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amother
OP
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 Sun, Mar 01 2020, 9:04 pm
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Every year around purim time I think about this. When achashveirosh invited the Jews to the party, Mordechai told them not to go. Yet, there they were. I always wonder, if I had been there, would I have gone to the party? There are so many things that Rabbanim say one way, yet we justify it that it’s ok the other way. The obvious difference is that Mordechai was the only tzaddik of the time whereas in today’s day and age, everyone holds by their own rav. Still, imagine Donald Trump throwing a huge party, kosher food and all. (Totally just as an example, I do NOT mean to get political in any way.) And he invites all the Jews to come, free of charge. Rav Chaim Kanievsky comes out with a psak that it’s assur to go. I’d like to think I’d be strong enough to listen to that psak, but in reality, how many people would justify the once in a lifetime event and go ahead. Just my musings aloud. Something to think about.
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amother
Lilac
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 9:05 pm
| amother [ OP ] wrote: | | Totally just as an example, I do NOT mean to get political in any way.) |
That offends me.
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amother
Lavender
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 9:10 pm
| amother [ Lilac ] wrote: | | That offends me. |
Maybe you are too easily offended.
OP I also think about if I were Esther. Would I have stood up to the task? Or said "let someone else do it?"
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amother
Tan
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 9:24 pm
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I have major social anxiety so this is an easy one to answer for me...
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Malkqueen
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 9:34 pm
I'd like to think I wouldn't go, but I'd for sure want to pass by and see what the fuss is all about. Or have someone take pictures, if we can apply time travel. But also I don't think I would live in Shushan, I prefer rural areas, so I could probably just avoid the entire controversy.
As an aside, did Vashti even invite Jewish women to her party? Given her hatred of them and they way she forced her Jewish maids to work on Shabbos, I'm not so certain we ladies would have been welcome at all.
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amother
Lilac
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 9:51 pm
| amother [ Lavender ] wrote: | Maybe you are too easily offended.
OP I also think about if I were Esther. Would I have stood up to the task? Or said "let someone else do it?" |
Whooosh.
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amother
Denim
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 10:09 pm
| amother [ Lilac ] wrote: | | That offends me. |
Explain please... is your name Donald Trump?
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PinkFridge
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 10:17 pm
OP, I'm not sure if the political analogy makes sense. It would be more like a president saying, guess what, I counted to 6000 and your Messiah's not here. Let's party!
And then some machers would say it's politically expedient and necessary to go and no one would pick their rabbanim's brains, etc.
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DrMom
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 10:29 pm
Where in Megillat Ester does it say this?
What are the reasons cited?
I am also not sure if the two scenarios you described are comparable. Were Jews urged not to attend because the atmosphere was lewd? If so, the message is to avoid gatherings with lewd atmospheres, not to avoid parties given by all political leaders.
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amother
OP
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 10:35 pm
Interesting to see the responses. I know the analogy is not the greatest, feel free to post a better example 
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amother
Lavender
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 10:39 pm
| amother [ Lilac ] wrote: | | Whooosh. |
?
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amother
Coral
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Sun, Mar 01 2020, 10:45 pm
Oh don't worry we'd have community organizations like Agudah and the Federation and OU and who knows whom else who get funding from the king, saying that we can't dare offend the ruler of the land, that it's actually to our benefit to go because in the long run if we're nice to him, he'll be nice to us, and we can't stick out from the rest of the citizens of the land, it's actually a chillul hashem not to go because everyone will see that it's mostly jews who don't go, and it's being kafui tov to the king, and that the Gadol (mordechai) doesn't know about politics and how important it is to be PC and that he is not involved in the metzius to be informed enough to give a psak so his psak isn't valid for this specific party and he should stick his nose out of politics and things that aren't a rav's domain and he should only keep to only paskening on halacha matters and only when asked.
You asked. I answered. 
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amother
Honeydew
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 12:19 am
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We don't go to our own children's school dinner even though we pay for it, so I can't imagine we'd schlep out for a free feast made by a political figure. Imagine the speeches we'd have to sit through!
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amother
Beige
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 12:26 am
| amother [ Coral ] wrote: | Oh don't worry we'd have community organizations like Agudah and the Federation and OU and who knows whom else who get funding from the king, saying that we can't dare defend the ruler of the land, that it's actually to our benefit to go because in the long run if we're nice to him, he'll be nice to us, and we can't stick out from the rest of the citizens of the land, it's actually a chillul hashem not to go because everyone will see that it's mostly jews who don't go, and it's being kafui tov to the king, and that the Gadol (mordechai) doesn't know about politics and how important it is to be PC and that he is not involved in the metzius to be informed enough to give a psak so his psak isn't valid for this specific party and he should stick his nose out of politics and things that aren't a rav's domain and he should only keep to only paskening on halacha matters and only when asked.
You asked. I answered. |
The difference, of course, is that Mordechai really was involved in the world and spoke many languages. And when given the opportunity, he got involved in politics at the highest level.
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DrMom
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 4:15 am
| amother [ OP ] wrote: | | Interesting to see the responses. I know the analogy is not the greatest, feel free to post a better example |
A better example of what?
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DrMom
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 4:22 am
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This thread is so packed with midrash - there are hardly actual references to the Megillah here.
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amother
Blush
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 7:12 am
| amother [ Honeydew ] wrote: | | We don't go to our own children's school dinner even though we pay for it, so I can't imagine we'd schlep out for a free feast made by a political figure. Imagine the speeches we'd have to sit through! |
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amother
Silver
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 7:25 am
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When I was dating I was on a religious dating website and got to a phone conversation with this one guy and he asked me how I felt about shomer negia. I told him I'm not completely shomeret, but wouldn't go as far as taking off clothes or touching private parts before marriage. He then said he wouldn't get married UNLESS he has s*x with the woman first so he could make sure the s*x was good. I hung up and never saw or heard from him again. But once I heard that it was basically a s*x contest and not a beauty pageant where king Achvarosh picked Esther, and it reminds me of that creep.
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amother
Coral
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Mon, Mar 02 2020, 7:52 am
| amother [ Beige ] wrote: | | The difference, of course, is that Mordechai really was involved in the world and spoke many languages. And when given the opportunity, he got involved in politics at the highest level. |
He spoke many languages but was not involved in the king's court at that time. He was raising his niece/cousin, dont forget. Very easy to dismiss his warning as irrelevant.
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