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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 11:27 am
amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:
OP, the source is kibbid av v'eim, plain and simple. Maybe you're just not expressing yourself correctly or leaving out many details, but you do come acroos as a bit entitled. You're complaining about normal things kids should be doing for parents like opening up their home for them or picking them up from the airport. It's basic respect.
Amother powderblue, there's nothing wrong with parents expecting their kids to bend over backwards for them. We should want to do so without being asked.


Definitely because the details are too long to write and I can’t find a way to sum it up.
But no, I am not at all entitled. My parents are emotionally abusive and manipulative, and display love in what some think isn’t really love. But it is, It’s just their way.
I have been constantly overwhelmed by them my whole life and finally am learning my emotional well being is far more important than pleasing my parents.
The key word here is pleasing.
Not respect.
I am absolutely respectful and display K.A.V to them. You need to realize though, that it’s not black and white and that in specific situations some things that would apply in healthy relationships or may work for some, don’t apply or work for others. So it’s not plain and simple. Halacha never is plain and simple.
I find your comments critical and you write them so confidently with little regard to how you come across.
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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 11:36 am
flowerpower wrote:
Kudos for you for standing up for yourself! How did she take it?


She understood and then topped it off with “so bummed. I’ll have to find somewhere else to vacation.”
Not an inkling of disappointment to not see the grandchildren, me, or DH..
Stung. But helped me to appreciate my decision even more.
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amother




Apricot


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 11:46 am
OP sounds like ur mom is a lot to deal with. Pls disregard people who aren't sympathetic. I started a vent a few days ago I felt worse after because of "whats the big deal" type comments. If im venting clearly its a big deal for me...
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amother




Amber


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:38 pm
I think some posters are being very unfair to OP.
Whoever is so happy that their mother has a simcha or some other excuse to visit, and is happy to make their home a hotel.... I suspect that your mother is also spending quality time with you and your kids and taking an interest. If you were being made to feel like nothing more than a convenient inn keeper, and that your mother wasn't particularly interested in spending time with you and taking an interest in your children, you might not be so excited for the kibbud opportunity.
The fact is, that if this is stressing OP out and making her feel bad, it surely has an effect on her physical and mental health and affects her own family negatively and therefore she has zero obligation to put herself out in this way.
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amother




Lavender


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:50 pm
OP I think I understand where you are coming from.

My MIL rarely visits us. I used to schlep 3 little ones to visit her when she was in town and she used to ignore us all and be busy in the kitchen helping her daughter. She would visit 2 of her children. Never us. My husband always excused her behavior. The only time she came over was when she cleaned out her home and wanted us to take some of my husband's old stuff and all the other accumulated junk in her house that she decided we would "benefit" from. After 3 kids, I finally said enough. If its so important, she can come. She is mobile and I am friggin' exhausted. She never came, when we call to invite she always has other plans - shopping, eating out with others. It stopped hurting after a while. You can't make someone love you. Hardest of all was watching my husband come to terms with reality. I couldn't pretend for him anymore. It still hurts when my daughter asks how come Bobby doesn't love us? Why does she always go to the other houses and not us? I never know what to say.

It hurts when people don't want a relationship with our families.
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ra_mom




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 3:42 pm
amother [ Maroon ] wrote:
I agree. My parents live 8 hours away. Whenever they have a wedding here they come and stay by us and we love that they have an excuse to come!

I don't suppose you take off a week from work a few times a year so that you can drive your parents around while they visit your town for shopping purposes.

If OP can't take off multiple times to take her mom shopping, and her mom won't take I'm sorry I'm working for an answer, then it's ok for her to tell her mom she can't come this time.

OP, I validate you!
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allthingsblue




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:23 pm
amother [ Maroon ] wrote:
I agree. My parents live 8 hours away. Whenever they have a wedding here they come and stay by us and we love that they have an excuse to come!


But you don't have to take off work and lend your car to them...
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amother




Scarlet


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:48 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
When my mother wants to visit us, she always forms it around a convenient time for an event. For example, there’s a friends wedding where I live, or she needs to go shopping at the stores which are by me. I live in a large community, she lives in a very small and one with not much going on.
I don’t mind that if she’s here, she can go to a store.
However, I work, I need my car, she’ll come to visit us to be able to shop- and then visiting us is the plus to her shopping trip- or event she’s attending.
We are her hotel stay it feels.
She makes this so obvious in how she invites herself, & how she phrases the question of if she can visit, but she has no clue how obvious she is. And how hurtful it is! To me my DH and I feel bad for my children...
I get so irritated by it. Everything revolves around her!
She never visits to spend time. I take off work to spend time with her- and she wants to shop.
She wants to take my car, and do what she wants to do.
This time I said no. I told her she can’t come and I made up some excuse- not telling her I feel this way. She’s so narcissistic I can’t tell her, she will guilt trip me and make herself the victim I’m this and I’m not interested in going there and being misunderstood..

I am proud of myself for saying no. Finally. For the first time.
But I hate that she is this way.


I’m not understanding why you don’t far’gin her, even if she is coming for some convenience or some need of hers. She’s your mother. I’m sure she does enjoy seeing all of you at the same time. So what’s wrong with her wanting to do what she wants to for herself too? I think this is probably not really what’s at the core of what bothers you about her. I think it’s much deeper stuff that way pre-dates her supposedly selfish reasons for coming.
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amother




Scarlet


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:49 pm
amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:
OP, maybe you're not expressing yourself right, but I don't see anything majorly wrong with your mother's behavior. It's normal to schedule visits to a different city when you're anyways being there.
We live in a different city than my parents and they never come visit and I don't expect them to come visit just because. When they have a simcha in town, they stop by. We kids are supposed to make the trip to visit our parents, not the other way around. She's your mom, you should be her hotel!


Yes I agree and that’s why I think she has some earlier unresolved issues with her mom and that’s why this issue is bothering her more than it should
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cbsp




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 6:47 pm
OP, I think I understand and can commiserate.

For those who don't :

If the extent of the relationship with her mom is that OP and her family are ALWAYS secondary to whatever is bringing her mother in then yeah, she's being used as a hotel and free car service.

It sounds like mom NEVER goes to OP unless there's another reason.
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amother




Rose


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 7:16 pm
OP, I hear you, validate and commiserate. Im in the same boat with extremely narcissistic parents. It's taken me time to learn that word and place it on them and know that they aren't healthy people and Im not the one who is crazy here, because that's likely how your mom is making you feel.

So no, you are not crazy, and kudos for expressing your needs. She reacted by being narcissistic, because that is who she is. It has nothing to do with you.

You can carry on with your life and please don't feel bad you are doing the right thing for yourself and your kids. Posters who are saying that you should bend over backwards, well it sounds like you bent so far over that your back broke (like mine - not in the literal sense of course), and now you are just seeing how you can manage things to not get hurt.

That's the way to go! It's not an issue of kibbud av v'eim here - I clarified that with a Rov, its an issue of venishmartem meod!

Good luck and don't let your mom bring you down!
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amother




Lawngreen


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:13 pm
cbsp, OP doesn't think it's important that SHE go visit her parents, but is mad that her parents only come visit when they anyways need to be in town. It's a 2 way street.
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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:28 pm
amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:
cbsp, OP doesn't think it's important that SHE go visit her parents, but is mad that her parents only come visit when they anyways need to be in town. It's a 2 way street.



Where did I mention that I don’t think it’s important to visit my parents?
I didn’t even bring up how often I visit them or my thoughts on it.. that’s another thread in itself.
I do visit them, despite other issues I am faced with doing so.
But anyways Lawngreen it’s been lovely hearing you. Have a good day.
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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:31 pm
allthingsblue wrote:
But you don't have to take off work and lend your car to them...


And then I’m left being told how ungrateful I am, how rude I am, they traveled all this way blah blah blah
All sorts of confusing statements, which really are irrelevant to the actual situation. I have put myself in uncomfortable situations just to avoid the abuse that comes along with me expressing my feelings or making boundaries they don’t like.
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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:34 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Where did I mention that I don’t think it’s important to visit my parents?
I didn’t even bring up how often I visit them or my thoughts on it.. that’s another thread in itself.
I do visit them, despite other issues I am faced with doing so.
But anyways Lawngreen it’s been lovely hearing you. Have a good day.


Oh and ps Lawngreen, bullying people isn’t cute. It’s 2019.
Grow up, or grow old. Your choice.
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amother




Lawngreen


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:45 pm
OP, when I mentioned that kids should visit parents and not the other way around, you wanted to know a source for that. When I said kids need to bend over backwards for their parents, you said that no, we don't. Seems like both your parents and yourself are stubborn in your ways and both need to work on that.
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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:48 pm
amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:
OP, when I mentioned that kids should visit parents and not the other way around, you wanted to know a source for that. When I said kids need to bend over backwards for their parents, you said that no, we don't. Seems like both your parents and yourself are stubborn in your ways and both need to work on that.


Seems like you hear only what you want to, just to pick a fight.

What I said was- healthy relationships are mutual. Parents and children should visit each other. The responsibility is not solely on the child only.
Never did I say that I don’t visit my parents, or think I shouldn’t. You’re responses are just so brazen and extreme.

I said no one needs to put their emotional needs at the bottom of a priority list.

That’s what was said.
How you too it is your own problem.

No I’m stubborn I just don’t appreciate your personality and how you are so quick to attack.

Shame on you, honestly.
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amother




OP


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 8:50 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Seems like you hear only what you want to, just to pick a fight.

What I said was- healthy relationships are mutual. Parents and children should visit each other. The responsibility is not solely on the child only.
Never did I say that I don’t visit my parents, or think I shouldn’t. You’re responses are just so brazen and extreme.

I said no one needs to put their emotional needs at the bottom of a priority list.

That’s what was said.
How you too it is your own problem.

No I’m stubborn I just don’t appreciate your personality and how you are so quick to attack.

Shame on you, honestly.



And with that I’m leaving this thread.
Thank you everyone who was respectful and helpful.
I hope everyone can learn from your example.
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amother




Teal


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 9:50 pm
oh my god Imamother has come through with the negativity and bullying again.

OP - you've written that it's an unhealthy dynamic in general, besides for the visiting issue. You've written she takes your car and your valuable time with no regard for what works with you and your schedule.

Readers - READ BETWEEN THE LINES. This isn't just about the visit, or the not visit, or whatever.

It's about a stressful situation that seemingly keeps coming up again and again and OP is burnt out and resentful, and maybe even heartbroken over never having a normal relationship with her mom. Emotionally exhausted and depleted with little to no family support.

OP I get you. Hugs and more hugs. I hope you learn to stand up for yourself at one point, which it seems you might have already, just lose the guilt. If it helps, talk to a rav or mentor about this. not anonymous people online. Imamother has me shaking my head sometimes.

I have one more thought on this, and that is - where is your husband in all this?


ETA I just noticed your last post. I will leave this up here anyway.
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aliavi




 
 
 


Post  Tue, Aug 06 2019, 10:55 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Nobody in this world needs to put their own emotional needs at the bottom of a priority list.

I wouldn’t treat my children the way my mother has me. There is much more that’s wrong in our relationship and it is by definition a dysfunctional one. I am the emotionally healthy one, and I get drained from her need to be the center of attention constantly.
So her visits have become hard for me, especially when they aren’t to spend quality time with my children, DH, and I.


Is your mother emotionally capable of spending the quality time you envision? Has this happened before? Are your expectations realistic? Please consider you can only change your behaviors and thought processes. I’m sorry you are disappointed.
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