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If your husband works
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naturalmom5




 
 
 
 

Post  Fri, Feb 07 2020, 3:46 pm
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amother




Periwinkle
 

Post  Fri, Feb 07 2020, 3:59 pm
tigerwife wrote:
And if she works full time, together with her husband who works full time, to cover the bills,, then it’s fine?


If both parents work full time, it's usually not out of choice, but out of necessity. A father chooses to sit in kollel and not work thus forcing the wife to work full time & not be able to be there for the kids all the way.
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amother




Aubergine
 

Post  Fri, Feb 07 2020, 4:13 pm
tigerwife wrote:
And if she works full time, together with her husband who works full time, to cover the bills,, then it’s fine?


Usually (not always, but in many cases), if the mama is working full time, it's because of extenuating circumstances.
We weren't supposed to have the curses of both Adam AND Chava, yknow
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Ruchel




 
 
 
 

Post  Sat, Feb 08 2020, 3:05 pm
Learners are like, 5% at most?
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Sat, Feb 08 2020, 3:20 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Just curious if your husband started working shortly after you got married if it was because you needed the money or because your husband was not cut out for learning.

My DH started working before we got married.

He's a smart guy with a yeshiva education and a medical degree. He works because he enjoys it and it is an excellent parnassa.

Your implicit assumption that every man *should* spend his life learning instead of earning a living is weird to me. So many of our forefathers and talmidei chacham had professions and occupations; why shouldn't my husband?
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amother




Jetblack
 

Post  Sat, Feb 08 2020, 8:00 pm
amother [ Aubergine ] wrote:
Usually (not always, but in many cases), if the mama is working full time, it's because of extenuating circumstances.
We weren't supposed to have the curses of both Adam AND Chava, yknow

Extenuating circumstances like tuition?
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amother




Lemon
 

Post  Sat, Feb 08 2020, 8:32 pm
DH comes from a family of Long term learners. His father is still learning in kollel. It’s simething he loves and respects.
He started working before we got married. He just can’t sit and learn all day long. It’s hard for him because he is a pretty yeshivish guy and people used to think otherwise.
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amother




Brunette
 

Post  Sat, Feb 08 2020, 10:36 pm
This question reminds me of when my (brilliant, learned) husband started working, a few years after we got married. A woman in the park said to me, "oh, so he is like my brother in law; he can't sit and learn, so he went out to work."

And I'm like, "he went out to work because we like things like milk. And paid bills."

Ooof, this was over 10 years ago, but the assumptions of the privileged still makes me fume.
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allthingsblue




 
 
 
 

Post  Sat, Feb 08 2020, 10:41 pm
naturalmom5 wrote:


Can't like this enough. What is the name of the rabbi in the video? I couldn't make it out on my phone.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 2:50 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Just curious if your husband started working shortly after you got married if it was because you needed the money or because your husband was not cut out for learning.
My husband was working for about 8 years before we got married. He never thought about not working. It was something that was ingrained in him growing up, supporting one's self and then one's family.

And your premise does not make sense. Not every frum couple out there starts married life in learning. Many many many do not. It is not a given at all. And it also should not be.
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salt




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 4:08 am
amother [ Chocolate ] wrote:
You know not everyone believes the Kollel model is ideal. My husband is smart and a good learner but not Gadol Hador material. We believe that a person with that potential should be sitting and learning, but others have the responsibility to earn a Parnasa and work, with their strengths, to better/ advance the world. When I met my husband, he was not in Kollel, never was, and I am not looking for that in a SIL. My DH was working for the DA office, prosecuting child offenders (those who have harmed children, not juvenile delinquents). That impressed me. Had be been learning, my questions would have been -and to do what with it? Become a posek-great, become a Shul rav, a Rebbi for 3 grade boys- awesome, but end goal. What are you going to accomplish? Why did Hashem put YOU on this earth.
Not that I don't think learning Torah is important. It is very important it is like lehavdil, coffee for the soul. You can't, shouldn't get the day without it, but it is more for you and you need to do something for the world (unless as above, you are able to contribute in Torah).


I have to admit I have a hard time myself really fully internalizing what I'm about to say, but my DH is a strong believer that Torah is more than just 'coffee for the soul'. A person who is learning Torah lishma, is not just rejuvinating his own soul, and performing a mitzva, he is keeping the world going.
על שלושה דברים העולם עומד. על התורה, על העבודה ועל גמילות חסדים

Anyone who learns Torah, whether he is a gadol hador, or a simple person who can hardly read Hebrew, if he is learning Torah lishma, he is upholding the world. Who knows who will benefit from those zechuyot.

That being said, if someone needs to make a living, or someone cannot learn all day lishma, and put his whole heart into it, he should get a job.

My DH worked full time before we got married. Actually in the last few years, since my job b"H brings in a good salary, he dropped his hrs and learns half day, and loves it. He he would ever need to, he's go back to full time.
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amother




Khaki
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 7:21 am
tigerwife wrote:
And if she works full time, together with her husband who works full time, to cover the bills,, then it’s fine?

At the very least, in that case there is enough money to pay for orthodontist bills, after-school activities according to the child's needs and talents, and any OT/ST/PT/ therapy/ private babysitter instead of low-quality after-school program, etc.
Yes they are deprived of time with both parents but they are not living in poverty AND deprived of time with their parents, double whammy for the sake of learning Torah.
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amother




Blonde
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 7:33 am
We're chassidish so there are less long time learners in our community; however, two of my sisters have husbands who learned for 5 years after the chasuna and another who has been learning indefinitely.

DH went to work fairly quickly because we wanted to be financially independent from our parents, especially his, who would use money as a threat if they didnt like certain things (like me teaching an English subject at the time).

That being said, DH, who enjoys working, is a very good learner. His Rav always tells him how he could have become a Dayan or whatever he wanted if he continued learning, but it wasn't what he wanted to pursue.
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amother




Chartreuse
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 7:33 am
amother [ Khaki ] wrote:
At the very least, in that case there is enough money to pay for orthodontist bills, after-school activities according to the child's needs and talents, and any OT/ST/PT/ therapy/ private babysitter instead of low-quality after-school program, etc.
Yes they are deprived of time with both parents but they are not living in poverty AND deprived of time with their parents, double whammy for the sake of learning Torah.


What on earth makes you think that? If I increased my hours from working until 3 to be working until 5 (Dh works full day already), I'd be making max $300 extra per week... and would have to pay for extra childcare so there would be very little extra takehome pay. Barely enough for even one item on your list.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 8:54 am
chmom wrote:
So working is bedieved is it?
These kind of sentences make my blood boil
My husband is not in kolel because we don’t believe in that life model at all
And there is absolutely nothing wrong with his brains
I don’t go around asking kolel wives why their husbands aren’t doctors. Are they not cut out for it?


I remember watching a panel of 3 women - the wife of a working man, the wife of a very long term kollel learner, and the wife of someone in klie kodesh. (After they walked into a bar) The thing is, they aren't necessarily 3 different women. They could be the same woman at different stages, e.g. learn long term, then go into the family business; learn short term, go into klei kodesh; etc.

I think this is something OP needs to think about. You don't become different people, you just transition to a different stage, taking all the growth of the last stage into the next.
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amother




Honeydew
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 11:49 am
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
There is actually a huge difference.

It goes against our biology and how humans evolved for the woman to be the breadwinner and the man to be supported. There are consequences to this kind of arrangement (resentment, lack of respect for husband)
It is also emasculating for the man. The woman takes on both male and female roles. She carries the financial and household burdens.

But when both are working, the man is still a provider. Yes his wife is too, but he is still fulfilling his instinctual role. He also carries the financial burden.


With all due respect, my husband and I both work full time and BH both earn a good living. That said, I’m technically the main breadwinner since I earn more. There is no resentment or lack of respect. We have figured out a split of household responsibilities that work for us. Stereotypes do not work here.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 3:18 pm
Who is the rabbi in the video? I've been googling and got Torah Clicks but it doesn't say.
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Refine




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 9:53 pm
Love the video!
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amother




Tangerine
 

Post  Sun, Feb 09 2020, 9:59 pm
amother [ Periwinkle ] wrote:
If both parents work full time, it's usually not out of choice, but out of necessity. A father chooses to sit in kollel and not work thus forcing the wife to work full time & not be able to be there for the kids all the way.


But then the father is more available for the kids. Where I live, the fathers take the kids to school and pick up the preschoolers on their lunch break. It's cute.
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