Should we stop keeping pets?

amother

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 2:29 pm

This article is a couple of years old, but I just saw it online. Discuss.

(Full disclosure: I am not a pet owner, and I am not an animal-lover in general. That's why I'm remaining anonymous here, because that's an unpopular point of view.)

https://www.theguardian.com/li.....y-yes

Fox

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 2:38 pm

The most interesting part, I thought, was the last paragraph about how attitudes toward animals/pets change.

My grandparents' generation related to animals through their food value or for their work. Dogs were for guarding and herding; cats were for deterring rodents. Other animals were raised to eat.

My parents' generation enjoyed companion animals, but certainly not with the fervor we see today.

To a large degree, it reflects the need people have to have nearby family. The secular world has promoted the glamour of single life for several generations, neatly brushing off the loneliness that often accompanies it. Thus we get "fur babies" and people describing themselves as "cat mom" or "dog dad."

urban gypsy

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 2:43 pm

This made me think of the lady who wrote in her will that her dearly beloved pet dog must be euthanized and buried along with her when she dies because she believed nobody was capable of caring for the dog to her exacting standards Sad

Rappel

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 2:45 pm

You're begging the question.

This while article is based on the premise that we love and highly value our pets. I grew up with animals, enjoy their company, and have two cats of my own, but they are never anything but animals. The Rambam in Shmoneh Perakim is very clear on that. So since my animals are with me for my enjoyment and communal benefit, I see no logical reason to stop having pets.

sushilover

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 3:34 pm

Totally off topic, but I was struck by the line "dogs are people too" because I have to be so careful when discussing abortions not to say person/people because it's so controversial these days.
It's strange how the same people who view some animals as people (based on cognitive function and emotional capacity)often refuse to see unborn humans as people.

naturalmom5

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 4:07 pm

sushilover wrote:

Thats the meaning of the posuk..

"Ha Nosheik Celev, Shofaic Adom"

Many top SS officials were big animal lovers while they were overseeing the murder of thousands of Jews..

ectomorph

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 4:20 pm

naturalmom5 wrote:

Thats the meaning of the posuk..

"Ha Nosheik Celev, Shofaic Adom"

Many top SS officials were big animal lovers while they were overseeing the murder of thousands of Jews..

Yup. I get very nervous about this when I see people who are into their pets.

amother

Seagreen

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 4:23 pm

naturalmom5 wrote:

Many top SS officials were big animal lovers while they were overseeing the murder of thousands of Jews..

They showed affection to animals on purpose in order to dehumanize the Jews. They didn't actually love the animals.

imasoftov

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 4:47 pm

naturalmom5 wrote:

Thats the meaning of the posuk..

"Ha Nosheik Celev, Shofaic Adom"

My comment is only about what Tanach says and might mean. Those words are not what any pasuk says. Probably what you remembered is Hoshea 13:2, זֹבְחֵ֣י אָדָ֔ם עֲגָלִ֖ים יִשָּׁקֽוּן (those who slaughter men kiss calves" and while I have heard a drash using that to refer to people who value animals more than people, a drash is not "the meaning of the pasuk". The calves in the verse could be the two Golden Calves of Yerovam and it could either be about human sacrifice to them, or murderers who worshiped the idols.

amother

Beige

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 4:50 pm

amother [ Seagreen ] wrote:

They showed affection to animals on purpose in order to dehumanize the Jews. They didn't actually love the animals.

I don't know that that's true.

I once heard a chilling story:

During one of the death marches, a Jewish man felt that he couldn't go on any more. He begged for a minute to rest. They told him he could have one minute, and then he had to continue the march.

He ended up finding a small hut in the forest they were marching through, and he hid inside. The Nazi who gave him a minute to rest came looking for him. He was going to check the hut, but a large dog had parked itself outside the door.

The Nazi raised his gun, about to shoot the dog to go check the hut, but another Nazi stopped him.

"Don't hurt the dog! What did he ever do to you?"

"You're right," said the first Nazi, so he lowered his gun and gave up his search.

This story just makes me Can't Believe It

amother

Seagreen

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 5:00 pm

The Nazis had that attitude toward inanimate objects as well, e.g, they would shoot multiple people with one bullet so as "not to waste a bullet". They wanted to emphasize how little they valued human life.

FranticFrummie

Thu, Jul 25 2019, 11:11 pm

I am a lifelong dog lover, but my policy has always been "People before pets." As soon as I have someone over for the first time, the very first thing I ask them is "Should I put the dogs outside?" and "Are you sure?" I would never choose an animal's comfort over a human being's. IMHO, that's where people get confused, and start calling their pets "their babies".

Your pet will never think like a human. If you are going to be a responsible pet owner, you have to educate yourself to think like your pet. Otherwise you will have no idea about pack behavior, bonding, appropriate toys, and a bunch of other things that are crucial to their mental health. Parrots can literally go insane if not treated well.

Pets do us a good service, even if we don't live on a farm. If a person has a heart attack, having a pet at home improves their chances of survival by 50%. People with pets tend to live 10 to 15 years longer, and in better overall health, than non pet owners. Pet ownership also greatly reduces the risk of suicide.

When done properly, you can have a harmonious symbiotic relationship with your pets. When done wrong, it can be inhumane, and possibly even dangerous. (Mentally sound dogs do not bite for no reason.)

FranticFrummie

Fri, Jul 26 2019, 12:18 am

Rappel wrote:

Agreed with FF. Cats also catch snakes and bugs, which is darn useful.

My cat is blind, but she is amazing at catching flies. I don't have any screens in my windows, and once a fly comes in, it doesn't stand a chance.

When she was a kitten, she would bring me half dead flies, and line them up on the bed next to me. She wanted me to learn how to hunt! Eventually she realized that I was a lost cause, and now she just kills them and puts them in a corner. Confused