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S/O Working women collapsing
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First Lady




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 09 2020, 11:09 pm
PurpleandGold wrote:
Hi op,

Would you like to know the real reason some women are working to the point of burn out, while other women are not burdened with supporting their families?

The answer is Beliefs - the strong beliefs we all adopted in childhood, that are so deeply embedded in our subconscious minds, we dont even realize they are driving our every choice and decision. Some women developed the belief that money is hard to come by, that earning a living is stressful and one person cannot possibly support his household, and that she will inevitably have to sacrifice many of her desires and her peace of mind to support her family financially. Other women developed the belief that money will come to them, that they will attract a man to support them while they immerse themselves in motherhood, that to be truly feminine and successful they need to concentrate solely on domestic concerns. Still other women developed the belief that they will actualize their full feminine potential as mothers and career women in positions that give them great satisfaction...it's all only beliefs...what we BELIEVE will always play out in our lives.

We are told that deep emunah is the catalyst for the creation of circumstances...the women in Mitzrayim BELIEVED so completely in the coming redemption they already had tambourines of celebration waiting...and that belief brought about their geulah.

Stop looking around at others, you've tried the victim's mentality, tried the jealousy mentality, and where has it gotten you? Still overworked and burned out! Look INSIDE...ask yourself, "What is my relationship with money? What do feel it takes to have enough money? What was my parents' relationship with money? What strong beliefs did I pick up from my home and family that I didn't even realize were penetrating when I was just a tiny child? What does my conscious mind say I "should" do to be a good enough woman? Why do I think that? What do I REALLY want?" Use pen and paper and write it all out.

Once you've solidified which beliefs you really want, talk to the little girl inside you. Tell her often what her new beliefs are. Do this for 30 days. Repeat to your inner child what it takes to have money, to be a satisfied, fulfilled woman and mother, and that Hashem is kol Yachol and can change your life in an instant. Daven for your true desires. Be brave, not a victim...see what happens....

Lots of love to you! We all have this inner journey to make in some area of life!


Beautiful post.
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Einikel




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 09 2020, 11:47 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
They're not well off but spend like they are and don't take on any financial responsibilities.
.


I did not read all responses but as a chassidish woman I’m floored by this generalization. I work hard and live with a budget. Please don’t put all chassidim in one box. And btw I usually end up doing the bills.
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mig100




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 09 2020, 11:51 pm
PurpleandGold wrote:
Hi op,

Would you like to know the real reason some women are working to the point of burn out, while other women are not burdened with supporting their families?

The answer is Beliefs - the strong beliefs we all adopted in childhood, that are so deeply embedded in our subconscious minds, we dont even realize they are driving our every choice and decision. Some women developed the belief that money is hard to come by, that earning a living is stressful and one person cannot possibly support his household, and that she will inevitably have to sacrifice many of her desires and her peace of mind to support her family financially. Other women developed the belief that money will come to them, that they will attract a man to support them while they immerse themselves in motherhood, that to be truly feminine and successful they need to concentrate solely on domestic concerns. Still other women developed the belief that they will actualize their full feminine potential as mothers and career women in positions that give them great satisfaction...it's all only beliefs...what we BELIEVE will always play out in our lives.

We are told that deep emunah is the catalyst for the creation of circumstances...the women in Mitzrayim BELIEVED so completely in the coming redemption they already had tambourines of celebration waiting...and that belief brought about their geulah.

Stop looking around at others, you've tried the victim's mentality, tried the jealousy mentality, and where has it gotten you? Still overworked and burned out! Look INSIDE...ask yourself, "What is my relationship with money? What do feel it takes to have enough money? What was my parents' relationship with money? What strong beliefs did I pick up from my home and family that I didn't even realize were penetrating when I was just a tiny child? What does my conscious mind say I "should" do to be a good enough woman? Why do I think that? What do I REALLY want?" Use pen and paper and write it all out.

Once you've solidified which beliefs you really want, talk to the little girl inside you. Tell her often what her new beliefs are. Do this for 30 days. Repeat to your inner child what it takes to have money, to be a satisfied, fulfilled woman and mother, and that Hashem is kol Yachol and can change your life in an instant. Daven for your true desires. Be brave, not a victim...see what happens....

Lots of love to you! We all have this inner journey to make in some area of life!


Can I like a thousand times!!!

Thanks for taking the time for posting. Beautiful.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 12:00 am
mig100 wrote:
Can I like a thousand times!!!

Thanks for taking the time for posting. Beautiful.


Beautiful in theory. In practice, either their husbands make a good living or they are deep in debt (the small sample of women you know who seem to be endlessly spending, by no means describing a community!)
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amother
Denim


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 12:52 am
PurpleandGold wrote:
Hi ...
The answer is Beliefs - the strong beliefs we all adopted in childhood, that are so deeply embedded in our subconscious minds, we dont even realize they are driving our every choice and decision. Some women developed the belief that money is hard to come by, that earning a living is stressful and one person cannot possibly support his household, and that she will inevitably have to sacrifice many of her desires and her peace of mind to support her family financially. Other women developed the belief that money will come to them, that they will attract a man to support them while they immerse themselves in motherhood, that to be truly feminine and successful they need to concentrate solely on domestic concerns. Still other women developed the belief that they will actualize their full feminine potential as mothers and career women in positions that give them great satisfaction...it's all only beliefs...what we BELIEVE will always play out in our lives.

We are told that deep emunah is the catalyst for the creation of circumstances...the women in Mitzrayim BELIEVED so completely in the coming redemption they already had tambourines of celebration waiting...and that belief brought about their geulah.

Stop looking around at others, you've tried the victim's mentality, tried the jealousy mentality, and where has it gotten you? Still overworked and burned out! Look INSIDE...ask yourself, "What is my relationship with money? What do feel it takes to have enough money? What was my parents' relationship with money? What strong beliefs did I pick up from my home and family that I didn't even realize were penetrating when I was just a tiny child? What does my conscious mind say I "should" do to be a good enough woman? Why do I think that? What do I REALLY want?" Use pen and paper and write it all 9eliefs you really want, talk to the little girl inside you. Tell her often what her new beliefs are. Do this for 30 days. Repeat to your inner child what it takes to have money, to be a satisfied, fulfilled woman and mother, and that Hashem is kol Yachol and can change your life in an instant. Daven for your true desires. Be brave, not a victim...see what happens....

Lots of love to you! We all have this inner journey to make in some area of life!


So hard for me to hear but so necessary.
Saving to refer to. THANK YOU
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amother
Yellow


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 4:45 am
Wait! Klei kodesh are not the ones living the hi life?
I thought they get discounts in all stores, they get coupons twice a year before yom tov, to get free clothes/shoes/ groceries/meat/matzah.
They work exactly only when their kids have school & are off together with them. Being so, why can't your hub take care of your kids then, why do you need a babysitter?
Which working man gets off on fast days because he is fasting & has erev yom tov off, and isru chag off, bein hazmanim off, before pesach so he can help with pesach cleaning & before sukkos so he can build the sukkah?
Why can't your dh take on some responsibility when he has off?
If he is a rebbe for young kids he literally works from 10-3! Which office guy has so few hours & can spend time with the kids.?
Mostly all Catskill homes are filled with such type. They continue the job there but get free bungalow all summer plus food and all their children can join the camp/daycamp program for free. How much money is saved there?
If they work in same mosdos as their children attend they get free tuition?
Eta: which other working guy gets tipped so generously on Chanuka & Purim?
What about your husband getting free lunches daily? and bringing home the extras for supper?
Maybe you just need the right connections!
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amother
Burgundy


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 10:46 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
You're right, in the chassidish world, if a man is learning long term in Kollel, the onus isn't on the wife to support. Even if they leave kollel and enter chinuch, the wife still isn't necessarily picking up the slack and it's on the man somehow to make ends meet, not the wife! Her attitude is I have enough on my head with my home and children. I have relatives who never worked a day in their life, even once all children were in school and there was no money in the house. It's such a mentality!
Yes, I know there are plenty of litvish women not working and living comfortably but my point is, you won't find a chassidish woman collapsing and not managing bec she has to support her family.


I'm not sure why you keep saying that.
There are chassidish women collapsing just as there are everywhere else.
I am chassidish.
I work, very very very hard.
I run my own business. Scrimp and save every stupid dollar and rethink any luxury a million times.
If we go on a vacation it's because months before we started saving dollar by dollar and managed to eke something out, and part of it is from the tax return.
It sounds like the people in your family are different. Ok, good for them that their life worked out that way. It does sound enticing, but it's not the reality for most chassidish women.
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amother
Peach


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 10:46 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
In the chassidish world, you don't have women collapsing from work and childcare, trying to manage it all on their own. Even if they're working, they have so much help and support!


this is such a stereotype my eyes hurt from reading it. not one thing you wrote about chasidish people applies to me or my friends, even if we eat out once in a while, you don't know that I'm rushing back for my babysitter, or that this happens once in 6 months...
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amother
Peach


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 10:51 am
amother [ Yellow ] wrote:
Wait! Klei kodesh are not the ones living the hi life?
I thought they get discounts in all stores, they get coupons twice a year before yom tov, to get free clothes/shoes/ groceries/meat/matzah.
They work exactly only when their kids have school & are off together with them. Being so, why can't your hub take care of your kids then, why do you need a babysitter?
Which working man gets off on fast days because he is fasting & has erev yom tov off, and isru chag off, bein hazmanim off, before pesach so he can help with pesach cleaning & before sukkos so he can build the sukkah?
Why can't your dh take on some responsibility when he has off?
If he is a rebbe for young kids he literally works from 10-3! Which office guy has so few hours & can spend time with the kids.?
Mostly all Catskill homes are filled with such type. They continue the job there but get free bungalow all summer plus food and all their children can join the camp/daycamp program for free. How much money is saved there?
If they work in same mosdos as their children attend they get free tuition?
Eta: which other working guy gets tipped so generously on Chanuka & Purim?
What about your husband getting free lunches daily? and bringing home the extras for supper?
Maybe you just need the right connections!


while it believe this is a slight exaggeration, I do think it's mostly true. people working in any school setting have great hours, days off left and right and more.
my husband and I work every single fast day. erev yom tov, including erev yom kippur and pesach and sukkos and purim till 1pm. with all our kids being off DAYS before every yom tov. our jobs don't closed for snow days but our kids are home. we arrange play dates and run back and forth to pick up and drop off. we pay extra on those days for babysitters...
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amother
OP


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 11:13 am
Thanks, everyone, for your responses. Just wanted to end this thread from my end and apologize if I've offended anyone or come across as bashed. I was honestly exhausted and falling apart and that other thread hit me like, it's not fair, the other women have it so much easier. Perhaps I wasn't open minded enough to know that there are other chassidish women out there collapsing as well, as the ones I'm related to and associated with do fall into the category I described.
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amother
Peach


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 11:19 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks, everyone, for your responses. Just wanted to end this thread from my end and apologize if I've offended anyone or come across as bashed. I was honestly exhausted and falling apart and that other thread hit me like, it's not fair, the other women have it so much easier. Perhaps I wasn't open minded enough to know that there are other chassidish women out there collapsing as well, as the ones I'm related to and associated with do fall into the category I described.


im sorry that I jumped down your throat and if we were harsh. perhaps you can look at it like this chasidish woeman you're looking at is the "other woman" and that she's super lucky (do you know that 100%?) and that most women in 2020 are hardworking in and out of the home.
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Mama Bear




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 11:24 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Thanks, everyone, for your responses. Just wanted to end this thread from my end and apologize if I've offended anyone or come across as bashed. I was honestly exhausted and falling apart and that other thread hit me like, it's not fair, the other women have it so much easier. Perhaps I wasn't open minded enough to know that there are other chassidish women out there collapsing as well, as the ones I'm related to and associated with do fall into the category I described.


which other thread?

and I'm chuckling here bc I'm probably one of those women you're associated with who (you think that ) fall into the category you describe. LOL (True I'm not working, but my husband has a Sun-Fri job for the past 15 years and I only have 3 children, and with my ADHD I can't really hold down an outside job. I don't travel to florida and I dont go out to lunch. But I'm bh not struggling for every penny.) You're correct that the vast majority of chasidish women dont have to work, most of my siblings and friends and neighbors don't.

But yeah I do think about you sometimes and feel for you, I wouldn't be able to do this. You're a warrior! Keep strong!


Last edited by Mama Bear on Fri, Jan 10 2020, 11:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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amother
OP


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 11:25 am
https://www.imamother.com/foru.....79562
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Mama Bear




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 11:37 am
Oh yeah I replied on that thread too. My hats off to working moms...
My husband's sister runs her own business and she is literally always at work. gets up at 6 am, is at work from 9:30 am til her youngest's bus, and runs back to work when the kids are asleep. never takes vacation, doesnt go to the country - not bc she can't afford it, but bc she's attached to her business!!! She's a workhorse! I'm constantly amazed and ask her how she can do it all - something's gotta give at some point, no?
She's unusual though. youre right than in wmsbg women don't work unless they really really have to or they really really want to.
So I do understand where you're coming from and I understand your resentment and jealousy. You're human!
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 12:55 pm
Mama Bear wrote:
Oh yeah I replied on that thread too. My hats off to working moms...
My husband's sister runs her own business and she is literally always at work. gets up at 6 am, is at work from 9:30 am til her youngest's bus, and runs back to work when the kids are asleep. never takes vacation, doesnt go to the country - not bc she can't afford it, but bc she's attached to her business!!! She's a workhorse! I'm constantly amazed and ask her how she can do it all - something's gotta give at some point, no?
She's unusual though. youre right than in wmsbg women don't work unless they really really have to or they really really want to.
So I do understand where you're coming from and I understand your resentment and jealousy. You're human!


Just curious, Mama Bear, how do families where the husband is learning or a Rebbe live? I'm guessing you can't live completely on a Rebbe's salary...

I agree that Chassidish women generally don't work full time once they have a few children, but in all the Chassidish families I know where the husband is a Rebbe or similar, the wife is working or they are being supported by family. Am I wrong?
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Mama Bear




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 1:28 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
Just curious, Mama Bear, how do families where the husband is learning or a Rebbe live? I'm guessing you can't live completely on a Rebbe's salary...

I agree that Chassidish women generally don't work full time once they have a few children, but in all the Chassidish families I know where the husband is a Rebbe or similar, the wife is working or they are being supported by family. Am I wrong?


Someone very correctly pointed out upthread that melamdim get 1) free tuition 2) free/discounted camp 3) discounts in the butcher store / fish store 4) Kimche D'Pischa vouchers 5) a generous stipend when they marry off their children 6) nice tips from the parents around chanukah / purim 7) the melamdim take on additional jobs such as bus routes, tutoring, etc. 8) gov't programs 9) summer jobs in the catskills 10) they do struggle and don't spend on extras! They dont live the kind of 'lavish' lifestyle.... in any case, melamdim/ klei kodesh tend to have a 'frummer' lifestyle which means no FL vacations and not regular restaurant eaters.

It's doable.

Also, if you're a really good melamed you can end up being promoted to high school (yeshiva) and they get paid really well I think.

And yes, some melamdim's wived work part time, as teachers, for example.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 1:36 pm
Mama Bear wrote:
Someone very correctly pointed out upthread that melamdim get 1) free tuition 2) free/discounted camp 3) discounts in the butcher store / fish store 4) Kimche D'Pischa vouchers 5) a generous stipend when they marry off their children 6) nice tips from the parents around chanukah / purim 7) the melamdim take on additional jobs such as bus routes, tutoring, etc. 8) gov't programs 9) summer jobs in the catskills 10) they do struggle and don't spend on extras! They dont live the kind of 'lavish' lifestyle.... in any case, melamdim/ klei kodesh tend to have a 'frummer' lifestyle which means no FL vacations and not regular restaurant eaters.

It's doable.

Also, if you're a really good melamed you can end up being promoted to high school (yeshiva) and they get paid really well I think.

And yes, some melamdim's wived work part time, as teachers, for example.


My (Chassidish) friends who's husbands are melamdim are all working. How does Satmar manage to not need to do that? Really wondering.
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 1:55 pm
amother [ Violet ] wrote:
I totally understand what you mean. Every time I go to Boro Park I marvel at all the women just strolling around or sitting in restaurants. I actually feel resentment that many of them are living this lifestyle thanks to all us hardworking people's taxes.


Really making assumptions here. How do you know who gets government aid? Do you know them.. Are you surprised about anti-semitism. Even the non-chassidim resent chassidim. This is exactly how the black americans feel.. resentment because of jealousy. Assumptions based on looks.
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amother
Sienna


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 2:11 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
My (Chassidish) friends who's husbands are melamdim are all working. How does Satmar manage to not need to do that? Really wondering.


Who says satmar people don't work? I can count seven people that I know personally that are satmar their husbands are melamdim five of them the wife works The other two have side jobs.

In all honesty the melamdim that I know tend to have more time on their hands. They work 10:00 to 3:00 have a morning job like some work in shul a job after 3:00 ( sales type of work, graphics for the chadder ECT.). Are off when the kids are off. Plus they don't pay tuition, get discounts, have a free bungalow in the Catskills, get nice tips, free lunches and suppers, ECT. Mmmmm maybe my husband should become one, It definitely pays off.
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amother
Silver


 

Post Fri, Jan 10 2020, 2:37 pm
I am appalled at the Chassidim hatred here.

Who do you think you are!


Yes, you see me sitting in coffee shops once a week.
Yes I wear high end clothes and wheel a bugaboo.
Yes I enjoy my freedom from 10-3 when kids are out.
But my DH works his *ss off and brings in a beautiful income bh.
And that means that I get no help at home from him, because he’s out until some kids are asleep and leaves early morning for davening, shiur and work.
We both work very hard for this arrangement.
But at the end of the day, we live comfortably bh, and yes we do vacation twice a year together.

And YES WE PAY MORE TAXES THAN YOU.
And NO we get no govt aid.

How do you expect Muslims and blacks to like is if you don’t??
Work on your middos all of you judgers.
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