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amother




OP


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:09 am
DS is 11 and really a good boy b"h. He has a boy in his class who he is a friend with. This boy comes from a dysfunctional family (although you'll never see from outside) and he isn't such a good influence on my son. (Nothing bad but I just don't like it!) I will NEVER force him not to be friends with him as my mom did it to me and I feel it affected me alot. How do I cut off this relationship without any lasting affects?
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amother




Beige


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:21 am
So this boy is from a disfunctional family but hasn't done anything bad. Not that you should ever put your son in a bad environment, and I wouldn't want him to have negative influences, but maybe Rebono Shel Olams plan is for your son (and your home) to be a grounding force for this kid and a good influence.

Thought?
Especially from those imas who state that their homes growing up were disfuctional.
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karat




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:21 am
It depends.
In what way is he a bad influence?
Have you spoken to the rebbe/menahel?
Do they feel the relationship is unhealthy?
Or are you biased because of the boy’s family?
Can you have the boy come over to your house so that you could be there to supervise?
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amother




Babyblue


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:26 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
DS is 11 and really a good boy b"h. He has a boy in his class who he is a friend with. This boy comes from a dysfunctional family (although you'll never see from outside) and he isn't such a good influence on my son. (Nothing bad but I just don't like it!) I will NEVER force him not to be friends with him as my mom did it to me and I feel it affected me alot. How do I cut off this relationship without any lasting affects?


Don’t cut off the friendship. When I was a teen, my friend was banned from being my friend because of something personal I had written on a piece of paper. Her abusive father read it when he searched her bag. My friend had never done anything wrong. One day I had a friend; next day I didn’t. I have never fully trusted female friends since. I didn’t grow up frum so in the past had a lot of male friends which was great. As a frum female, this incident in my childhood still affects me as I can’t hang out with guys any more.

If your DS’s friend is leading him astray sure, you have a reason but at the moment so what if his family is dysfunctional? Doesn’t mean the boy will do anything he shouldn’t and plenty of boys from nice functional homes do bad things.
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amother




Babyblue


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:30 am
karat wrote:
It depends.
In what way is he a bad influence?
Have you spoken to the rebbe/menahel?
Do they feel the relationship is unhealthy?
Or are you biased because of the boy’s family?
Can you have the boy come over to your house so that you could be there to supervise?


Yes, please don’t cut off the friendship if it is the bolded.
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amother




OP


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:33 am
Thanks for your replies. I'm looking for advice how to slowly cut off contact between them. I don't need advice if I should do it.

I meant dysfunctional as they don't have manners and their behaviour is out of control and the mom thinks they're the perfect children
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karat




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:39 am
I’m convinced that your judgment is clouded.
In your original post you said that if someone were to meet the boy it would not be obvious that he is from a dysfunctional family.

I think you should speak to the rebbe/menahel and get their opinion.

Regardless, I don’t see how you can cut off the friendship if they attend the same yeshiva.

It would be more effective for you to encourage your son to invite other friends over and see if the friendship will taper off naturally.
Hatzlacha
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amother




Beige


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:44 am
I am all in favor of keeping you kids away from children who drink/smoke/sneak out/steal/ are chutzpaddik to the Rebbi...

I would say teach your child manners and insists the child had manners in your home, but you are not interested.

If your child is as refined as you believe, and this child is as ill mannered and out of control as you think, your son will find so him annoying and babyish and move on.
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groovy1224




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 11:46 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks for your replies. I'm looking for advice how to slowly cut off contact between them. I don't need advice if I should do it.

I meant dysfunctional as they don't have manners and their behaviour is out of control and the mom thinks they're the perfect children


I'm just not really understanding what you want. You say you don't want to cut off the friendship but it sounds kind of like you want to..cut off the friendship. Just secretly.
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karat




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 12:42 pm
groovy1224 wrote:
I'm just not really understanding what you want. You say you don't want to cut off the friendship but it sounds kind of like you want to..cut off the friendship. Just secretly.


She’s going to hurt the friend’s feelings and wants to get support here so that she can rationalize it and not feel guilty about it.
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amother




Babyblue


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 12:45 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks for your replies. I'm looking for advice how to slowly cut off contact between them. I don't need advice if I should do it.

I meant dysfunctional as they don't have manners and their behaviour is out of control and the mom thinks they're the perfect children


But your son likes him. Your son is entitled to have friends. You can tell him that you expect your DS’s behavior and manners to be exemplary. And also, just think how your DS’s good manners and good behavior might positively influence the other boy in a good way.
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iyar




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 12:46 pm
amother [ Babyblue ] wrote:
Yes, please don’t cut off the friendship if it is the bolded.


Another vote in this direction.
If you can speak to a Rebbe or teacher who knows the child that might be a good idea.
Don't do this unless you decide it's very necessary. Mixing in to your son's friendship isn't good for your own child- I realize his needs are your first priority. And even if it's not top priority, the needs of the other child also should be considered.
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SixOfWands




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 12:49 pm
groovy1224 wrote:
I'm just not really understanding what you want. You say you don't want to cut off the friendship but it sounds kind of like you want to..cut off the friendship. Just secretly.


She doesn't want to tell her son that he can't be friends with the other child. She wants to figure out how to manipulate it so that the relationship is severed without her son figuring out that she's the one who set it in motion.

What I can't figure out is how the kid is a "bad influence" but does "Nothing bad." I wonder if it really all boils down to the fact that OP "just [doesn't] like it!" -- or more to the point, doesn't like this other kid.

OP, you can encourage other friendships, invite other families with kids his age over, send him to different camps and different extra-curricular activitiess than the other boy. But an 11 year old will pick his own friends.
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imasinger




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 12:57 pm
(As a mother of boys with issues, I hope you might reconsider and back off unless and until you actually see a negative influence on your DS. Maybe he would be a positive influence on this child.)

That being said, I'll paraphrase Judith Martin/Miss Manners that the way to discourage an undesirable connection in an older child is similar to the way one discourages an undesirable connection to, say, a ragged, smelly blanky in a younger child. Convey the message that it's not quite acceptable in polite society. "You can play this afternoon with X, but I would prefer that for Shabbos playdates you only invite friends who remember to say please and thank you, and play nicely with everyone."

And keep talking about middos in general, how you're proud of DS's, and what impresses you about different people of any age.
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amother




Papaya


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 1:00 pm
I would taper things off rather than cut abruptly, which can backfire badly. Have the boy over at your house (where you can be in control of the situation) and stop sending your son over there. Make plans with other kids so that sometimes he can be busy with someone else.

I had a friend growing up like this, her parents were neglectful not in the sense of physical needs, or even totally emotional needs (they were very loving parents), but just, they weren't around a lot and left their kids to their own devices and just didn't really know what their kids were up to. My mother wasn't comfortable with me going there, so we had the girl over, and though there were still some things my mother didn't like, I had a much more powerful influence on my friend than she did on me.
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amother




OP


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 1:30 pm
Thanks everyone for your advice! (And assumptions Rolling Eyes ). I was caught in the heat of the moment when the mother yet again tried to manipulate me in paring my son with hers for a workshop. I calmed down now and decided not to mix in and hopefully this friendship will fade away.
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amother




Emerald


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 1:38 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks everyone for your advice! (And assumptions Rolling Eyes ). I was caught in the heat of the moment when the mother yet again tried to manipulate me in paring my son with hers for a workshop. I calmed down now and decided not to mix in and hopefully this friendship will fade away.


One of my daughter's friend's moms decided to get rid of their friendship because of DH's race. The mom didn't know until I told her. She had the school separate them into different classes.
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Chayalle




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 1:49 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks everyone for your advice! (And assumptions Rolling Eyes ). I was caught in the heat of the moment when the mother yet again tried to manipulate me in paring my son with hers for a workshop. I calmed down now and decided not to mix in and hopefully this friendship will fade away.


Why is that manipulative? If the child thinks your child is his friend, it's normal to want to be together on a project.

If you don't want your child to be assigned to projects with this child, speak to the teacher.

My personal observation is that kids seek friends that make sense for them on an emotional, social, and behavioral level. They have something in common with this child that makes it work for them. When we interfere with the social process, we often end up with a child that does not know how to make healthy friendships.

OTOH if a child really is a negative influence (not just for perceived external reasons), we sometimes have to take steps to protect them. Just be sure the benefit is more than the cost.
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naturalmom5




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 2:40 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks for your replies. I'm looking for advice how to slowly cut off contact between them. I don't need advice if I should do it.

I meant dysfunctional as they don't have manners and their behaviour is out of control and the mom thinks they're the perfect children

Strictly going ONLY by your post, I am scratching my head as to who doesn't have manners..
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amother




OP


Post  Wed, Jun 19 2019, 2:44 pm
Chayalle wrote:
Why is that manipulative? If the child thinks your child is his friend, it's normal to want to be together on a project.

If you don't want your child to be assigned to projects with this child, speak to the teacher.

My personal observation is that kids seek friends that make sense for them on an emotional, social, and behavioral level. They have something in common with this child that makes it work for them. When we interfere with the social process, we often end up with a child that does not know how to make healthy friendships.

OTOH if a child really is a negative influence (not just for perceived external reasons), we sometimes have to take steps to protect them. Just be sure the benefit is more than the cost.


This wasn't a workshop during school time it's for something outside the school hours and I would be only these 2 kids with other boys from other schools.
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