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Forum
-> Children's Health
-> Vaccinations
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amother
Plum
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 Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:29 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: |
C. Keep your kids away from her children |
Sure. Because the minute she stopped vaxxing, her kids suddenly started carrying all kinds of disease in their pockets. Run for your life! 
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amother
Natural
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:30 am
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Honestly the whole philosophy about humans being born with perfect bodies sounds like it's straight out of the Greek/Hellenistic worldview. I've been listening to Jewish history lectures. That's exactly what they espoused and it is antithetical to the Torah view.
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amother
Sapphire
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:30 am
| amother [ Plum ] wrote: | The idea of herd immunity comes from when a whole city of children got the infection at once and once they did, nobody got it until the next generation of children got it, which also served to boost the immunity of the kids who had it already. With the natural infection it works, because everyone develops immunity (unlike the vaccine) and immunity doesn't wear off (unlike the vaccine). That is real herd immunity.
Herd immunity can't ever occur with the vaccine because of two factors:
1. Some people don't develop immunity regardless of how many doses they get. And even when you do develop immunity it may or may not wear off with time. So we will always have pockets of people who are not protected.
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2. Let's take chicken pox for example. Young children are getting a vaccine against a mostly benign childhood infection. So the rates of chicken pox decreased. We know that immunity gets boosted if you are next to a child who has an infection which you are immune to. So when all children had chicken pox you hardly heard of an adult getting shingles because their immunity was constantly upped. Now that we have only a handful of kids getting chicken pox, we are not exposed to the infection and adults are not getting the required natural immunity booster. So ironically, in this sense, vaccines are preventing herd immunity to certain diseases from happening. |
SO BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE DONT DEVELOP IMMUNITY FROM VACCINES WE SHOULD JUST NOT ADMINISTER THE VACCINES AT ALL AND LET EVERYONE CATCH DEADLY DISEASES? AND THIS IS EXACTLY WHY WE NEED TO VACCINATE TO PROTECT THE SMALL POCKETS OF PEOPLE THAT AREN'T IMMUNED . ESPECIALLY THE ELDERLY, BABIES AND SICK
Immunity constantly getting upped?! Never heard this terminology in my life. Did you make this up or read this in peach magazine ?
But if everyone is getting the chicken pox vaccine then how are older people contracting the shingles ? I'll tell you how.. because of the kids that aren't getting the chicken pox vaccine ! If everyone would in fact get the vaccine then older people wouldnt have whom to catch the shingles from !
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amother
Jetblack
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:32 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: | Just because shes educated and worldly doesn't mean she knows anything regarding vaccines and b. Why dont you ask her why she became an anti vaxxer ?
C. Keep your kids away from her children |
She's actually a medical professional and someone I've always trusted as having good judgment.
Yes I asked her why she became antivax, the conversations go in complete circles which is part of why it's so frustrating. When I ask her a question about something she says, she changes topic. Like, it's not vaccines that prevented measles, it's hygiene, vaccines only help in third world countries where there's no running water. Ok, then how was there a measles outbreak in Israel? Oh, you should read this really great blog post about the chemicals they put into vaccines.
Her kids are vaxed afaik bec this is recent.
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amother
Plum
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:32 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: | Immunity constantly getting upped?! Never heard this terminology in my life. Did you make this up or read this in peach magazine ?
But if everyone is getting the chicken pox vaccine then how are older people contracting the shingles ? I'll tell you how.. because of the kids that aren't getting the chicken pox vaccine ! If everyone would in fact get the vaccine then older people wouldnt have whom to catch the shingles from ! |
Talk about lack of reading comprehension skills...  
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amother
Olive
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:33 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: |
But if everyone is getting the chicken pox vaccine then how are older people contracting the shingles ? I'll tell you how.. because of the kids that aren't getting the chicken pox vaccine ! If everyone would in fact get the vaccine then older people wouldnt have whom to catch the shingles from ! |
Um. this is not exactly true. Once you've had chicken pox, the disease stays dormant in your body. As you get older & weaker or sick & stressed, the body cannot hold on to the dormancy and the virus becomes active again.
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amother
Olive
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:33 am
| amother [ Plum ] wrote: | | Talk about lack of reading comprehension skills... |
It's not lack of reading comprehension, it's just a lack of scientific knowledge. Which just proves an earlier poster's point.
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amother
Jetblack
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:34 am
| amother [ Royalblue ] wrote: | | I wont out myself here but im already a third generation antivaxer so no peach and no hotline , it started out as a philosophical objection going against being forced to inject unnatural foreign matter for the sake officially of becoming healthier. didnt make sense from a hashkafadik and common sense angle. We believe a perfect Gd created humans perfect except male babies need bris. didnt make sense to say He made them with missing vit k and missing antibodies. injecting disease to avoid disease is trying to outsmart Gd and not in line with how we yidden view Gd. the same mentality thats against dor yeshorim. lo sachakor achar hoasidos. this is imo a true example of a religious belief even though its not judaism who says this but one persons take on it. they lived their whole life in line with their belief, not pick and choose. then as the schedule grew the resistance grew. much later came the awareness of adverse reactions. |
I agree this is a religious belief and is the one belief that should legitimately qualify for a religious exemption. That said I don't think it's a Jewish belief, more along the lines of Seventh day adventists.
Since when are Jews against medicine?
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amother
Plum
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:35 am
| amother [ Olive ] wrote: | | It's not lack of reading comprehension, it's just a lack of scientific knowledge. Which just proves an earlier poster's point. |
what point?
To me it just proves that most provaxxers vaccinate out of default and not because of scientific backing...
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amother
Sapphire
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:36 am
| amother [ Jetblack ] wrote: | She's actually a medical professional and someone I've always trusted as having good judgment.
Yes I asked her why she became antivax, the conversations go in complete circles which is part of why it's so frustrating. When I ask her a question about something she says, she changes topic. Like, it's not vaccines that prevented measles, it's hygiene, vaccines only help in third world countries where there's no running water. Ok, then how was there a measles outbreak in Israel? Oh, you should read this really great blog post about the chemicals they put into vaccines.
Her kids are vaxed afaik bec this is recent. |
What kind of medical professional are we talking about ?
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amother
Olive
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:36 am
| amother [ Plum ] wrote: | what point?
To me it just proves that most provaxxers vaccinate out of default and not because of scientific backing... |
It proves that many on both sides of the aisle lack scientific knowledge, both provaxxers & anti vaxxers.
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amother
Blue
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:38 am
| amother [ Ecru ] wrote: | | If you are going to quote the few, unfortunate mistakes of the drug companies and the medical field, then don't take advantage of any part of modern medicine. I dare you to go drug free the rest of your life. Don't you dare go to the eye dr, they didn't have those 1000 years ago. Give birth in your own bed with only a neighbor to help you, and never step into an ER. |
Drug companies are a business like any other. I would like to use manufactured products at my own discretion. Not have them forced on me.
Pictures of thalidomide babies traumatize me. And I get so nauseous during pregnancy I lost 30 lbs last time within the first 12 weeks. To think drs would give these prescriptions out thinking it's safe. Horrifying.
And you'd think theyd stop making that stuff. Nope thalidomide babies are back because I read that it's used in a 3rd world country for a diff reason.
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amother
Plum
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:38 am
| amother [ Olive ] wrote: | | It proves that many on both sides of the aisle lack scientific knowledge, both provaxxers & anti vaxxers. |
Fair enough. I won't stereotype and would appreciate if you can do the same.
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amother
Olive
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:39 am
| amother [ Plum ] wrote: | | Fair enough. I won't stereotype and would appreciate if you can do the same. |
Where have I done so?
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amother
Sapphire
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:40 am
| amother [ Olive ] wrote: | | Um. this is not exactly true. Once you've had chicken pox, the disease stays dormant in your body. As you get older & weaker or sick & stressed, the body cannot hold on to the dormancy and the virus becomes active again. |
Older people dont contract shingles only because the virus is dormant . They can in fact contract it from others . The varicella virus is in fact contagious.
°(it is true though that if you did have chicken pox when you were younger that the varicella virus will be dormant in your nervous system primarily near your spine and brain but if you never had the chicken pox you most definitely can catch it and shingles is most definitely contagious)
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amother
Blue
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:41 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: | SO BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE DONT DEVELOP IMMUNITY FROM VACCINES WE SHOULD JUST NOT ADMINISTER THE VACCINES AT ALL AND LET EVERYONE CATCH DEADLY DISEASES? AND THIS IS EXACTLY WHY WE NEED TO VACCINATE TO PROTECT THE SMALL POCKETS OF PEOPLE THAT AREN'T IMMUNED . ESPECIALLY THE ELDERLY, BABIES AND SICK
Immunity constantly getting upped?! Never heard this terminology in my life. Did you make this up or read this in peach magazine ?
But if everyone is getting the chicken pox vaccine then how are older people contracting the shingles ? I'll tell you how.. because of the kids that aren't getting the chicken pox vaccine ! If everyone would in fact get the vaccine then older people wouldnt have whom to catch the shingles from ! |
You cant catch shingles from a kid who has chicken pox.
That's one of the ludicrous myths that go around.
Anyone who at any point had chickenpox virus in them, whether from the illness or the shot, can later on get shingles.
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amother
Plum
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:42 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: | | Older people dont contract shingles only because the virus is dormant . They can in fact contract it from others . The varicella virus is in fact contagious. |
But if they have immunity to chicken pox they will generally not contract it.
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amother
Natural
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:43 am
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No, not if you've had the chicken pox vaccine. Only if you've had the chicken pox.
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amother
Plum
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:43 am
| amother [ Olive ] wrote: | | Where have I done so? |
I meant the general provax population who claim that all antivaxxers are ignorant morons with no scientific knowledge. I didn't mean you specifically.
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amother
Jetblack
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Thu, Dec 12 2019, 12:47 am
| amother [ Sapphire ] wrote: | | What kind of medical professional are we talking about ? |
Even though we're anon I don't want to give too many details, dunno if she's on here. The point is that she's always been well articulated and suddenly, saying things that make no sense to me. I'm not a medical or science professional. So either I'm too dumb to get it, or I dunno. It's disturbing to me that's all.
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