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Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 4:49 pm
Many people get gmach certificates for shoes and clothing. As for strollers- maybe it was a gift, maybe it was second hand? Maybe it’s borrowed? Maybe they can’t buy luxuries but the carriage is something they need to last?
BH- you have a house- that is a bracha, and an asset that is more important than expensive shoes and clothing. A house has long term value.
So while you don’t have it easy, at least your penny pinching is for something that others don’t have. May you always see simchos and brachos in your home.
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:00 pm
amother [ Pearl ] wrote:
The price difference between an expensive stroller and a basic one is a few hundred dollars. Is that a lot of money? Sure. But its not going to be the difference between someone living on the edge and someone getting by.

Forget the stroller.

What do you think the reaction of non-Jews is when they hear that people are receiving thousands of dollars in government benefits, but sending their children to private school. That's going to get them a whole lot angrier than a stroller.

You're focused on the wrong thing.


I am out of the stroller stage, so I did a quick Goggle. Greco strollers which was the brand I used are between $100 and $200. While the Bugaboo Donkey is $2000 which my friend on benefits has. That's a significant spread.

But how do you think it looks in the benefits offices to see expensive stroller after expensive stroller with matching stroller pads (I don't know the proper name), matching stroller bags, and the kids dressed in expensive outfits? The moms are dressed to the nines.

I don't think private schools upset them as much as material possessions and oblivious wealth flaunting.

OP's concerns are legitimate. She doesn't have a character flaw that she needs to reframe. She doesn't have to go through mental contortions saying they probably went to a thrift store, or aunt Faggie brought it for her, or they are in debt.

The simple fact is she wants for her kids.
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southernbubby




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:03 pm
I have recently heard that the tide is beginning to turn on the ridiculous spending. People are starting to feel better about living within their means and thinking as individuals rather than following the crowd.
In another thread, some legitimate poor people couldn't get help from tzedukah organizations because there are too many people in need. Maybe they should filter out the ones whose parents buy them over the top stuff.
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Kiwi13




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:09 pm
We are below middle class and trying hard to work our way up to a more stable financial situation, be”H. Our car was gifted to us when my parents bought a new one. We wear nice clothes that are bought at savers or goodwill. We virtually never buy new clothes or baby gear (except car seats and cribs). Almost all of our furniture was bought/inherited second hand. I love it because we can live nicely within our means. People don’t need to know how much our clothes or furniture cost. We have a house BH - our parents helped us with the down payment and we financed the rest. We work very hard to balance what we have. I think if you were outside looking in you’d never know how little we’re actually working with, financially. My sister once gave me the nicest compliment, she said that of all the siblings and spouses in my family, my husband and I have the least money and the most happiness. That always stuck with me.
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:13 pm
Squishy wrote:
I am out of the stroller stage, so I did a quick Goggle. Greco strollers which was the brand I used are between $100 and $200. While the Bugaboo Donkey is $2000 which my friend on benefits has. That's a significant spread.

But how do you think it looks in the benefits offices to see expensive stroller after expensive stroller with matching stroller pads (I don't know the proper name), matching stroller bags, and the kids dressed in expensive outfits? The moms are dressed to the nines.

I don't think private schools upset them as much as material possessions and oblivious wealth flaunting.

OP's concerns are legitimate. She doesn't have a character flaw that she needs to reframe. She doesn't have to go through mental contortions saying they probably went to a thrift store, or aunt Faggie brought it for her, or they are in debt.

The simple fact is she wants for her kids.


What was OP's concern?

She was venting. She feels crappy.
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Mommyg8




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:13 pm
I have just been told by those who know these things that Bubbies are supposed to pay for high end carriages. So now you know how many are living on food stamps pushing a $1000+ carriage.
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sarahmalka




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:14 pm
I'm with you OP. The middle class is struggling across the board in the USA, whether Jewish or not, religious or not. I am middle class. I try hard to make it a point to not look at other people's money or make any assumptions bc I have been on the receiving end of that... and I am clueless about name- brands and that kind of thing. But I do know I think twice about every doctor's visit I schedule bc of our high deductible and co-pays, there have been times when I probably should have gone to urgent care or the ER but decided against it, simply because of the insane costs, whereas if we qualified for Medicaid I would not hesitate. Even right now I'm ignoring a health issue bc we don't have the extra $300 it would cost to see a specialist, on top of our regular monthly bills of mortgage, utilities, insurance, and tuition. But my friends on assistance or disability don't think twice about medical bills. I also have the unfortunate inside information from two friends who get disability and other government assistance that they davka DON'T look for more work even though they're capable bc they don't want to lose the benefits. I have been a liberal Democrat my whole adult life but things like this drive me bananas and make me start to buy into more of the right wing rhetoric.
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:20 pm
sarahmalka wrote:
I'm with you OP. The middle class is struggling across the board in the USA, whether Jewish or not, religious or not. I am middle class. I try hard to make it a point to not look at other people's money or make any assumptions bc I have been on the receiving end of that... and I am clueless about name- brands and that kind of thing. But I do know I think twice about every doctor's visit I schedule bc of our high deductible and co-pays, there have been times when I probably should have gone to urgent care or the ER but decided against it, simply because of the insane costs, whereas if we qualified for Medicaid I would not hesitate. Even right now I'm ignoring a health issue bc we don't have the extra $300 it would cost to see a specialist, on top of our regular monthly bills of mortgage, utilities, insurance, and tuition. But my friends on assistance or disability don't think twice about medical bills. I also have the unfortunate inside information from two friends who get disability and other government assistance that they davka DON'T look for more work even though they're capable bc they don't want to lose the benefits. I have been a liberal Democrat my whole adult life but things like this drive me bananas and make me start to buy into more of the right wing rhetoric.


Come to Canada. We're socialists on healthcare - but that's about it. Public assistance is otherwise hard to come by. (Quebec may be different).
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amother




Pewter


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:22 pm
You made buying a home your priority
Which was smart because it’s something of value, that builds equity, and can be handed down. Strollers, clothing wigs, not.
But that’s what is a priority for them.

I know very wealthy ppl that only shop in thrift stores. And although I wouldn’t announce it pubicly, she did, at her own son’s bar mitzvah. She spent $20 on her dress, including buying extra trims and stuff. And, it looked at least $300.
I know very wealthy ppl who eat and dress very simple. But they have a luxury home, and own luxury real estate that brings nice income.
They like to spend on leaving an inheritance of value to their grandkids, and they splurge on exotic vacations.
It all depends on what your priorities are.
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:32 pm
amother [ Crimson ] wrote:
What was OP's concern?

She was venting. She feels crappy.


Don't tell her how to feel. I think I would feel the same crappy if my kids didn't have. The programs should be a rescue not a lifestyle.
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:35 pm
Squishy wrote:
Don't tell her how to feel. I think I would feel the same crappy if my kids didn't have. The programs should be a rescue not a lifestyle.


I didn't tell her how to feel.

She's venting. People vent when they feel crappy.

Its better though not to feel crappy, I would think.


You introduced concern into her post.
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:39 pm
amother [ Crimson ] wrote:
I didn't tell her how to feel.

She's venting. People vent when they feel crappy.

Its better though not to feel crappy, I would think.


You introduced concern into her post.


Then the people on programs who are affluent should not be taking government handouts. Or maybe they should be discreet about their lifestyle? OP doesn't need an attitude adjustment.
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:45 pm
Squishy wrote:
Then the people on programs who are affluent should not be taking government handouts. Or maybe they should be discreet about their lifestyle? OP doesn't need an attitude adjustment.


OP can only live her life.

She has no control over what the government programs are, or how other people live their lives.

If she doesn't make an attitude adjustment - she will continue to feel crappy. That's her choice.

I've seen what bitterness can do to people - its not a good thing.
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professor




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:47 pm
amother [ Crimson ] wrote:
You own a house. If you need to look somewhere - look at the huge asset you have.

Paying mortgage doesn't equal owning a house. The bank owns it until it's payed off. Just sayin'
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 5:50 pm
professor wrote:
Paying mortgage doesn't equal owning a house. The bank owns it until it's payed off. Just sayin'


That is false. The bank does not own the house.

If OP wanted to she could sell the house, because she owns the house. The bank cannot sell her house, because the bank does not own her house.
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professor




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 6:10 pm
amother [ Crimson ] wrote:
That is false. The bank does not own the house.

If OP wanted to she could sell the house, because she owns the house. The bank cannot sell her house, because the bank does not own her house.

Yeah.... She could sell, but depending on how much she owes the bank, she will sell and get no money from it. And she'll have to pay rent so,
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 6:11 pm
amother [ Crimson ] wrote:
That is false. The bank does not own the house.

If OP wanted to she could sell the house, because she owns the house. The bank cannot sell her house, because the bank does not own her house.


Crimson,

OP owns the equity in her house which could be significantly less than the debt at this point in time. Her asset is only the equity.
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 6:20 pm
Squishy wrote:
Crimson,

OP owns the equity in her house which could be significantly less than the debt at this point in time. Her asset is only the equity.


Her house is her asset.

Her mortgage is her liability.

She owns her home.


I made no comment about her net worth.
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amother




Crimson


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 6:21 pm
professor wrote:
Yeah.... She could sell, but depending on how much she owes the bank, she will sell and get no money from it. And she'll have to pay rent so,


The point I'm making is - the bank does not own her home. She does. What you said was just false.
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amother




Taupe


Post  Fri, Oct 04 2019, 6:21 pm
I was just in the "frum" shoe store and saw a bubby buying shoes for her toddler granddaughter. Someone asked if the baby's mother liked the shoes and the bubby laughed and said that if she pays for them, she's the one who gets to choose what they look like.

That kind of changed my perspective a bit!

It is such a bracha to be able to make your own choices. OP, perhaps later in life your trajectory will change a bit, and you will have more wiggle room to afford luxuries and different opportunities that people with benefits will never be able to afford.

Just keep davening and not thinking too hard about other people's cheshbonos. IYH things should improve for you!!
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