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Using Yiddish name--should we keep unusual spelling?
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meyerlemon44




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 5:16 pm
My grandmother's name was Shaindel, but she spelled it with one yud insteal of two. Should we preserve the spelling or use the usual spelling? I'm torn on the issue.
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amother




Plum
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 5:28 pm
Nice name they call my cousin sheindy
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pizza4




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 5:32 pm
It's up to you. I'd probably use the usual spelling to make it easier on everyone.
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nchr




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 6:05 pm
Keep one yud. That's actually the correct halachic spelling. You can call someone who deals with gitten to confirm if you want..
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amother




Peach
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 6:10 pm
My parents spelled my name the way my it was spelled on the person I’m named afters matzeiva. Came to my wedding and the mesader kedushin insisted on a different spelling for my kesubah. I would def ask a Rav if I wasn’t sure what the accepted spelling was for my kids. It was very odd for me to be told I was spelling it wrong my whole life.
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amother




Cerise
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 6:50 pm
We named our daughter Kayla after my grandmother. The usual spellings are either kuf yud lamed heh or kuf yud yud lamed alef. My mother was sure that her mother spelled the name kuf yud lamed alef and someone even went to the kever to check for us. Since we were naming for a specific person we used the spelling she used even if it was unusual. If we had just picked the name because we liked it we would have gone with the Hebrew spelling ending with a heh over the Yiddish version.
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MommyM




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 8:06 pm
nchr wrote:
Keep one yud. That's actually the correct halachic spelling. You can call someone who deals with gitten to confirm if you want..


Yes, many yiddish names with the two yudin for the "tzeirei" sound are actually officially written with one "yud" in one of the seforim on gitten.
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nchr




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 8:17 pm
MommyM wrote:
Yes, many yiddish names with the two yudin for the "tzeirei" sound are actually officially written with one "yud" in one of the seforim on gitten.


That is because the two yuds is Yiddish and NOT Lashon HaKodesh. Halachic spellings are in Lashon HaKodesh.
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meyerlemon44




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 9:25 pm
nchr wrote:
That is because the two yuds is Yiddish and NOT Lashon HaKodesh. Halachic spellings are in Lashon HaKodesh.


I have never heard this before and it doesn’t make sense to me. I’m pretty sure people who have a Yiddish language name spell it the way it’s commonly spelled on halachic documents.
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nchr




 
 
 
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 9:29 pm
meyerlemon44 wrote:
I have never heard this before and it doesn’t make sense to me. I’m pretty sure people who have a Yiddish language name spell it the way it’s commonly spelled on halachic documents.


There are seforim on names for gitten and you'd be surprised just how many "common" ways to spell names are wrong. However, there are people who are careful about spelling and look it up/discuss with a Rav. And there may also be different opinions because we are talking about Jews here lol
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amother




Khaki
 

Post  Thu, Dec 19 2019, 10:48 pm
I have a daughter Bayla. We asked our Rav how we should spell it because the relative she was named after spelled it ביילא but we weren't sure. Rav said the correct spelling is בילא because there is some old halachic sefer on names and Bayla is really Aramaic not Yiddish despite common misconception.

My point, ask your LOR.
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amother




White
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 12:18 am
amother [ Cerise ] wrote:
We named our daughter Kayla after my grandmother. The usual spellings are either kuf yud lamed heh or kuf yud yud lamed alef. My mother was sure that her mother spelled the name kuf yud lamed alef and someone even went to the kever to check for us. Since we were naming for a specific person we used the spelling she used even if it was unusual. If we had just picked the name because we liked it we would have gone with the Hebrew spelling ending with a heh over the Yiddish version.


My sister Kayla is also kuf-yud-lamed-alef.

I thought Yiddish names don't end in "hey".
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malki2




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 12:40 am
nchr wrote:
That is because the two yuds is Yiddish and NOT Lashon HaKodesh. Halachic spellings are in Lashon HaKodesh.


So Shaindel is Lashon Hakodesh?
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b.chadash




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 12:42 am
amother [ Khaki ] wrote:
I have a daughter Bayla. We asked our Rav how we should spell it because the relative she was named after spelled it ביילא but we weren't sure. Rav said the correct spelling is בילא because there is some old halachic sefer on names and Bayla is really Aramaic not Yiddish despite common misconception.

My point, ask your LOR.


Correct. בילא is not Yiddish. Its an acronym for ברוך ה' לעולם אמן


Last edited by b.chadash on Fri, Dec 20 2019, 12:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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b.chadash




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 12:42 am
Double post
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nchr




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 6:37 am
malki2 wrote:
So Shaindel is Lashon Hakodesh?


Shaindel is Yiddish but that doesn't mean that it's halachic spelling is with two yuds. I don't know how to explain it any other way. Maybe the other poster who quoted me can expound on it better. There is a sefer on gitten and almost all names that people spell with two yuds are identified in that sefer as truely having on one yud. Also, as is not the case with Shaindel, many Yiddish names are just Jewishisms of vernacular so they have no true Yiddish spelling. In most instances, spelling really means nothing. All seforim on it are for gitten which most people will never deal with.
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JoyInTheMorning




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 7:17 am
b.chadash wrote:
Correct. בילא is not Yiddish. Its an acronym for ברוך ה' לעולם אמן


See https://judaism.stackexchange......earch for some interesting discussion on this. My own feeling is that these acronyms are usually given after a name has already gained some popularity, since no one I know creates an acronym when they set out to give a name for their child.
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thanks




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 7:20 am
b.chadash wrote:
Correct. בילא is not Yiddish. Its an acronym for ברוך ה' לעולם אמן

Bayala come from the root belle, which means beautiful. It's like yaffa.

It was common to give Yiddish names like that in the 1500' s. Some are translations like fayga for tzipporah. Imagine if we created new names like that today in English, Hebrew, or even yiddish. Anyone who does, is considered "modern". The custom to name after ancestors is fairly new.
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Ruchel




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 7:55 am
Define fairly new... is thousand fairly new? Possibly more.

There can various good spellings. I would ask a specialist
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MommyM




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Dec 20 2019, 8:04 am
nchr wrote:
Shaindel is Yiddish but that doesn't mean that it's halachic spelling is with two yuds. I don't know how to explain it any other way. Maybe the other poster who quoted me can expound on it better. There is a sefer on gitten and almost all names that people spell with two yuds are identified in that sefer as truely having on one yud. Also, as is not the case with Shaindel, many Yiddish names are just Jewishisms of vernacular so they have no true Yiddish spelling. In most instances, spelling really means nothing. All seforim on it are for gitten which most people will never deal with.


I will try... To clarify that I don't know how names get halachik spellings. However, the sefer on gittin has the "tzeirei" sound as one "yud" for many names with that sound. Although nowadays that sound in Yiddish has two "yud"s, in true grammatical Yiddish, one "yud" can also be used, which is how these names were written. I don't know more of the whys or how these names got their halochik spellings, but this is the explanation I got when I was looking into it.
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