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Why do you want women in a Magazine
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Poll

Why do you want women in magazines
For inspirational reasons (Role Models)
 20%  [ 33 ]
I believe equal for men and women
 21%  [ 34 ]
Only little girls
 15%  [ 24 ]
It's not a halacha, I don't believe in Chumros
 42%  [ 68 ]
Total Votes : 159


shirasingsalot




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 26 2019, 3:51 pm
For those of you who want to see women in print, my favorite magazine, Nashim Magazine just announced that they are going to print!
[spam removed]
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Rubber Ducky




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Jun 26 2019, 11:26 pm
That's exciting news! More choices in frum women's reading is a good thing.

I have advertised in their online magazine a few times, and am getting advertising info for their print version now.
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amother




Blue


Post  Wed, Jun 26 2019, 11:58 pm
shirasingsalot wrote:
For those of you who want to see women in print, my favorite magazine, Nashim Magazine just announced that they are going to print! They opened up a campaign to help them. You can donate here: https://donate.thechesedfund.c.....e-to-print
I personally think this is a great cause.

You can see their amazing magazine at www.nashimmagazine.com. They just put out their summer issue and the cover is hilarious as usual!

Case in point. You see, according to my communities standards, bare legs are not tzenuah. So, although I understand that there are communities where it is allowed, I wouldn't consider this a perfectly tzanuah photo women. And so it begins. Who will determine what's considered tznuah? How will they make sure its acceptable for everyone? It's impossible to keep everyone satisfied.

I think it's great that Nashim is coming out in print. I believe we do need a variety of frum magazines to cater to the variety of frum communities/individuals out there. There can never be a one-size-fits-all standard. I wish more would follow.

Then we can have a magazine for those who prefer women, a different one for those who want only headshot, one with only Rebbetzins, one with only ugly women, and one with no women at all!
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urban gypsy




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 9:21 am
amother [ Blue ] wrote:
one with only ugly women


This is true progress! Maybe I will finally get my chance to realize my lifelong dream of being a cover girl! Lady
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Rubber Ducky




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 9:49 am
amother [ Blue ] wrote:
Case in point. You see, according to my communities standards, bare legs are not tzenuah. So, although I understand that there are communities where it is allowed, I wouldn't consider this a perfectly tzanuah photo women. And so it begins. Who will determine what's considered tznuah? How will they make sure its acceptable for everyone? It's impossible to keep everyone satisfied...

You're right. And trying to make a magazine with tzanua standards acceptable to everyone is a big part of why Mishpacha, Binah, and Ami et al don't print women's pictures. It's safer.
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cbsp




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 11:39 am
Rubber Ducky wrote:
You're right. And trying to make a magazine with tzanua standards acceptable to everyone is a big part of why Mishpacha, Binah, and Ami et al don't print women's pictures. It's safer.


Thank you for that acknowledgement.

And that is why I don't think the agenda is to erase women from our society. And that is why I don't understand the uproar.
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singleagain




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 11:43 am
cbsp wrote:
Thank you for that acknowledgement.

And that is why I don't think the agenda is to erase women from our society. And that is why I don't understand the uproar.


It might not be the agenda... But it's still a consequence. look at the accolades that certain movies/shows get when they include a certain type for the first time. It's very powerful for someone to see themselves properly represented. It made them feel seen and let's then know they aren't alone.

Feeling alone or unseen is incredibly painful
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amother




Puce


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 12:06 pm
Rubber Ducky wrote:
You're right. And trying to make a magazine with tzanua standards acceptable to everyone is a big part of why Mishpacha, Binah, and Ami et al don't print women's pictures. It's safer.

It's clearly not acceptable to everyone.
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little neshamala




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 12:16 pm
Rubber Ducky wrote:
You're right. And trying to make a magazine with tzanua standards acceptable to everyone is a big part of why Mishpacha, Binah, and Ami et al don't print women's pictures. It's safer.


But thats exactly why this whole issue is so upsetting.
I would have no problem at all with a magazine telling me they cant print a certain picture, because its not according to their predetermined tznius guidelines. Even if its waaaaay more censored than (in my opinion) it needs to be-if thats what that magazine's guidelines are, then that is what needs to be held to. But there is NO magazine whos Rabbanim hold that a womans face in real life is not tzanuah, or Rebbetzin Kanievsky or whatever. That simply would not be in their guidelines.

Like this, when they take their "safe zone" approach, they are basically establishing that their guidelines on tznius and what is acceptable to print include not allowing womens faces or a picture of Rebbetzin Kanievsky.
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soap suds




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 12:27 pm
little neshamala wrote:
But thats exactly why this whole issue is so upsetting.
I would have no problem at all with a magazine telling me they cant print a certain picture, because its not according to their predetermined tznius guidelines. Even if its waaaaay more censored than (in my opinion) it needs to be-if thats what that magazine's guidelines are, then that is what needs to be held to. But there is NO magazine whos Rabbanim hold that a womans face in real life is not tzanuah, or Rebbetzin Kanievsky or whatever. That simply would not be in their guidelines.

Like this, when they take their "safe zone" approach, they are basically establishing that their guidelines on tznius and what is acceptable to print include not allowing womens faces or a picture of Rebbetzin Kanievsky.

The bolded may be true for you, but I can see there being an uproar about that, too. Can't you just see it? "Oh, come on! It's just legs. Just because you have a chumra of covering your entire leg doesn't mean you get to push your chumra on me. There's no halacha that says a woman must cover her legs. It's a perverted form of yiddishkeit where women are oppressed and forced to cover up more and more. What's next? Burkas? Why must we cater to the most extreme people out there?"

Or if it's a neckline, elbow, less than a tefach of hair. It never ends. There will always be people complaining, no matter what they do. My assumption is that with the no woman policy, they are catering to the majority of their readership. IOW, it's a financial business decision.

As more magazines come out with different policies, people will be able to vote with their pocketbooks, and each one will cater to a different set of women.
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little neshamala




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 12:36 pm
soap suds wrote:
The bolded may be true for you, but I can see there being an uproar about that, too. Can't you just see it? "Oh, come on! It's just legs. Just because you have a chumra of covering your entire leg doesn't mean you get to push your chumra on me. There's no halacha that says a woman must cover her legs. It's a perverted form of yiddishkeit where women are oppressed and forced to cover up more and more. What's next? Burkas? Why must we cater to the most extreme people out there?"

Or if it's a neckline, elbow, less than a tefach of hair. It never ends. There will always be people complaining, no matter what they do. My assumption is that with the no woman policy, they are catering to the majority of their readership. IOW, it's a financial business decision.

As more magazines come out with different policies, people will be able to vote with their pocketbooks, and each one will cater to a different set of women.


There will always be people uproaring. Let them. But not about womens faces in magazines. If they're uproaring anyway, then change your guidelines to ones that make sense and arent so disturbing.

Completely erasing women makes NO sense, and sends a very mixed up message.
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soap suds




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 1:05 pm
little neshamala wrote:
There will always be people uproaring. Let them. But not about womens faces in magazines. If they're uproaring anyway, then change your guidelines to ones that make sense and arent so disturbing.

Completely erasing women makes NO sense, and sends a very mixed up message.

It all comes down to the dollar. Since people will be uproaring anyway, they'll always go with the policy that pleases the majority of readers. Seems like at this point, the no woman policy wins over they yes woman policy - at least for Mishpacha, Ami, Bina readership.
The only way to really resolve this is by having a variety of magazines, with each one catering to different groups. Then people will buy the ones they like, boycott the ones they don't, and there'll be peace in the world. Angel
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sarahiam




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 1:11 pm
this may seem unrelated but hear me out. did anyone here watch the show Shtiesel? I did. growing up (family wasnt frum) we has TV but the only show which was jewish in some very little way was seinfeld, and anyway we werent allowed to watch it so I watched typical kids shows. now I dont watch a lot but when I saw shtiesel I was so drawn in and connected with it so much because these were people that looked and sounded like me being represented on a show I could relate to a thousand times more deeply than anything else. now im not chsddish, and dont speak yiddish, but the same 'kinds' of issues they deal with I deal with and it meant a lot to have a show where that was normal. for me women in magazines is the same thing. I dont know if id call it role models but id like to read amagazine where women like me are normal, where pictures arent there for men to look at but for me to see people who look like me who accomplisehd great things, or are good leaders, etc ect NOT focusing on the fact that they are women, or even frum women, just done in a context where that is accepted as normal, where it wouldnt elicit a cmment that oh look shes wearing a tiche or not where the focus was on what they did not what they look like, would make me feel more normal reading such a magazine that either a) a magazine where women are not dressed like me or b) a magazine in which women are not there at all.
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soap suds




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 1:18 pm
sarahiam wrote:
this may seem unrelated but hear me out. did anyone here watch the show Shtiesel? I did. growing up (family wasnt frum) we has TV but the only show which was jewish in some very little way was seinfeld, and anyway we werent allowed to watch it so I watched typical kids shows. now I dont watch a lot but when I saw shtiesel I was so drawn in and connected with it so much because these were people that looked and sounded like me being represented on a show I could relate to a thousand times more deeply than anything else. now im not chsddish, and dont speak yiddish, but the same 'kinds' of issues they deal with I deal with and it meant a lot to have a show where that was normal. for me women in magazines is the same thing. I dont know if id call it role models but id like to read amagazine where women like me are normal, where pictures arent there for men to look at but for me to see people who look like me who accomplisehd great things, or are good leaders, etc ect NOT focusing on the fact that they are women, or even frum women, just done in a context where that is accepted as normal, where it wouldnt elicit a cmment that oh look shes wearing a tiche or not where the focus was on what they did not what they look like, would make me feel more normal reading such a magazine that either a) a magazine where women are not dressed like me or b) a magazine in which women are not there at all.

I hear you. But the magazine does write about "women like me". I do fee represented in print. I don't see how a head-shot would make much of a difference.

For me personally, as a chassidish woman, I think that if there would be pictures, it won't be of women who look like me. So, in a way, it may cause more of a disconnect for me personally.
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sarahiam




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 1:28 pm
soap suds wrote:
I hear you. But the magazine does write about "women like me". I do fee represented in print. I don't see how a head-shot would make much of a difference.

For me personally, as a chassidish woman, I think that if there would be pictures, it won't be of women who look like me. So, in a way, it may cause more of a disconnect for me personally.


I understand what youre saying. I guess what im trying to say is in general esp sicne family wasnt frum growing up I often in public am very conscious that I dont look 'normal' (for what its worth I think I dress fine just long skirts and sleeves in summer isnt 'normal) and seeing pictures as part of the story of people who look more or less like me would make me feel at home in the magazine, same as I feel that way in israel even though people dont all look like me its much more of a norm and not made into a THING
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Simple1




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Jun 27 2019, 1:40 pm
soap suds wrote:
The bolded may be true for you, but I can see there being an uproar about that, too. Can't you just see it? "Oh, come on! It's just legs. Just because you have a chumra of covering your entire leg doesn't mean you get to push your chumra on me. There's no halacha that says a woman must cover her legs. It's a perverted form of yiddishkeit where women are oppressed and forced to cover up more and more. What's next? Burkas? Why must we cater to the most extreme people out there?"

Or if it's a neckline, elbow, less than a tefach of hair. It never ends. There will always be people complaining, no matter what they do. My assumption is that with the no woman policy, they are catering to the majority of their readership. IOW, it's a financial business decision.

As more magazines come out with different policies, people will be able to vote with their pocketbooks, and each one will cater to a different set of women.


There wouldn't be any uproar in that direction because the readers are not sitting in the magazine's office where the decisions are being made. They would only see the end result, a magazine that includes tznius pictures of women.
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