PSA- Edited: After months of not finding any insects

naturalmom5

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 12:33 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

It should go without saying that generations of Jews ate vegetables without the benefit of light boxes or jeweler's loupes. If you want to believe that they all ate treif, go ahead.

1) Previous generations had more siyata d shomaya and knew what to look for
2) There are more bugs today
3) As a result of messing with the eco-system and importing all sorts of fruits that aren't indigenous to the region there are many insects that there should be

amother

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 12:39 am

pgk wrote:

For all those talking about checking veggies generations ago, please note I am pretty sure my ancestors did not have easy access to most of these veggies in any case. Don’t remember my grandmother ever telling me about her mother’s great recipe for broccoli kugel or the like.

How true!

Growing up in the 60s and 70s, I never saw any leafy greens, besides iceberg lettuce in my parents house.

And, I dont think there were too many salads served in pre-war Europe. They werent health conscious. I think their idea of a healthy diet was eating lots of eggs and beef.

FranticFrummie

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 12:59 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

And, I dont think there were too many salads served in pre-war Europe. They werent health conscious. I think their idea of a healthy diet was eating lots of eggs and beef.

As far at eating healthy goes, I find that leafy organic produce is by far the most infested. I did some research, and the soaking and checking method is enough to remove 95% of the pesticides of regular produce.

I just hate that we're going into a monoculture, where there's no crop diversity and everything is GMO. It's only going to take one plant virus to wipe out an entire industry. Imagine not having any wheat! That's why I want to have a garden with heirloom varieties of plants, and I like buying Einkorn flour (when I can find it and afford it.)

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 1:28 am

pgk wrote:

Italian Jews ate artichokes for hundreds of years. There's a vegetarian cookbook from Vilna about a hundred years ago that uses all kinds of vegetables. It's true that our ancestors didn't have the variety of fresh fruits and vegetables that we have today, but it wasn't all potatoes and beets either.

watergirl

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 6:23 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Yup. I’m a BT and we also always only had iceberg at home. These varieties of new leafy green lettuces are pretty new, relatively speaking. I grew up watching cooking shows - this was before food network - and I remember seeing romaine used for the first time. Same with the other “new”ish lettuces and veggies. Its not “our bubbies in Europe were so frum that they never ate these things”. Its that no one did yet! Not to the degree people eat it now!

amother

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 6:32 am

watergirl wrote:

Yes. Take Ratners on the Lower East Side- one of the most popular restaurants in the 60s, I doubt they had too many salads altogether, and if they had salads they were iceberg lettuce and tomato based.

amother

Jetblack

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 9:00 am

watergirl wrote:

Our bubbies in Europe didn’t have access to much in the way of fresh leafy greens. At least not mine, who hailed fromLithuania. Check a map: it’s pretty far north. Vilna is at about the same latitude as Edinburgh, Scotland. The growing season is short and if they already grew veggies it was hardy things that could survive winter storage in a cold cellar: carrots, turnips, onions, garlic, potatoes, beets and pickled cabbage.

My friend who was born in Siberia never saw a banana till he was 30 years old and an orange was a rare luxury. The growing season there was SO short they had hardly any fruit or veggies at all aside from root veggies.

My Polish grandfather never ate a leafy green in his life. He considered it grass, fit only for cows. Real men ate meat or 🐓 (if they could afford it) beans, potatoes, barley and root veggies. This attitude persisted even after he moved to more temperate latitudes. Even prosperous people in the US weren’t big on vegetables in the late 19th and early 20th century. Greens weren’t considered nutritious and they were fit only for the poorest of the poor. Given the low calorie content and the huge quantity of greens one would have to eat to sustain life, and given how much physical labor most people had to do, it’s not hard to see why. A mess of greens won’t power your engine for long.

ShishKabob

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 1:09 pm

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

It should go without saying that generations of Jews ate vegetables without the benefit of light boxes or jeweler's loupes. If you want to believe that they all ate treif, go ahead.

Cmon. You know very well that the reality has changed over time and with regard to the bugs as well.
(if you were generations back and would look at the stuff now) It's almost as if you're saying that the people that use Shabbos clocks for their lights, heat, hotplates and so on are being mechallel Shabbos because they didn't have it years ago.
I understand being fed up with unnecessary stringencies, however, there is a point to the double checking and other things put into place to ensure a bug free eating experience.
I'm not condoning or condemning the lightbox or whatever else and neither am I doing the same for people that do something else.
You have to keep an open mind either way, that's all.

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Oct 23 2019, 1:18 pm

ShishKabob wrote:

No, I don't know that the reality has changed. Bugs are bugs, and our pesticides are a lot more efficient than they were in the past. Attitudes have changed.

This isn't at all comparable to using timers. That works within the halachic system

What's happening here (and in other areas of halacha, I think) is that the ordinary Jews have lost their reliability. Instead, everything must be handed over to professionals (some of whom may be making money off their chumros).

I don't think any of us would say we know when the new moon is, so let's eliminate the second day of yom tov outside of Israel. Scientific certainty should not outweigh human measurements, either le-chumra or le-kula. Chazal established that we go according to what the human eye can perceive. That rule stands, despite the existence of microscopes, telescopes, or anything else.

amother

Thu, Oct 24 2019, 12:47 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

Is this what your Rabbi says and believes?

amother

Mon, May 18 2020, 1:22 pm

OP here.

After many months of not finding any insects at all in Organic Girl, with very tedious checking, this week I found insects (in one package only). I assume this may be either because there may be certain months (spring/summer) that produce is more infested, or during the pandemic they have less help at Organic Girl, or theyre being more lax with their checking.