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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 11 2019, 2:22 pm
Cheiny wrote:
Sorry but you’re not seeing nearly an iota of the same disgusting behavior being perpetrated by republicans against liberals. Have you noticed how silent the fake news media has been about the liberals rioting last night at Trump’s rally?


The Democrats, Liberals, and media are wasting what power and influence they did have. Their disgusting the ends justify the means behavior is not resonating with the American people. Traditional media is not looked at with the same respect. NYT has become the mouth piece for the left instead of being a left leaning paper.

They destroyed their base in middle America by catering to illegal immigrants instead of American workers. That is so twisted from the Democratic party I knew.

They are going to have a tough time recovering from their march to the left. The silent majority are not impressed with the left's screaming at the sky antics.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 11 2019, 3:30 pm
roses wrote:
For those that are in support of Trump and the current Republican Party- and all of the impeachable crimes that are alleged

Do you have a red line? Is there anything that Trump could do that would make you stop supporting him? That would make you support impeachment? Or is your support for him unconditional, and there are no red lines in terms of his actions and behaviors in office that would make you reconsider? What would it take for you to stop supporting him and justifying his actions- or not?

For those who do not support him- have you ever considered supporting him? And if so, what was the line that was breached that stopped you?


These threads are fascinating! No time to read and comment on them.
I'm finding what's going on disconcerting. The new impeachment findings, Syria and abandonment of the Kurds...but I can't imagine any Democrat being appealing. I might just not vote.
Of course, I'm hoping Moshiach will be here and the world will be a different place. Looking forward to catching up on chol hamoed!
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Cheiny




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 11 2019, 3:54 pm
gold21 wrote:
If you hate Trump and specifically Trump, that's fine w me.

So what's w the social media outrage about Ellen DeGeneres spending time w George W Bush?

Because he's also a terrible unloveable person, apparently.

Or maybe it's just partisan politics.

From the perspective of some liberals, if someone is a republican, he's a full fledged creep and if he's a Democrat he can do no wrong.

And the reverse for some republicans.

Meanwhile our government representatives in Congress do nothing. I mean, sure they keep busy (sort of), but they actually do very little to help the country. Every ten minutes they're on a 2 week recess. When they're actually working, they're focused on partisan politics, not the country. Just a total bummer to have to pay these people's salaries.


And yet the very same base who was so thrilled that dems retook the House are completely fine with their not having done anything for the country since....so long as their focus is on “get Trump” 24/7. Their hatred of the president is greater than their desire to see this country flourish.
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Cheiny




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 11 2019, 3:56 pm
Jeanette wrote:
[quote
You have also not provided any basis, legal or otherwise, for your assertion that the Mueller report provides evidence that Trump committed no impeachable offenses.


So why didn’t your party immediately jump on impeachment after Mueller issued his report? There’s your proof.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Oct 13 2019, 9:04 am
I'm going to add to my post. Something that's enough to make me Banging head. Or really, someone else's head.
Trump at the rally was saying that Biden was such a sycophant. (As opposed to psychophant.) Hello, aren't these the same middos you admire in Mr. Pence?

And another great line, from someone I would expect to be savvier. I caught a little bit of a Sunday rerun of Sebastian Gorka from sometime this week, and he was running through the Dem front runners with a brief disparaging note about each, e.g. the one who's using his gayness to get ahead...I forgot who else he picked on (he didn't say names) and he referred to one who apparently had an affair with a married man when both were married. I don't need to know who he was referring to. BUT, BUT, within the very same few minutes he spoke about Cyrus Vance Jr. (harping on his being his Democratic father's son) making hay about Trump paying off two women, which of course was totally irrelevant. Hello, but didn't you just say that that kind of behavior was extremely relevant re whoever this candidate is? (!??!!)

OK, just had to get this off my chest. Off to laundry and cooking. (And B"H!!! Quite seriously.)
Have a wonderful yom tov!

P.S. But if Moshiach's not here, I still wouldn't be able to bring myself to vote for a Dem. for president. If things get worse for Trump, the way I would see it, I would much sooner leave it blank if I really couldn't hold my nose and vote GOP.
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Jeanette




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Oct 13 2019, 9:28 am
Quote:
P.S. But if Moshiach's not here, I still wouldn't be able to bring myself to vote for a Dem. for president. If things get worse for Trump, the way I would see it, I would much sooner leave it blank if I really couldn't hold my nose and vote GOP.


This is what I cannot wrap my head around. You couldn't bring yourself to vote for a dem but you could bring yourself to vote for Trump.
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Jeanette




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Oct 13 2019, 9:29 am
Jeanette wrote:
Quote:
Actually, from what I read, the Turks are encroaching on Cyprus. But please answer the question posed by columnist Kurt Schlichter in between making unsupported accusations about antipathy toward Muslims


Please ask Kurt Schlichter to explain why the US is deploying thousands of troops to Saudi Arabia in the same week we abandoned our Kurdish allies.


Follow up question:

How much is Saudi Arabia paying for the rent-a-troops Trump just deployed there, and where is the money going?
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PinkFridge




 
 
 


Post  Sun, Oct 13 2019, 9:31 am
Jeanette wrote:
Quote:
P.S. But if Moshiach's not here, I still wouldn't be able to bring myself to vote for a Dem. for president. If things get worse for Trump, the way I would see it, I would much sooner leave it blank if I really couldn't hold my nose and vote GOP.


This is what I cannot wrap my head around. You couldn't bring yourself to vote for a dem but you could bring yourself to vote for Trump.


Honestly, I'm not sure if I can anymore. I could see it the first time though.
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JoyInTheMorning




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Oct 17 2019, 4:35 am
How do imamother Trump supporters feel about what is happening with the Kurds in Syria now that America is withdrawing its troops? Most Republican legislators strongly oppose this move, as evidenced by the resolution overwhelmingly passed by the House yesterday. Even staunch supporters of Trump like Graham have spoken out against this betrayal of our ally.

Are you concerned that Trump abandoning one ally makes it more likely that he’ll abandon other allies? Note that sudden turnarounds in loyalty are common for Trump, as is evident not only from his very frequent staff changes, but also from his comments and tweets after staff departures. What do you think that says about his support for Israel?

Given the difference in opinion between Trump and most Republican legislators, is your loyalty more to the Republican Party (as is the case with PF) or to Trump himself?

Did you read the letter Trump wrote to Erdogan? Do the style and tone of the letter worry you?
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PinkFridge




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Oct 17 2019, 7:12 am
JoyInTheMorning wrote:
How do imamother Trump supporters feel about what is happening with the Kurds in Syria now that America is withdrawing its troops? Most Republican legislators strongly oppose this move, as evidenced by the resolution overwhelmingly passed by the House yesterday. Even staunch supporters of Trump like Graham have spoken out against this betrayal of our ally.

Are you concerned that Trump abandoning one ally makes it more likely that he’ll abandon other allies? Note that sudden turnarounds in loyalty are common for Trump, as is evident not only from his very frequent staff changes, but also from his comments and tweets after staff departures. What do you think that says about his support for Israel?

Given the difference in opinion between Trump and most Republican legislators, is your loyalty more to the Republican Party (as is the case with PF) or to Trump himself?

Did you read the letter Trump wrote to Erdogan? Do the style and tone of the letter worry you?


You bet I find Syria disconcerting. There's a link someone sent me to an article by Caroline Glick about how it's not as bad as we think, or something like that, I have yet to read it. I'm skeptical though.

If we're going to talk loyalty, yes, it's more to the GOP than to the president, but I don't know if I would call it loyalty. I'd say that there is an overall direction that I find less disconcerting than what's going on in the Democrat party.

Here we are in the middle of the yom tov where we reference the korbanos we brought on behalf of the world at large. I can only hope that uneshalma parim sefaseinu, that our tefilos do something to strengthen the umos ha'olam in the best ways....

ETA: Here's the link. https://www.israelhayom.com/op.....66653
I didn't read it carefully. I guess I can see the other side. But I do wonder how there is so much bipartisan opposition to the removal of the troops.
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princessleah




 
 
 


Post  Thu, Oct 17 2019, 1:01 pm
I have no affection for Trump and I disagree with just about every policy he has put in place and every position he has, and I think he's a bad person.

And I wasn't sure this impeachment inquiry was going to lead anywhere, and maybe it was a waste of time and would hurt the Democrats in the long run.

When I turned my phone on after Shabbat or Yom Tov (who can remember at this point) and saw the news about Syria and the Kurds I as absolutely sick to my stomach. I've actually been thinking about it every day since then. I am completely horrified that he abandoned our allies and left them to be slaughtered. I don't understand how anyone can justify this.

It is murder.
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JoyInTheMorning




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 3:10 am
princessleah wrote:
I have no affection for Trump and I disagree with just about every policy he has put in place and every position he has, and I think he's a bad person.

And I wasn't sure this impeachment inquiry was going to lead anywhere, and maybe it was a waste of time and would hurt the Democrats in the long run.

When I turned my phone on after Shabbat or Yom Tov (who can remember at this point) and saw the news about Syria and the Kurds I as absolutely sick to my stomach. I've actually been thinking about it every day since then. I am completely horrified that he abandoned our allies and left them to be slaughtered. I don't understand how anyone can justify this.

It is murder.


Princessleah, I’m with you. It is hard for me to believe there isn’t an outcry from the frum community about this. But it appears that there are those who are just disparaging the Kurds as antiSemites. (In fact, the Kurds and Jews/Israelis have had good relations for over a century now.) And those disparagers are saying they don’t care that the Kurds are being slaughtered.

Besides everything else, I am horrified at how frum Jews are abandoning their values in order to keep supporting Trump.
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roses




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 9:16 am
JoyInTheMorning wrote:
Princessleah, I’m with you. It is hard for me to believe there isn’t an outcry from the frum community about this. But it appears that there are those who are just disparaging the Kurds as antiSemites. (In fact, the Kurds and Jews/Israelis have had good relations for over a century now.) And those disparagers are saying they don’t care that the Kurds are being slaughtered.

Besides everything else, I am horrified at how frum Jews are abandoning their values in order to keep supporting Trump.


Yes, this is very horrifying outcome of.the gaslighting Trump and his actors has done, and the impact on people's values and morality and sensitivities. This damage cannot be quantified.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 9:48 am
According to HH a little bird (I.e. some info source he has) says that Erdogan told Trump he was going to go into Syria anyway so Trump's getting everyone out because there weren't enough people there to make a difference.

I'm not saying this to be dlkz. It would be interesting to know if there is truth to this, or if it's just trying to whitewash and protect Trump.
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roses




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 10:01 am
PinkFridge wrote:
According to HH a little bird (I.e. some info source he has) says that Erdogan told Trump he was going to go into Syria anyway so Trump's getting everyone out because there weren't enough people there to make a difference.

I'm not saying this to be dlkz. It would be interesting to know if there is truth to this, or if it's just trying to whitewash and protect Trump.


Since when do we step aside to allow genocide and slaughter to happen? We are the United States of America, and we have the power and the ability to say no to Turkeys plan to harm our allies.and allow the resurgence of ISIS. Since when do our president's act against the US national and security interests of us and our Middle East Partners? However this HH person tries to whitewash his actions- we don't need to buy into it
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JoyInTheMorning




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 11:27 am
roses wrote:
Yes, this is very horrifying outcome of.the gaslighting Trump and his actors has done, and the impact on people's values and morality and sensitivities. This damage cannot be quantified.


It cannot be quantified and will be very hard to reverse, even after Trump and his cronies are gone. Even if he wins in 2020, he'll be gone in January 2025. But the damage to our democracy and norms will last for quite a while, and the damage to the frum community's values will last even longer.
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Squishy




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 12:28 pm
JoyInTheMorning wrote:
It cannot be quantified and will be very hard to reverse, even after Trump and his cronies are gone. Even if he wins in 2020, he'll be gone in January 2025. But the damage to our democracy and norms will last for quite a while, and the damage to the frum community's values will last even longer.


I am also afraid of the damage the Democrats and their media handmaidens have done.
Secret proceedings and double standards are destroying their credibility.

The Democrats are gaslighting their voters. They are lying about the economy and about the cost of their proposals. Heck, the frontrunner lies about native American ancestry. She set back affirmative action with her stealing and cheating. She back back the cause of feminism with her lies about getting fired for being pregnant. She speaks with a forked tongue.

The way the democratic professional politicians financially enrich themselves and their families is disgusting. I am glad that and deep state working against the elected President has come to light.

Putting illegal aliens above American workers is going to back fire big time on the Democrats. The illegal aliens have values similar to middle Americans rather than kooky elitist globalists. Once they are established in America, they don't want to be drowning in taxes to pay for more free loaders sneaking into the country. They know there are only 2 genders and gender is not fungible. And boys belong in boy locker rooms and girls belong in girl locker rooms. They are religious with traditional family values which is at war with the craziness.

The only way Democrats think they can win is with violence and stifling free speech.

The Democrats are going to be toast because they are so out of touch with the workers who used to be the backbone of their party. The leftist candidates are unelectable. The country doesn't want their policies.

I foresee social media being controlled by government regulations because of how they stifle the free exchange of ideas. It is unfair to only censor one side. That's the one the silent majority associates with.
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Fox




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 1:31 pm
Let's start by correcting some factual information, shall we?

A number of posters have referred to the Kurds as "our allies" in contrast to Turkey. However, as a member of NATO, Turkey has a much stronger case for being considered our ally than the Kurds.

You remember NATO? Those are the "allies" that many of you complained Trump was offending in the past. So which is it? Does NATO membership confer some kind of immunity from being called out for bad policies or not? Merkel is immune but Erdogan is not?

Many of you are also pretending that the Kurds are a unified force, which is also misleading. There are at least five different Kurdish political groups, some based on tribal affiliations or nationalities. The YPG, the group with which the U.S. allied to fight ISIS, is openly Marxist and is allied with the PKK -- a group designated by both the U.S. and Turkey as a terrorist organization. Anyone speaking about "the Kurds" is woefully uninformed. Brookings Institute and Int'l Relations Org
____________________________

But let's move on.

I don't believe that any of the posters here cares one whit about any of the Kurds.

If any of you cared about the fate of civilian Kurds, you would have been talking about the withdrawal from Syria back when we reduced our troops by thousands, not by hundreds.

I am also curious how many of you lived through the Vietnam conflict and saw the effect on the country of massive involvement in undeclared wars. We didn't want to win in Vietnam but we didn't want to lose, either. We went into Vietnam to prove to our allies that they could always depend on us. 50,000+ dead Americans later, we proved the opposite.
____________________________

However, it's possible that I'm mistaken. It's possible that some of you truly do care about the fate of Kurds -- though it's not clear to me which Kurds you care about -- and not just as a new pretext for complaining about Trump. If so, let me give you some suggestions:

Declare War
This one will appeal to those of you who have suddenly become strident Constitutionalists on the topic of impeachment: Simply lobby Congress to declare war on Turkey. Bypass President Trump altogether. If Congress can gather 350 votes to condemn the pullout, they can certainly get the votes to declare war.

Declaring war, though, must be done with some goal in mind. What goal do you envision? A Kurdish homeland that will be immediately plunged into civil war? A defeat and rebuilding of Turkey? An overthrow of Assad and a defeat of Turkey?

And do you feel strongly enough about this to send your own sons' to their deaths? Or just other women's sons? The military is disproportionately made up of Southerners, who view military service as a point of honor. Having rendered a rather stereotyped opinion on the educational level of Southerners, I presume Roses won't mind using them as cannon fodder. But if we are to overthrow Assad and defeat Turkey, it's going to require a lot more boots on the ground. How many of your sons and your neighbors' sons are you willing to commit?

Involve Israel and the KSA
Simple logistics suggest that if the Kurds must be defended, Israel has more geographic stake in the matter than we do. Get Israel to declare war on Turkey and overthrow Assad. How many IDF deaths are we prepared to suffer to do . . . something . . . for Kurds?

Or ask Saudi Arabia to join with Israel to defeat Turkey and overthrow Assad -- and replace the current governments with . . . ?

Do you honestly believe that fewer civilians would suffer in such a scenario?
____________________________

President Obama partnered with the YPG very reluctantly for the purpose of defeating ISIS. He recognized that it was not a case of good guys versus bad guys, but highly questionable guys versus really, really bad guys.

Reducing the complexity of Kurdish politics and their relationships with the sovereign countries in which they live in order to score points against a President you don't like is reprehensible. If you're sincere, email your Congressional representative to declare war -- anything less is merely a pose.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 2:25 pm
roses wrote:
Since when do we step aside to allow genocide and slaughter to happen? We are the United States of America, and we have the power and the ability to say no to Turkeys plan to harm our allies.and allow the resurgence of ISIS. Since when do our president's act against the US national and security interests of us and our Middle East Partners? However this HH person tries to whitewash his actions- we don't need to buy into it


HH is Hugh Hewitt, whom I'd just quoted before.
As I understood him, we didn't have enough troops in the first place, we'd have needed to send more anyway. The reason why I thought he was quoteworthy is because he seems to represent the more moderate RW, so this is the stuff that they're offering.
Please note, despite what's being offered on the apologetics side (him, Caroline Glick), I'm very disturbed myself. Just throwing this out there.
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#BestBubby




 
 
 


Post  Fri, Oct 18 2019, 3:05 pm
To all Democrat Ima-Mothers crying over the Kurds. If Trump had aided the Kurds, The Democrats and their Fake News Media would attack Trump as being a War Monger who is killing American boys and girls to aid foreigners, and American Soldiers are committing Atrocities, etc.

And the brain-washed Ima-Mothers would parrot their Democrat Leaders and attack Trump for involving America in a foreign war.
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