Do you hold of the Eruv in Flatbush?

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cnc

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 6:05 pm

TriAspora wrote:

One can hold of the eruv described in erub.org or not, but this attack is rather feeble. You are questioning Sephardic Rabbinic Council, but the 2003 letter is signed by the chief rabbi of Syrian communities at the time, so it is a respectable organization. And why do you think the eruv needs a Haskomo letter every year? If they did not change the borders or the eruv and the method of how it is maintained, then the original Haskomo stands. Eruv is not a pizza store that needs certification renewal. Websites for Kew Gardens and Kew Gardens Hills eruvim have no Haskomos whatsoever, but these eruvim are widely accepted.

Also, a brief internet search reveals that "a Rabbi Alouf" is Rabbi Shimon Alouf, Rabbi of Shul, posek and student of Rabbi Ovadia Yosef. And why is it a problem that other rabbis supporting the eruv do not live in Brooklyn? Halocho is the same everywhere. R' Moshe Feinstein arranged the eruuv in Queens, but he did not live there. Finally, your idea that all rabbis need to sign off on the eruv is not realistic at all, this is not done anywhere.

So, you did not research the topic, did not prove a single point and are anonymously questioning the integrity of people you know nothing about basing your opinion on hearsay. Does your rabbi approve?

Eruvs need to be maintained halachically...
I would not rely on a Psak from 16 years ago. (And I DO hold of both the BP and the Flatbush Eruv.)

TriAspora

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 6:13 pm

cnc wrote:

Eruvs need to be maintained halachically...
I would not rely on a Psak from 16 years ago. (And I DO hold of both the BP and the Flatbush Eruv.)

What about some of the other well know eruvim? Do all of them have received updated Haskomo letters every few years just to keep people who know more about politics than Halocho happy? I doubt so.

ra_mom

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 6:37 pm

TriAspora wrote:

What about some of the other well know eruvim? Do all of them have received updated Haskomo letters every few years just to keep people who know more about politics than Halocho happy? I doubt so.

They have trucks that go around every week to make sure they are still kosher for the upcoming shabbos. I am sure Flatbush does the same. Find out.

cnc

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 6:39 pm

TriAspora wrote:

What about some of the other well know eruvim? Do all of them have received updated Haskomo letters every few years just to keep people who know more about politics than Halocho happy? I doubt so.

Of course they do.
Much more often than once every few years. There is an Eruv committee headed by a Rav that checks the Eruv weekly.

TriAspora

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 6:47 pm

ra_mom wrote:

They have trucks that go around every week to make sure they are still kosher for the upcoming shabbos. I am sure Flatbush does the same. Find out.

Don't mix up the weekly checking the eruv borders and a Haskomo letter approving the eruv concept (that does not need to be re-issued if nothing changes). The attack on the eruv on this thread are ahalachic and purely political.

cbsp

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 8:51 pm

TriAspora wrote:

Rav Moishe's objection was political????

amother

Smokey

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 11:16 pm

cbsp wrote:

Rav Moishe's objection was political????

This. People’s desire to do whatever they want makes them throw halacha concern out the window.

amother

Smokey

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 11:19 pm

amother [ Silver ] wrote:

I just want to add the " new" eruv is fully kasher to the strictest standards although I do not know who checks it each week for shabbas and where you can find that info. .

Yeh this is what I hear from people who use the flatbush eiruv, I d’nt know which rabbi okays it or which rabbi checks it. So why are you using it? Because I want to.

dovebird

Sun, Nov 10 2019, 11:50 pm

amother [ Smokey ] wrote:

This. People’s desire to do whatever they want makes them throw halacha concern out the window.

Actually not. It’s more political than you think. Harav Ovadia says the eruv is okay, but he said he’s not paskening against Rav Moshe on it. That sounds pretty political if you ask me.

cbsp

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 8:03 am

dovebird wrote:

Actually not. It’s more political than you think. Harav Ovadia says the eruv is okay, but he said he’s not paskening against Rav Moshe on it. That sounds pretty political if you ask me.

And with that you just demonstrated how little you know of the halachic process.

To disrespected Rav Ovadia like that???

PinkFridge

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 9:37 am

Without making any judgment on this eruv, I would not want to use an eiruv that wasn't checked weekly, with some way for laypeople to find out about the status. I've heard of communities that have an updated hot line that allows you to check. Obviously, if someone checks, there is a reputable checker, and a rav whom he consults.

All you need to do is find out this info and you're good to go!

dovebird

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 11:46 am

cbsp wrote:

And with that you just demonstrated how little you know of the halachic process.

To disrespected Rav Ovadia like that???

You are right- I do not know much about the halachic process.
But I would never ever disrespect Rav Ovadia and my statement wasn’t meant to be disrespectful.

cbsp

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 12:03 pm

dovebird wrote:

You are right- I do not know much about the halachic process.
But I would never ever disrespect Rav Ovadia and my statement wasn’t meant to be disrespectful.

Ascribing political (or any non-halachic) motive to a halachic ruling is disrespectful and dismissive, regardless of intent.

dovebird

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 12:19 pm

cbsp wrote:

Ascribing political (or any non-halachic) motive to a halachic ruling is disrespectful and dismissive, regardless of intent.

It was not a halachic ruling.
I might have been wrong for saying it was “political”. I could rephrase and say Rav Ovadia didn’t paskan against Rav Moshe out of respect. But then there is the question of why R Ovadia didn’t feel that way with regards to other psaks that were against other big rabbis.

amother

Smokey

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 4:35 pm

amother [ Vermilion ] wrote:

and I am quite familiar with the "SephardicRabbinaical council" and certainly questioning them, as they are but 1 shul among many Sephardic Shuls in the area. I already know that is it Rabbi Shimon Alouf who is a Rabbi in Ahave V' Ahava on Ocean Parkway Congreation. There are some controversies involvoed with this council. (isn't Sephardic Synagoue on Ave R, the shul that let women dance with the Sefer Torah recently?) They are known for being liberal.
And no, Halacha, is not the same everywhere. "Oseh lechah Rav" You pick ONE Rabbi and you ask him ALL your shailiahs. You can't pick and choose, "oh this Rav paskens this way, so I'll follow him and then for another shailiah, you pick a different rav. Rav Belsky opposed the Flatbush Eruv.
Because the Ocean parkway is a major issue(which runs through Flatbush and I am not taliking about Boro Park, because I am not familar with the Rebbes involved in that decision). There is a problem.
Israeli rabbi's shouldn't decide if a Eruv is kosher, when there are MANY Rabbis in the Area already. There is practically a shul on every corner in Flatbush, yet why is there only ONE Shul who is listed on the "Sephardic Rabbinical Council??!!'
I am quite familiar with many of the Sephardic/Syrian Rabbis in the area and I can quite postively say, they do NOT hold by that "Flatbush Eruv".
And as for as a Haskomo for every year. Just like a Store needs to have it's hecher renewed every year, to make sure it Kashrut is update, so to an Eruv needs to be checked that it is kosher, even more so then a store, It most be checked weekly. Who exactly is doing the checking of the Eruv before Shabbos?? The area involved is huge!!

You’re so right and it looks like it comes down to who’s serious about keeping Shabbat and who is just looking for any loophole so they can do what they want.

amother

Smokey

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 4:37 pm

TriAspora wrote:

Why are you casting aspersions? If you don't trust the eruv or are unfamiliar with the supervising rabbis, don't carry, by all means. But don't attack the people who carry just because you don't have all the information. The front page of the website erub.org clearly states that the eruv is checked weekly and a status email is sent. I am sure it's easy to find out who does the checking. And of course the weekly checking is totally different from Haskomo, which is given when eruv is established and does not have to be re-issued unless the setup changes. Like I have said before, Queens eruvim, which are widely accepted, don't list even one haskomo on the website, but only the weekly status. You are free to trust or not, to carry or not, but your attack is without merit.

The fact that you’re fine with it and you even admit you have no idea who checks it is a problem

amother

Smokey

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 4:39 pm

ra_mom wrote:

They have trucks that go around every week to make sure they are still kosher for the upcoming shabbos. I am sure Flatbush does the same. Find out.

It’s not good enough to assume Flatbush does the same. No one here can give us a name who checks it. That tells it.

amother

Smokey

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 4:39 pm

cnc wrote:

Of course they do.
Much more often than once every few years. There is an Eruv committee headed by a Rav that checks the Eruv weekly.

Here’s another one, everyone is guaranteeing it’s checked but no t one person could say who’s checking it

amother

Smokey

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 4:41 pm

TriAspora wrote:

The attack on the eruv on this thread are ahalachic and purely political.

That’s a horrible and false thing to say. I’m sure anyone who doesn’t agree with you is only trying to prevent others from chilul Shabbat

amother

Smokey

Mon, Nov 11 2019, 4:42 pm

dovebird wrote:

Actually not. It’s more political than you think. Harav Ovadia says the eruv is okay, but he said he’s not paskening against Rav Moshe on it. That sounds pretty political if you ask me.

He didn’t live here and if e said he’s not going against Rav Moshe then kal v’choimer no lay person should either

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