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Who won the Israeli election??
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SacN




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Sep 20 2019, 7:40 am
Quote:

Thirty years ago secular Jewish Americans weren't nearly as hostile to frum people as secular Israeli's were. The reason IMHO was because secular Jewish Americans had no frum people on thier backs trying to dictate their lifestyles and screaming at them for driving on Shabbos etc.


American Jews weren't founded as a community on principles of secular zionism, which grew long before the political battle for seats in knesset.

And look where they are today. Half of them aren't Jewish, and it's said that we have a quiet holocaust on our hands.

No one (that I've met) loves the Rabbanut. But could it possibly be said that it's kept Israelis Jewish? That the religious parties have kept the state (land) in Israeli hands? That the gadlus that's grown in torat Eretz Yisrael in the last 30 years would have been funded without religious government institutions?
I think it could be.

Rather than saying live and let live, realize the painful place that American Jewery as a whole has fallen to, and why the religious public in Israel has to stand up and remind the world that we're Jewish and that stands for something (other than humanitarian tikun olam). Do we do it perfectly? Of course not. Do we even know we're doing it right? No.
But we have to keep doing it.
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seeker




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Sep 20 2019, 10:00 am
Are most places this complicated? I keep trying but I can't seem to understand any of it. USA govt is plenty messed up but somehow it's still easier to keep track of. Who made up the rules for these games and what were they thinking?
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Cmon be nice




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Sep 20 2019, 10:22 am
It used to be in israel they had the status quo with both the draft (lets not argue that here) and shabos. Bus since that has become a fight, everything now is us vs them, unfortunately
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byisrael




 
 
 


Post  Sat, Sep 21 2019, 2:51 pm
I actually think the anti-religious percentage of the population has gone down in comparison to what went on 40/50 years ago. Therefore I see what happened in the last election with Lieberman/ Lapid is a reaction to the fact that most secular Israeli 's feel connected and like masoret, don't feel threatened by "hadata" or by having Rafi Peretz as Saar Chinuch.
Look what's going on now at the kotel/ meron with selichot, secular singers doing selichot concert, Yishai Ribo having a concert erev yom kippur in tel Aviv for a mostly secular crowd for the release of a disc called "Elul TSHA'T" !!!

I think this really freaks the hard core securlists out and those are the people who voted for Lieberman....
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SacN




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Sep 22 2019, 8:23 am
Quote:

Are most places this complicated? I keep trying but I can't seem to understand any of it. USA govt is plenty messed up but somehow it's still easier to keep track of. Who made up the rules for these games and what were they thinking?


It's easier, for Americans. Gonna go out on a limb and suggest that coalition governments work in most democratic countries, are more responsive and easier to create change, and better protect minority groups.
American government is none of those things.
Explain the Electoral College? I mean, why?
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Amarante




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Sep 22 2019, 8:36 am
SacN wrote:
Quote:

Are most places this complicated? I keep trying but I can't seem to understand any of it. USA govt is plenty messed up but somehow it's still easier to keep track of. Who made up the rules for these games and what were they thinking?


It's easier, for Americans. Gonna go out on a limb and suggest that coalition governments work in most democratic countries, are more responsive and easier to create change, and better protect minority groups.
American government is none of those things.
Explain the Electoral College? I mean, why?


Not sure if your question about the Electoral College is really a question or just rhetorical.

It exists because it was a political solution to get states to ratify the Constitution which is a Federal system as the first solution which was a Confederation didn't work.

It is also somewhat of a throwback to the era when only the rich and properties were deemed "good enough" to vote. It is the same kind of thinking in which Senators used to NOT be elected by popular vote but were elected by the State legislatures which obviously meant it was far less likely for a populist candidate to be elected as a Senator.
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SacN




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Sep 22 2019, 11:11 am
Quote:

Not sure if your question about the Electoral College is really a question or just rhetorical


Yea, I know. I'm just commenting on the post above that said the Israeli system is hard to figure out in comparison to the American one.

Cause, it's not. It's pretty straightforward, and more or less a more similar model to most democracies than the US system.
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etky




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Sep 22 2019, 11:23 am
SacN wrote:
Quote:

Not sure if your question about the Electoral College is really a question or just rhetorical


Yea, I know. I'm just commenting on the post above that said the Israeli system is hard to figure out in comparison to the American one.

Cause, it's not. It's pretty straightforward, and more or less a more similar model to most democracies than the US system.


Right, and it's not even bicameral like many European parliamentary democracies, and also the President is for the most part a figurehead (except for times like this lol), not like some more complicated systems like France where the Head of State also has real power that he shares with the PM, the head of the legislature.
What's difficult here is that Israel is a society divided into many disparate sectors whose various interests very often inevitably come at the expense of another sector. The fissures here are deep and existential and the political parties are an expression of those intractable social cleavages.
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Rappel




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Sep 22 2019, 11:32 am
etky wrote:

What's difficult here is that Israel is a society divided into many disparate sectors whose various interests very often inevitably come at the expense of another sector. The fissures here are deep and existential and the political parties are an expression of those intractable social cleavages.


Well said!
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