Why is [non jew] not a PC word?

southernbubby

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 10:49 pm

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

I agree. Don't speak negatively.

But is the word [non jew] inherently negative? If I tell my child, "g0yim don't have the mitzva of shabbos, just yidden do," is that insulting? Or just differentiating?

Because some posters apparently did use the term negatively, which upset women who had converted, we had to avoid using the word. By itself, it is a neutral term.

FranticFrummie

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 10:59 pm

singleagain wrote:

I recently got an email from someone asking for one of my co-workers numbers. I either hope that he really thinks if it as innocent. Or that it was a typo and he meant to ask for the "guy's number"

Are you sure he wasn't asking for that gay's number? Wink

singleagain

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 11:12 pm

southernbubby wrote:

Because some posters apparently did use the term negatively, which upset women who had converted, we had to avoid using the word. By itself, it is a neutral term.

All words are neutral until they aren't.

I mean.. just think of any two synonyms you'll find that there's a reason you use the word you use instead of its synonym.

singleagain

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 11:12 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

Are you sure he wasn't asking for that gay's number? Wink

very sure. Though I don't quite want to say where my mind just went

southernbubby

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 11:17 pm

singleagain wrote:

All words are neutral until they aren't.

I mean.. just think of any two synonyms you'll find that there's a reason you use the word you use instead of its synonym.

It is the Hebrew word for non-Jew but a non-Jew can be a number of types of people, from a wonderful person to an evil anti-Semite, so it depends on the context.

singleagain

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 11:20 pm

southernbubby wrote:

It is the Hebrew word for non-Jew but a non-Jew can be a number of types of people, from a wonderful person to an evil anti-Semite, so it depends on the context.

For sure. But it's really hard to change the way people perceive something. It's like my mom says says "it's no that you say, but what they hear"

southernbubby

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 11:27 pm

singleagain wrote:

For sure. But it's really hard to change the way people perceive something. It's like my mom says says "it's no that you say, but what they hear"

A lot of times it doesn't sound respectful or sounds dehumanizing.

singleagain

Thu, Oct 31 2019, 11:40 pm

southernbubby wrote:

A lot of times it doesn't sound respectful or sounds dehumanizing.

Maybe not.. but then up still have to deal with the preconceptions of people.

My mom works in the developmental disability community. Growing up the "R" word that the dictionary defines as delay was and to this day is a bad word. To the point that when my boss referred to a situation as that word I right away said "that's a bad word" I even once said to a virtual stranger bc I overhead him saying it. I've been trying not to automatically react to it. But if it's someone I see constantly, I will tell them "please don't say that word around me"

amother

Emerald

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 12:12 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

When you have little boys throw rocks at you and yell [non jew] because you are visiting from out of town, and you don't have seams in your stockings. Mad

I very much doubt little boys notice seams in stockings.....

marina

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 12:20 am

Squishy wrote:

It's controlling people deciding to censor others. They would censor your thoughts if they could. You can say gentile with the same derision that they say g○y.

It's the PC culture run amok. They lack respect for others with a different point of view from them.

southernbubby

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 12:30 am

amother [ Emerald ] wrote:

I very much doubt little boys notice seams in stockings.....

Unfortunately those things do happen.

LovesHashem

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 3:37 am

sequoia wrote:

Keeping shabbat, kosher, and taharat hamishpacha (if applicable) is generally what makes you Orthodox.

In many places in Europe, Russia, South Africa, and South America, everyone goes to an Orthodox shul (when they do), so that alone would not make you Orthodox.

Tzniyus is also a thing.
If you're a woman who doesn't want to do service in Israel because you are religious you need to sign you keep shabbos, kosher, and tzniyus.

LovesHashem

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 3:47 am

singleagain wrote:

For sure. But it's really hard to change the way people perceive something. It's like my mom says says "it's no that you say, but what they hear"

I hear that. That's why I keep trying to explain to my mom she cannot called me friends, her friends or any females friends "their girlfriends". LOL

It means something else nowadays.
I think she gets it she just forgets lol.

amother

Sienna

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 3:49 am

Words absorb the zeitgest of the times.

G-y has become a negative term in English speaking countries, because the Jews living there used it for a long time in a negative way. As others have said, it was NOT usually used to describe positive personality traits. In fact, it was used as a catch all for all the negative stuff.

Same with sh@ksa, by the way. Not a term that should be used (although that is yiddish and not Hebrew).

In Israel, 'g@y' is still used everywhere in religious communities.

The OP said that it's similar to using 'black'. I thought 'black' was still used in America? After all, not all 'blacks' are African American, so that's not a good term either. Am I wrong and hopelessly not pc? If so, pls tell me what the term is these days.

Rappel

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 4:20 am

Squishy wrote:

This is more or less what I came here to say. I feel like gentile is actually more rude than [non jew], but I've never heard people jump all over that word.

To me, "[non jew]" is a neutral word.

On the other hand, I've only ever heard people use the word "[gentile woman]" derogatorily, and that one makes me wrinkle my nose. Go figure.

33055

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 7:07 am

marina wrote:

Actually political correctness should be called virtue signaling at their victims' expense or just hypocrites. The posters who come on here dictating how others offend say American Indians because of their Purim costumes aren't offended. They are controlling. There aren't any American Indians on here to be offended. But how many liberals do we see in blackface or offering to do the moonwalk? (That's after discussing after birth abortions or murder. )

Even Obama made a recent speech saying, what we already knew, that this nonsense has gone too far.

The term g○y is not used in my community as the equivalent of the N word. It is a non- offensive way to say gentile. If people want to get offended, they will find something to get offended about.

I get offended by controlling dictating people who are often don't have original ideas themselves.

singleagain

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 7:58 am

Rappel wrote:

I think part of the reason which was touched on upthread, when it's the the only foreign word in an other languages sentence it takes on a different connotation.

Typically, when people switch languages even for one word it is either, bc there is no direct translation or is for emphasize, good or bad.

nchr

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 8:04 am

For the record, non Jewish is often derogatory as well, depending on the context. It's like because we are Jewish we are superior etc. I'd be very careful to use those words in public.

amother

Natural

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 9:43 am

LovesHashem wrote:

I just don't understand.
If anyone knows the history, or can shed some light on what turned the word [non jew] into a non PC word I'd love to hear!

It is because it has come to be widely used with negative intent.

I have heard children say things like "I hate that game, it's really g0yish," meaning that they think the game is stupid, not that they think the game is particularly pertinent to non-Jews.

amother

Mustard

Fri, Nov 01 2019, 9:47 am

Squishy wrote:

This should be in the alien thead.

I have learned on imamother that if they keep kosher, keep shabbos and keep TH, they are considered orthodox. This is important to know.

I see nothing wrong with knowing someone's religion unlike some.

Then what for the Halacha on not wearing men’s clothing? How would an outsider know if they keep TH, shabbos fully, or kosher fully? What for the rabbonim that day if they don’t keep in public we can’t assume they do on private. Keeping Shabbos and keeping kosher are pretty subjective.