Interesting Discussion, Generations..

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:02 am

I find it quite often that I look at people in awe sometimes of their manners..

Sometimes I just truly don’t understand how they don’t see that they’re being rude, or coming off as bossy, or coming off as controlling, or coming across inconsiderate...
I bite my tongue and never say anything.
If I was the receiving hand of the behavior I would politely address it, if I could, if it mattered that much, and if it was a relationship I needed to maintain.
Some people I realize it’s best to not say anything if I’m rarely around them and I just brush it off- which happens to be most of the time this happens.

My Q is
Does anyone else notice this with this generation?
Is it a generational thing? Women of the generation above me- did you feel this way with acquaintances and friends 90% of the time?

Does anyone have theories of what maybe causes the newer generations to be so socially unaware of their behaviors?

Please be respectful!
I’m just so curious.. it irks me.

Last edited by amother on Wed, Nov 04 2020, 1:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

naturalmom5

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:12 am

You don't say where you live or your level of observance

In Lakewood I find that

A... It's s millennial thing
It's sort of hip to be rude and brash
My son said Trump is his generation's Reagan

B... Among yeshivish and CHASIDISH
People you cant stress everything
There is such an emphasis on tznius and frum shtick that manners and polish falls by the wayside

little neshamala

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:17 am

Im not really sure what it is exactly, but I do know I was very taken aback at my friends' reactions when we were all together for a shabbos, and they saw my emphasis on prompting my kids to say "yes please" and "no thank you" when asked if they want juice.

They straight out said "oh gosh, thats too much for me, im happy if they say thank you after they get juice" "totally not something I care about" "I dont think it's important for them to speak that way, thats a lot"

I was raised in a home with very old school manners, so maybe that's why im raising my kids along those lines...but I was really surprised at how they acknowledged they didnt feel it was important. I still get very taken aback when I ask a grown child if they'd like a piece of cake and they just say "yeah" or "no"

Last edited by little neshamala on Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:18 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:18 am

naturalmom5 wrote:

Ok
Not Yeshivish, not chassish
I’m not referring to Brooklyn / NY attitude

Big community, but out of town.
People are here from all over. And the crowd I mesh with is Orthodox, but more relaxed.
During a meal men and women can converse and no one feels uncomfortable. However, the men usually stick with men talk, and women usually to the women.

Last edited by amother on Wed, Nov 04 2020, 1:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

OutATowner

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:20 am

This is not exclusive to any Jewish community or Jews altogether. Society at large has lost basic respect and manners. When 8 year olds post you tube videos bashing their friends and teachers, when kids think they are smarter tha adults, when everyone feels entitled and the fine art of patience is lost to an era of instant gratification...I could go on.
Really, it is very sad all around. I'm not saying it's exclusive to one group, I'm saying it's unfortunately pervasive everywhere. We as individuals and parents need to do our best to rise above it.

DrMom

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:20 am

little neshamala wrote:

If saying "please" and "thank you" is old-school, then I guess that is what I am too.

Just out of curiosity: Does your friend neglect to say please/thank you, or is it just her kids who behave this way?

OutATowner

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:21 am

little neshamala wrote:

Yes! I have encountered the same thing! I would rather be "extreme" in some people's eyes than have my kids fall to lower standards.

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:22 am

little neshamala wrote:

I’m not even just referring to please and thank yous, or how they raise their kids. Though that’s a very valid point and wow.. I’m surprised thos friends you’re referring to feel it’s “too much” for their kids.

I was personally referring more along the lines of adults inviting themselves over for a shabbos meal, in mid conversation will tune out and ignore the other person, talking on behalf of another person in front of them as if they can’t speak for themselves. And muchhhh more that irks me so badly to watch.

Last edited by amother on Wed, Nov 04 2020, 1:12 pm; edited 1 time in total

little neshamala

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:23 am

DrMom wrote:

It wasnt please and thank you-that they acknowledged was important.

But they felt that teaching a child to say "yes please" and "no thank you" when offered something, was overkill

And it was 5 friends who all agreed with each other! They were joking and teasing me good naturedly like "oh little neshamala is so cute, shes going to raise these quaint little children in pinnafores who are seen and not heard" (so not lol)

little neshamala

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:25 am

rosezee wrote:

Clarifying again-they do emohasize please and thank you. But "yes please" and "no thank you" when offered something is "really not ao important"

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:26 am

little neshamala wrote:

Clarifying again-they do emohasize please and thank you. But "yes please" and "no thank you" when offered something is "really not ao important"

Yes I get what you mean.
Do you find these adults lack manners too?

Last edited by amother on Wed, Nov 04 2020, 1:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

tichellady

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:30 am

I find my parents and grandparents generation much ruder than mine. No one my age has ever asked me about my fertility or family planning or commented to my face about how large I carry when pregnant ( not that it’s the point but I wasn’t large at all, I was a normal looking pregnant lady) and I have gotten lots and lots of those comments from people from the previous generation

little neshamala

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:32 am

rosezee wrote:

Yes I get what you mean.
Do you find these adults lack manners too?

These adults specifically, not really. Thats whats funny. Theyre terrific people, my good friends, great midos, always jumping in to awkward conversations to rescue someone if they're embarassed, in other words, very socially aware and sweet people.
Theyre very careful about making sure their kids share, and treat each other nicely etc.

But they dont seem to care about "manners" per se when it comes to their kids. Its like midos over manners, if that makes sense. Which is fine when youre 4 or 5, but when youre raised like that and turn 20, it comes across as rude, no matter how much midos tovos you have.

little neshamala

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:33 am

tichellady wrote:

Ha. Youre right.
Its almost like they dont consider it rude to inquire about someones private life.

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:34 am

tichellady wrote:

People ask who are unrelated to you even?
Not that relatives are ok saying those things but I personally get comments from my own relatives like that.. idk why anyone thinks those are normal Qs to ask! 😡

Last edited by amother on Wed, Nov 04 2020, 1:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Ivory

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:34 am

I think it's absolutely a generational thing.
Another small example is that I grew up calling all my aunts and uncles with the title "Aunt" or "Uncle" before their name. My nieces and nephews call me by just my first name (so do their parents when referring to me) and it really bothers me.
There are very few boundaries of respect in place in society today. Kids and teens see themselves as peers with those older than them, rather than revering them just based on age.

And I also believe technology has almost completely done away with normal polite conversational skills. I cringe when I hear my sister and her friends call the pizza shop to order and they're like, I want a pizza and fries - and hang up. What happened to "hello", "please", "thank you", and "goodbye". These words are just not part of their everyday vocabulary anymore.

Rappel

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:35 am

rosezee wrote:

That sounds awful.

amother

Fuchsia

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:36 am

tichellady wrote:

We're so "PC" now that we're trained not to ask anything personal, or make any personal comments. Its a new way of being.

I remember being warned that people would want to touch my pregnant belly. Nobody did. I actually asked friends to feel. I wanted the connection.

I do think that social media has changed us a lot.

amother

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 10:48 am

Rappel wrote:

That sounds awful.

It’s so awful!

I find myself so badly wanting to correct the behavior but I hold back most of the time bc why should I say anything..?
I just get so irritated by people’s lack of manners!

Last edited by amother on Wed, Nov 04 2020, 1:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

Zehava

Thu, Aug 01 2019, 11:01 am

amother [ Fuchsia ] wrote:

That’s a really good thing! And there will always be those oblivious ones who will continue making stupid comments at shiva houses and ask intrusive questions. But we as a society have become more sensitive and aware. And that is way more important than arbitrary “manners”.