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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:02 pm
I’m sorry bestbubby I’m seriously not into arguing with an antivaxxer and I have plenty of info just way to much to type. I have plenty of arguing with my insane anti vaxxers neighbors whose kids have issues but no shots! Have a great night
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:08 pm
amother [ Pumpkin ] wrote:
I know someone in Montreal anti vaxxers and her child got autism and never had a vaccine


Can you tell me what is the RATE of autism in non-vaccinated children?

Nobody ever said that there is ZERO autism in non-vaccinated children. But there are many articles that autism in non-vaccinated is EXTREMELY rare.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:09 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
There are UNvaccinated children - although the government is trying to ELIMINATE all unvaccinated children by mandating vaccines.

We already know the autism rate of the general population - 1:150 for NON-VERBAL autism. Other illnesses: 1:90 epilepsy, 1:400 diabetes,

Just check the rate of these illnesses in the 100% Unvaccinated Children and you will know 100% whether Vaccines cause autism and other illnesses. But Government REFUSES to look.


Who exactly in the government refuses to look? The CDC, for example, is concerned about the possibility that the polio like illness, AFM, is connected to vaccines and they are looking for answers and have not ruled it out that I know of. So is it the CDC that refuses to study completely non-vaccinated children? There don't seem to be many politicians with a strong vaccine safety platform except in California. I don't see it mentioned at all in the news.
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:12 pm
amother [ Coffee ] wrote:
Ironic that this is the complaint, as the very reason they added the adjuvants is so as to get the same good result but with fewer antigens. If there are actual studies showing a link between adjuvants and any adverse reactions, please share


The adjuvent aluminum is well known to be a neurotoxin. Plus there are other harmful ingredients.
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amother
Babyblue


 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:12 pm
amother [ Coffee ] wrote:
I'm not familiar with this. Are you saying they are allergic to their mother's milk?

My understanding is that, when looking at populations, it was observed that in Israel, where 6 month babies are fed bamba, the rate of peanut allergy was significantly lower than here in the US, where parents were told to keep kids away from peanuts, yet allergy rates were rising. So they changed the recommendation.

Again, I have no idea how it would be possible to conclusively test this kind of theory, but te numbers seemed to strongly suggest correlation that indicated causation. Enough for the APA to change its recommendation anyway

I mean allergic to allergens via the mothers milk. I know many like that. My son included. I have also heard a theory that the high levels of vitamin D in Israel also contribute to lower allergies. I'm not sure ther Israel peanut study was enough to indicate causation as you mentioned.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:13 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
What is the proof that autism is genetic?


About 100 genes have been identified that are connected with autism. Some families, unfortunately, have more than one child with autism.
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:14 pm
southernbubby wrote:
Who exactly in the government refuses to look? The CDC, for example, is concerned about the possibility that the polio like illness, AFM, is connected to vaccines and they are looking for answers and have not ruled it out that I know of. So is it the CDC that refuses to study completely non-vaccinated children? There don't seem to be many politicians with a strong vaccine safety platform except in California. I don't see it mentioned at all in the news.


Yes, it is the CDC who refuses to do the Vax vs UnVax Study - even though they were requested to so by congressmen. Some congressmen proposed a law to FORCE the
CDC to do a vax vs unvax study but the rest of the congressmen - who take millions from pharmaceutical industry - refused to force CDC to do a Vax vs UnVax study.
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amother
Babyblue


 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:15 pm
amother [ Coffee ] wrote:
Ironic that this is the complaint, as the very reason they added the adjuvants is so as to get the same good result but with fewer antigens. If there are actual studies showing a link between adjuvants and any adverse reactions, please share

What is an antigen?
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:18 pm
amother [ Coffee ] wrote:
Both antibiotics and vaccines have been the main factors in increasing life expectancies, lowering childhood and infant mortality, etc. in the past 100 years.

Two of my grandparents had at least two siblings each who died as young children of diseases.

I have no idea as to the extent to which modern medicine, without vaccines, would be able to effectively treat the diseases that we vaccinate for. It doesn't sound like a world I want to live in, though. (Fwiw I have kids with food allergies and asthma)


In the 1950s and 1960s when there were only FOUR Vaccines given, children were not dying from infectious disease (very rare).

And today the Life Span is GOING DOWN. Children born today are expected to have a shorter lifespan than their parents due to high rate of chronic disease in children. There never was a high rate of chronic disease in children before the CDC QUADRUPLED the vaccine schedule in 1990!
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:24 pm
amother [ Babyblue ] wrote:
I mean allergic to allergens via the mothers milk. I know many like that. My son included. I have also heard a theory that the high levels of vitamin D in Israel also contribute to lower allergies. I'm not sure ther Israel peanut study was enough to indicate causation as you mentioned.


Persuasive enough to get the AAP to change its guidelines. I remember asking my pediatrician about it after I read about the Israel study but before the AAP changed their guidelines. He told me with a straight face that I was welcome to do what I wanted, but he had to follow the recommendations of the AAP. A year later, the AAP reversed itself. That the AAP reversed its own policy is a big deal.

As for nursing babies, Idk. I know moms who had to nurse even when they weren't planning to because that was the only milk their babies could tolerate.
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:26 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
In the 1950s and 1960s when there were only FOUR Vaccines given, children were not dying from infectious disease (very rare).

And today the Life Span is GOING DOWN. Children born today are expected to have a shorter lifespan than their parents due to high rate of chronic disease in children. There never was a high rate of chronic disease in children before the CDC QUADRUPLED the vaccine schedule in 1990!


So you would agree that 4 vaccines was better than none?
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:37 pm
amother [ Coffee ] wrote:
So you would agree that 4 vaccines was better than none?


No. But I would agree that four vaccines are better than 72 doses of 17 vaccines.

Here is the results of a small Vax vs Partially Vax vs Unvax Study:

up until the mid-2000's, Dr. Paul Thomas followed the CDC schedule. But when he saw healthy babies regress into autism, Dr. Thomas did a lot of research and developed a "Vaccine Friendly Plan".

Authorities challenged Dr. Thomas to prove his schedule was "safer" than CDC schedule. Dr. Thomas hired a consultant to examine his patients records.

Of those 2,645 partially vaccinated, 6 cases of autism were identified giving a rate of 1 in 440. Of the 715 who were 100% unvaccinated, only 1 case of autism.

Autism Rate:

Unvaccinated 1:715
Partially Vaccinated 1:440
CDC Vaccinated 1:50
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:37 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
In the 1950s and 1960s when there were only FOUR Vaccines given, children were not dying from infectious disease (very rare).

And today the Life Span is GOING DOWN. Children born today are expected to have a shorter lifespan than their parents due to high rate of chronic disease in children. There never was a high rate of chronic disease in children before the CDC QUADRUPLED the vaccine schedule in 1990!


The lifespan is going down as a result of both obesity and opioid addiction.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:42 pm
#BestBubby wrote:
Yes, it is the CDC who refuses to do the Vax vs UnVax Study - even though they were requested to so by congressmen. Some congressmen proposed a law to FORCE the
CDC to do a vax vs unvax study but the rest of the congressmen - who take millions from pharmaceutical industry - refused to force CDC to do a Vax vs UnVax study.


Do you have any reliable information about why the study wasn't done? Is there proof of bribery?
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amother
Beige


 

Post Thu, Nov 07 2019, 12:14 am
amother [ Pumpkin ] wrote:
I know someone in Montreal anti vaxxers and her child got autism and never had a vaccine


So amother pumpkin knows one person who is autistic and didn't get vaccines. And that proves that vaccines don't cause autism. Genius.
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amother
Beige


 

Post Thu, Nov 07 2019, 12:15 am
amother [ Pumpkin ] wrote:
Autism is genetic I have no clue where u have been researching your information


And I am sitting here scratching my head wondering where you research the information which you (don't) have.
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 07 2019, 12:26 am
southernbubby wrote:
Do you have any reliable information about why the study wasn't done? Is there proof of bribery?


No explanation why the study was not done - CDC refuses to say.

I am referring to "legal" bribery aka "campaign donations".
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nchr




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 07 2019, 7:17 am
amother [ Coffee ] wrote:
I don't know how it would be possible to design such a study that would properly exclude potentially complicating factors.

I happen to agree that this probably does deserve more study, but I don't know how that can be done.


Im not sure how to either, and doing so would be unethical. However, Anti vaxxers have funded their own "studies," and when you review the data, it just does not support that vaccines have anything to do with what they claim.

I personally think the actual numbers reported by the CDC arw higher than in reality for say a white middle class person because IRL I simply do not know many sick children and frum Jewish people, in particular, who have children late and marry their cousins tend to have sicker kids for such reason.
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nchr




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 07 2019, 7:20 am
amother [ Babyblue ] wrote:
So what has changed genetics to cause an increase? Electronics? Pesticides? Everyone is saying its not vaccines.


The most compelling data shows it has to do with our clean environments because children and adults raised on farms and rural environments are significantly less likely to have any autoimmune diseases.

We do not know what causes autism, but we probably will in the next few decades. We're beginning to be able to see difference on CT scans conducted at birth, etc. and know many genes play a role so well learn more about that..
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Nov 07 2019, 7:28 am
amother [ Beige ] wrote:
So amother pumpkin knows one person who is autistic and didn't get vaccines. And that proves that vaccines don't cause autism. Genius.


Autism is a broad term just like dementia is a broad term. Autism can occur in babies (may all yidden be spared) due to genetic mutations and the mother usually will see something different about her baby before the shots are given. Scientists are just starting to determine what mutations cause autism because sometimes other abnormalities occur with it. No one gene or genetic mutation reliably causes autism.

I sometimes either take my grandchildren to medical appointments or accompany the parents. I ask the doctor for a print-out of possible reactions to immunizations and ask under what circumstances I should be concerned about a reaction. I don't take for granted that there are risks and the CDC website also lists reactions that warrant medical attention.
Some children may be immunized in health departments, drug stores, and urgent care centers and when a severe reaction occurs, some go to the ER but some possibly don't seek help and lose the opportunity for a doctor to follow up and determine that vaccine injury has occurred.
It seems that if there is so much obvious injury, that more doctors would be concerned about it; enough so to inform the CDC.
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