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S/o kids and tuition- what careers should we encourage?



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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:06 pm
mig100 wrote:
op what exactly is bothering you and what are you trying to suggest? I can think of 2 things

1) high school grads being encouraged to spend time and energy pursuing a well -paying career

2) people not having "too many" kids

I think your op is focusing on #2. if you would focus on #1 I think it would make a more interesting discussion and you would get less attacks.


Let's spin off and discuss mig100's #1 listed scenario.

I'm not going to ask the questions on my mind. I'm sure they'll come up here. Just throwing it out there.
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sidewalkchalk




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:13 pm
Plumbers make a lot of money relative to the amount of schooling time and tuition.
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essie14




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:15 pm
In Israel, the highest paying field is high tech.
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giselle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:15 pm
A career that is both somewhat lucrative and that they'll enjoy. It would be dreadful to have to go to work each day feeling miserable.
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amother
Burgundy


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:27 pm
This question has too many factors...

What they are interested in
If husband will be working
If they needs quick schooling, are supported before they have a degree, or if they don't mind waiting a few years before dating
If they want a flexible schedule
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amother
Forestgreen


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:32 pm
I don't think it makes sense to encourage a small number of specific careers. Rather, I would encourage a certain approach, including but not limited to:

1. Obtain the strongest possible knowledge base (accounting for individual abilities) in mathematics and writing in grades K-12. The latter will require a lot of reading and writing.

2. Whatever field the child is interested in, consider which credentials and training are most widely recognized and offer the most opportunities in the future for promotion or growth without total retraining.

3. Consider other income opportunities that are adjacent to the job that you plan to formally hold. For example, a teacher might also do tutoring, standardized test prep, write or publish or edit test prep products, design curriculum, conduct corporate training, etc.

4. Take advantage of networking opportunities outside the frum and Jewish communities and build relationships outside these communities. This may be tricky to navigate for those who try to be more insular, but that's what your LOR is for, to answer the tricky questions.

5. Think about jobs not just as base salary and work-life balance, but also in terms of how they get you to the next step of your career. Don't stay in one place just because change is scary. For example, a friend of mine has her bachelor's in a field considered "easy" and known for lower earnings. She worked as an office manager in a small company, took on finance responsibilities in the company, and transitioned to a full time finance role in the company. She then used that experience to jump to a finance role in a much larger company with only slightly higher pay, but with generous tuition reimbursement and shorter hours. She now is getting a free graduate degree to complement and legitimize her finance experience (at night), and will be much better poised for promotion and advancement in a couple of years without any loans.

6. Learn from more experienced mentors the unwritten rules about how to push for advancement, negotiate salary, and navigate workplace politics and dynamics. At least one mentor should be in your workplace.

To sum it up, I think there needs to be a shift from viewing oneself as having a job to thinking of it as building a career. Doesn't matter what the field. My friend's mom (not Jewish) came to the US with nothing and worked in daycare. She still works in daycare, except now she has a bachelor's, a master's, and owns two daycares, as well as a rental property.

I don't think both spouses have to advance their careers to the maximum possible. But they should still think of themselves as building a career, even if there are pauses and detours along the way.
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keym




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 1:58 pm
Heres my take.
I want my kids teachers, and rebbis and babysitters and playgroup morahs and our nuses and social workers to be passionate and enthusiastic with what they are doing.
Why would anyone choose to be a teacher or Rebbi or Rabbi knowing they will have to sacrifice by having fewer children, or enter into a mismatched marriage just so their spouse can be an engineer, or stay in a horrible marriage just because their spouse brings in the kosher bacon.
The day we make rules that people in "caring professions" who by reality make less money, are not eligible for scholarships and assistance and force them to limit their family size, is the day we will have cold, unpassionate uncaring teachers and nurses.

With that said, I believe we should encourage everyone to improve their knowledge and skill set-higher education, workshops, etc.
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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 3:53 pm
Just as an FYI and I don’t care how much flak I receive cuz it’s totally true- the ppl who open their own business end up being the real rich ones.... so at the end of the day- while hishtadlus is important- let’s keep in mind no matter what degree or education you take that everything is up to Hashem and the most important thing you can do is pray.
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amother
Denim


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:18 pm
Reading this sight. I think the best career to encourage for our DD is as a Sx Therapist. They make almost $200 an hour and are needed by everyone!!!!
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amother
Papaya


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:25 pm
Perhaps instead of encouraging specific careers, we should encourage those who are successful to reach out to young people entering those careers to offer them support and mentorship.

That way instead of expecting everyone to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, those who are already at the goal can help out the others to get there too.
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amother
Mauve


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:32 pm
amother [ Denim ] wrote:
Reading this sight. I think the best career to encourage for our DD is as a Sx Therapist. They make almost $200 an hour and are needed by everyone!!!!

Well....only everyone on imamother! LOL
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amother
Denim


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 4:36 pm
amother [ Mauve ] wrote:
Well....only everyone on imamother! LOL


Is Imamother not a perfect sampling of the frum world?
Is not everyone on Imamother?
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amother
Plum


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 7:31 pm
amother [ Pumpkin ] wrote:
Just as an FYI and I don’t care how much flak I receive cuz it’s totally true- the ppl who open their own business end up being the real rich ones.... so at the end of the day- while hishtadlus is important- let’s keep in mind no matter what degree or education you take that everything is up to Hashem and the most important thing you can do is pray.


It depends what type of business.

Blue collar not so much (maybe it’s different in the city). There’s much less schooling though. Blue collar businesses don’t have the growth rate, especially in passive income, as white collar businesses.
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ectomorph




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 7:40 pm
I will encourage my kids to work as HVAC workers and sanitation department and police department employees. Amazing benefits and lots of spare time.
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amother
Yellow


 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 9:06 pm
Forestgreen really nails it, in terms of general thinking about careers advice, I don't think there's anything to add. What I do want to say is that regarding tuition, OP is asking the wrong question. If we're at the point where we're telling everyone to make career decisions based on what's most remunerative, then the community model is what needs to change. The answer to the tuition crisis is not for every Orthodox Jew to become a doctor, lawyer, or investment banker. The answer is we have to better support community institutions so that NOT everybody has to be a doctor, lawyer, or investment banker. For one thing, it is mathematically impossible for the entire community (or even the majority) to earn top 10% levels of income. For another, we NEED some people in our community to become social workers and teachers and religious workers and nonprofit workers etc. We need to have a community set up that supports a normal income distribution, not to shame everyone who doesn't earn $200k a year.
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Laiya




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Aug 06 2019, 9:13 pm
ectomorph wrote:
I will encourage my kids to work as HVAC workers and sanitation department and police department employees. Amazing benefits and lots of spare time.


Lots of stress though
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mig100




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 07 2019, 12:07 am
amother [ Yellow ] wrote:
The answer to the tuition crisis is not for every Orthodox Jew to become a doctor, lawyer, or investment banker.


this really is NOT what I meant at all in my post- I wrote I quickly - had I realized it would become a spinoff id probably have worded it very differently and more carefully.

I am still honored that my post became its own thread! thanks op

I was curious to see how others would respond and understand it

one thing I can learn from the responses and the lack thereof - is this.

imas are way quicker to bash, blame, judge and scream then to actually come up with any proactive productive solutions.

judging OTHERS life decisions is lots of fun - I guess!
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amother
Tangerine


 

Post Wed, Aug 07 2019, 1:37 am
We should encourage mass aliyah. In Israel, housing is expensive, but no one is stressing over the high cost of Jewish education. There are some schools that charge more, but you have options.

The question is how much you are really willing to sacrifice to educate your children.

(And no, I'm not saying that life here is perfect, or that schools are perfect, but that's true everywhere.)
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