S/O criminal prices

amother

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:16 pm

Someone, who runs an organization that helps people make Shabbos and Y'T, approached my husband with a request for a donation. As he explained the way it works with shoes and clothing is that people get a coupon sort of, that they can redeem in stores and this organization covers the cost that the store owner paid.
I have no problem giving tzedaka. And DH and I give gladly. But I feel like this type of arrangement feeds into the "need" of having expensive brand clothes. Where someone who needs to rely on tzedaka should just walk into a store and get $100 pair of shoes. I don't know if I'm wrong or right. But that's just my feeling. Maybe I'm a bit jealous? Here I'm giving tzedaka but my kids are happily wearing hand me downs (from each other, not from other people) or cheaper shoes that I bought online. I would probably only buy local if I don't find online or elsewhere for less.
What are your thoughts?

amother

Yellow

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:37 pm

There are countless threads on this topic.
The people getting the coupons are better off and better dressed than the people giving tzeddaka. The joke goes that the lady with the bugaboo and kids with brand name clothing and $100 shoes (bought with coupons) is buying matching $18 headbands to 10 dresses with "coupons". It %100 feeds into the need of always being in style.
The organizations should give coupons to target, carters, h&m....

amother

Pearl

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:43 pm

I know what you mean.
I just embarrassed myself by mentioning this to someone and he said he gets these vouchers.
He is so poor. His wife is so simple. They spend money on nothing. Seriously. According to any standards. He is against lavis spending, tzedakah for wasteful things.
He had a few comments.
- he and his wife have no internet. They can’t buy online (and won’t)
- now that Payless closed down there aren’t much options. They are not the type to go into mall. His wife would sooner take someone’s year old shoes or go without then take her kids past a VS or mall ads. They are very sincere people.
- he has teen daughters who are starting to care.
- there aren’t many other options in town. Lately gmachs are not so many options.
- he gets one voucher per kid. His wife uses it on sale shoes or backroom last year to get at least 2 pairs per kid.
- it doesn’t make sense to give them vouchers to target or children’s place or Zara. While the shoes are cute they rarely last me 3 months. My kids have it now for Shabbos and weekday because I couldn’t shell out the big bucks but they are all already breaking.

itsmeima

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:44 pm

I'm with you!

I’d probably qualify for these coupons if we'd ask, but I find it rude to wear clothing my wealthy sister can’t afford to wear!

So instead I shop at Target, Zara/H&M for Shabbos and the gemach!

Last edited by itsmeima on Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:48 pm; edited 1 time in total

mum22

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:47 pm

Rappel wrote:

I'm curious: Why do you care that someone else is wearing shoes bought with tzedaka from local stores, whole your kids are wearing thrifty online purchases? What is the connection?

I’m jealous.
It’s hard for me to see people buying the outfits I would like to buy, and the $160 dress I also would like.
But we are wearing HnM and gap.
We do pay full tuition and give tzedaka.
I’m only human...
social pressures are strong, it’s hard to swim against the tide.

southernbubby

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:48 pm

The idea is to prevent the recipients from feeling that their kids have less than everyone else.
Is there a specific category of community members who get the help, such as big families, single mothers, yeshiva Rebbeim, etc or it open to anyone who can't provide new clothes?

gande

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:56 pm

If I would get the coupons I still wouldn't buy. With the coupon shabbos shoes are still over $60 and more than we can afford. I think its terrible that this is the norm but I try to be dan lkaf zchus that many people dont have the time (kollel working moms), energy (kids close together), internet, creativity to live more thrifty.

In fact stores like kidi chic and tottini are doing so well because most people really dont want to spend on clothes but they need thier kids to look cute.

My dh was asked to sponsor coupons one year. I only let him give for a neby dry good store. Because people who bought there actually cared about the prices and got basics.

amother

Apricot

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:56 pm

Life is not only about "things." The menuchas hanefesh of one who can live without constant worry, who CHOOSES to spend on xxx vs yyyy but has enough to pay rent, tuition, and basic needs without asking for help, is much greater than the satisfaction gained from trendy shoes or clothing.
Personally, I'd rather choose to pay full tuition and wear my old $500 wig, shop in H&M and sale Zara, and be happy knowing I made the choice.

notshanarishona

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 9:58 pm

Rappel wrote:

I'm curious: Why do you care that someone else is wearing shoes bought with tzedaka from local stores, whole your kids are wearing thrifty online purchases? What is the connection?

Because if rich me who buys $10 Wal-Mart shoes and goodwill coats manages to clothe myself and my family on minimal budget why does anyone need " tzsdakah" at $100 a pair ?
I would never do that for kids who grow out of shoes every year anyway . Maybe for an adult work shoe that you want to last a few years . .

amother

Pearl

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:01 pm

gande wrote:

I think stores like tottini, clover, kiddi chic, sage (fashion wholesalers) are doing a chessed (even off 2nd). I know they are making a profit and it’s a business - but it’s so wonderful to be able to buy Shabbos dresses in current beautiful styles $25-40. My girls can choose what they want and feel gorgeous .

I wish there were more.

33055

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:16 pm

Rappel wrote:

I'm curious: Why do you care that someone else is wearing shoes bought with tzedaka from local stores, whole your kids are wearing thrifty online purchases? What is the connection?

It's not any one person or family. It is when the community is clothing the poorest on standards that are higher than those able to purchase full price then those who don't qualify and can't afford feel frustrated.

As other posters said, I have a choice. I don't choose to pay over $100 a pair for kids shoes. When DD was younger, I could take her to Marshall's and buy 5 pair of designer shoes for $100 and get change back. I don't see the value in $100 shoes every half year.

My friend received certificates for shoes at the Jewish store each yontiff. Her kids had the $100 shoes. Our other friend with a bigger family didn't get certificates and couldn't afford nicer shoes for her kids. She would go on rants to me that her kids dressed in ****. She was frustrated because she didn't qualify for help and couldn't afford the standards without help. There's nothing to say because she is absolutely correct.

amother

Forestgreen

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:26 pm

These coupons dont cover full cost for anything.
Imagine wearing all your old clothes but trimming it with a nice headband so it shouldn't look so dated. Or wearing all your old clothes but being able to buy geox sneakers that last longer lthan the department store because after two month those shoes are in shreds. Or to buy tznius skirts because it hard to find tznius basic skirts anywhere. And no one you know has weekday pants as hand me downs because they get so worn out. Even trendy Zara is not so cheap ther prices is the same as totini and Zara but not tznius so it has to be fixed. I'm sure these coupons get abused but some people use these to fill in for there wodrope that consist of hand me downs. Not even to target cloths. These coupons should be the cheap Jewish stores like kidichic. I wish there were stores even cheaper but with the nice clothes that kidichic has. There are also some cheap dry goods stores but unlike kidichic clothes are made very poorly. Somone showed me an some shirts she bought they ran wide but the arm part was so skinny her son could nearly fit his fingers in. I wish there was a coupon for the $5 target legging. And I wish these organizations covered more people. Because yom tov is expensive for everyone

sub

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:30 pm

These families usually live on bare bones. So they get good quality shoes like everyone else and feel good about themselves. ( shoes are important to kids in school)
And don’t kid yourself, the parents feel the pain of handouts.
Note one poster wrote that she knows s/o who uses the vouchers sparingly.
This conversation is just going in circles. No-one knows what goes on in another person’s life.

33055

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:38 pm

sub wrote:

But not everyone else has these shoes. The poorest and the better off folks do. It is the ones who are too poor to buy and who crave them for their children that are envious.

What's more pain to accept the handout of the shoes or to see your child without the shoes? I think the pain is greater to see your child without or no one would accept these vouchers.

sub

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:52 pm

Squishy wrote:

So let’s fargin those who have the shoes no matter how they “bought” them.

amother

Yellow

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 10:57 pm

We don't have a problem with the people that really need the coupons & are using them.
The problem is that many many of the women shopping with the coupons are the ones dressed to the nines with expensive fancy strollers and brand name everything. Why should they be getting coupons?? To support and feed their lavish lifestyles??
Same goes for the people that don't work.

amother

Powderblue

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 11:00 pm

I don't begrudge anyone.
I do think there's something seriously wrong when clothing for the 1 percent becomes the norm for everyone.
There are plenty of places where you can live a perfectly frum life without expensive shoes.

33055

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 11:04 pm

sub wrote:

[/b]
So let’s fargin those who have the shoes no matter how they “bought” them.

I fargin everyone their shoes. I don't want to buy overpriced kids shoes. I don't want to be gifted overpriced kids shoes either. They do nothing for me. I don't care for them.

The ones who can't fargin everyone their shoes are the ones whose kids must do without. It's not the poorest who are doing without. They have the same shoes as the wealthiest.

amother

Chartreuse

Sat, Oct 12 2019, 11:08 pm

Prices in our heimishe stores Are Criminal!

We need to have a shoe store that brings in lower cost shoes n the styles we like.

Stride rite and l’amour to name a few. Pretty Mary Janes for $40 bucks.

Oy, the proprietor won’t make big profit