? A man needs a woman too.

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:00 pm

nechamashifra wrote:

The bolded is what feminism is. Everything else you mention is just man hating. Man hating does not equal feminism. I personally don’t see how the two get muddled up. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Who is saying that they don’t need a man? And what has that got to do with feminism? I am a feminist with a man I need. Where is the contradiction?

amother

Seagreen

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:02 pm

Along with equal rights/privileges - comes equal responsibility. If women want equal rights, pay, respect, independence, etc., then it’s not fair to expect men to always be helping and taking care of them (especially when women are often more than capable of doing those things for themselves).

(This is not to say that anyone - man, woman, child, or cocker spaniel -should not be helped and/or taken care of, when they actually do need it.)

trixx

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:02 pm

delicious wrote:

A bit off topic, throw tomatoes if you want, but in my opinion a woman who believes this (and I say this as someone who used to) needs to read (and ignore the title of) the Surrendered Wife. Bc you should be able to, even if you shattered that glass ceiling, accept offer of help and a compliment from your husband whom you presumably love and value.

Last edited by trixx on Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:04 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:03 pm

amother [ Seagreen ] wrote:

Ok, there is no argument here? Who is saying otherwise?

amother

Red

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:06 pm

trixx wrote:

Nobody is disagreeing that you shouldn’t accept help from your DH. However that particular book you mention is decidedly unfeminist which is why it irks people sometimes. The person in the household who is strongest at financial bookkeeping is the best person to look after house finances regardless of gender. The LD book disregards this common sense. It makes no sense to let the man control the finances if he is an unemployed gambler while his wife makes six figures as an accountant to take an extreme example.

trixx

Mon, Jun 17 2019, 8:08 pm

amother [ Red ] wrote:

Everyone always quotes that one aspect in critique of the book. I don't agree with it either. You don't have to follow it like the Bible. She would have been better off leaving out that entire chapter.