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No antivaxers here please. Flu vax related question
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amother




Denim


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 9:32 am
abound wrote:
A different question: I gave my children flu shots a few years back and every single one of them got the flu that year, it was an insane winter. I did not give it for a few years after that and then I tried again, once again everyone got the flu. since then I stopped giving the flu shot. I give all the other shots so it is not an anti vax issue, I just see it is not working for my family. DOes anyone else have that experience?



It is a normal immune response to have fever and flu-like symptoms (NOT the flu) for a couple days after the flu shot. If you are not referring to that, then unfortunately your kids got the flu anyway because the flu shot is only about 50% effective. It is still important to get because kids who get the flu shot and get the flu anyway are more than 80% less likely end up in the ICU.
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amother




Turquoise


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 10:18 am
abound wrote:
A different question: I gave my children flu shots a few years back and every single one of them got the flu that year, it was an insane winter. I did not give it for a few years after that and then I tried again, once again everyone got the flu. since then I stopped giving the flu shot. I give all the other shots so it is not an anti vax issue, I just see it is not working for my family. DOes anyone else have that experience?


I had the same experience. When I asked the dr he said "oh, it's a different strain"
When my son had the flu without the shot he was sick the same amount of days as the kids that had it with the shot. (Diff seasons)
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amother




Forestgreen


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:08 am
I don't understand the need for two shots so the body will later "recognize the virus"? Every year the formulation is different. Often (approximately 50% of more of time, depending on the year) it's not effective at all which means that the person got the flu anyway. So the body DOES recognize the virus which it caught that year.

For example: year x the shot targeted viruses 1,2,3
person got sick with virus 4

next year, year y, they try to predict what the virus will be (often basing it on last year's) and target 4,5,6
but person is already immune to 4 because of last year and maybe 5 & 6 because of other years when they got sick and sometimes it was so mild nobody even knew.

I tutor in a school and 1 year, virtually all my students were immunized for the flu and they ALL got the flu. I didn't take the shot and didn't get sick. Go figure.
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Elfrida




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 11:52 am
I don't feel like going into all the immunological details, but the essence of the flu virus remains the same from year to year. That is how it is identified as the flu virus, rather than anything else. The mutations change from year to year.

Incidentally, the composition is dictated by the most prominent strains in the southern hemisphere over their recent winter, not by what was prominent on America last year.

As for sAying the children all got sick - well, they probably did, but are you sure it was actually influenza that they had? Children in their first year at school are exposed to a huge amount of new viruses from each other and a new environment. A lot of them cause generic flu-like symptoms; coughing, fever, muscle aches etc. (Any new teacher also gets this.) That doesn't mean that they actually had flu.
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amother




Forestgreen


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 12:17 pm
They were all several years in school already and claimed they had the flu which their parents would not assume so quickly if they had any faith in the vaccine.
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amother




Forestgreen


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 12:20 pm
In terms of the mutation you haven't answered that there is proof that the person isn't already immune to that mutation or how that extra shot helps for other years when the mutation is different.
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Elfrida




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 12:39 pm
I've just had a very long day at work, giving a huge amount of flu shots in addition to my normal workload. If you don't want to believe that it helps, thats up to you. I'm willing to answer genuine questions, but I'm not wasting my time convincing people who don't want to believe in it.
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amother




Forestgreen


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 12:42 pm
Just asking for information. If you don't know, sorry for offending you.
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Elfrida




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 12:51 pm
I promise you I know.

Go and look it up on the WHO website if you want all the details.
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amother




Forestgreen


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 12:56 pm
Thanks. Will do.
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amother




Bronze


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:03 pm
Elfrida wrote:
No, it's exactly the same shot, given twice. The immune system doesn't tends not to react too strongly from just a single exposure, so the first time a child (up to age eight) gets the shot we reccomend doing twice in the year to ensure that his immune system recognizes it and can react in the future. After that, his system has made acquaintance with the flu virus, so one annual dose is enough to recognize the variations that are around that year.


Is the recommendation the same even if the child tested positive for flu virus the previous year? I'm considering giving my kids the flu shot for the first time this year and want it to be as effective as possible without unnecessary injections.
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nchr




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:14 pm
amother [ Bronze ] wrote:
Is the recommendation the same even if the child tested positive for flu virus the previous year? I'm considering giving my kids the flu shot for the first time this year and want it to be as effective as possible without unnecessary injections.


Probably the same. AFAIAA, let's think about it as dogs. You know that an Akita, Pug, Poodle, Bulldog and Husky are all dogs, but if you have only seen a Pug and an Akita you may not recognize them as the same species and later realize that a Poodle is also that species. So if your child has only been exposed to one flu - his body may not yet recognize other flus as the flu. Does that make sense? The more flus one is shown, like dogs, the more like s/he will recognize them for what they are.
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amother




Bronze


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:17 pm
nchr wrote:
Probably the same. AFAIAA, let's think about it as dogs. You know that an Akita, Pug, Poodle, Bulldog and Husky are all dogs, but if you have only seen a Pug and an Akita you may not recognize them as the same species and later realize that a Poodle is also that species. So if your child has only been exposed to one flu - his body may not yet recognize other flus as the flu. Does that make sense? The more flus one is shown, like dogs, the more like s/he will recognize them for what they are.
.
I don't see how that has anything to do with the recommendation to do two flu shots the first year a child is getting it.
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amother




Slategray


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:41 pm
amother [ Bronze ] wrote:
Is the recommendation the same even if the child tested positive for flu virus the previous year? I'm considering giving my kids the flu shot for the first time this year and want it to be as effective as possible without unnecessary injections.


I always gave the flu shot this year I was laxxed about it and my son has the flu without the shot his fever spiked 106 he’s sick as a dog at this point I’m trying to keep him out of the hospital. When my kids got the flu with having the flu shot they had a mild case 2 days or just not feeling well no high fever .
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amother




Bronze


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:43 pm
amother [ Slategray ] wrote:
I always gave the flu shot this year I was laxxed about it and my son has the flu without the shot his fever spiked 106 he’s sick as a dog at this point I’m trying to keep him out of the hospital. When my kids got the flu with having the flu shot they had a mild case 2 days or just not feeling well no high fever .


My question was whether it's necessary to get two flu shots the first year even the child has definitely been sick from a flu virus in the past. Not whether or not to give the flu shot each year.
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amother




Slategray


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:44 pm
amother [ Bronze ] wrote:
My question was whether it's necessary to get two flu shots the first year even the child has definitely been sick from a flu virus in the past. Not whether or not to give the flu shot each year.


My doc always gave one so not sure why it seems some docs give two
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nchr




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:52 pm
My children who are under 8 years old all receive 2 doses of the vaccine. It has shown to be most effective the first year though when a child is still an infant, but I'm pretty sure it is still recommended for toddlers and children under 8 who have previously received a flu vaccine because our pediatrician recommends it and our insurance covers it.
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Chayalle




 
 
 


Post  Wed, Nov 06 2019, 1:54 pm
abound wrote:
A different question: I gave my children flu shots a few years back and every single one of them got the flu that year, it was an insane winter. I did not give it for a few years after that and then I tried again, once again everyone got the flu. since then I stopped giving the flu shot. I give all the other shots so it is not an anti vax issue, I just see it is not working for my family. DOes anyone else have that experience?


I think some years the flu is just worse and more prevalent, so more people get it. Could be that's why your kids got it then.

Two years ago my entire family got the flu in early December. We moved that year and I hadn't gotten around to getting us flu shots....I can't tell you what it was like, it was just so awful. All of us were really sick.

Right after that, DH and I got the flu shot.

And then a month later, my kids all got the flu AGAIN - twice in one year. At around that time, I felt like a little ill - not myself, but I didn't get the flu. I'm guessing I got it a little but due to the flu shot, I didn't get the full-scale virus. DH B"H didn't get it at all the 2nd time around.

Two weeks ago my niece had the flu. She had a fever of 104. B"H for tamiflu.

I took my whole family for flu shots, and B"H so far so good.
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