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Forum -> Coronavirus Health Questions
Is anyone on top of economic and other secondary effects?



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seeker




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 1:24 pm
Of course health departments are all over this. But it's clear there will be consequences beyond the health care. Are any of the governments being proactive about this? If you want people to stay home and avoid spreading germs, then you need a proactive plan of how they are not going to lose their jobs, or even their homes from debt? El Al is laying off a thousand employees - well who exactly is going to work for them when this ends and demand for travel picks up again? And what are all those people supposed to do now? And that's only one little slice of the world. And I'm in the US which seems even less on the ball than Israel.

I'm not a fan of panic, but the alternative to panic is rational planning - is anyone doing that or are we just speculating and waiting for the chips to fall?
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Elfrida




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 4:43 pm
Also related, but on a more positive note, I'm wondering what the environmental impact is going to be. The huge drop in flight numbers can only be good, but the increasing use of tissues will encourage deforestation, and all the disposable wipes contain plastics.
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amother
Blue


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 4:46 pm
Elfrida wrote:
Also related, but on a more positive note, I'm wondering what the environmental impact is going to be. The huge drop in flight numbers can only be good, but the increasing use of tissues will encourage deforestation, and all the disposable wipes contain plastics.


Big clearing up of pollution over China.
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losingweight




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 4:47 pm
This is my question all along. How are people supposed to sustain themselves if commerce doesn't take place? If most people will have to sit home quarantined and not working, how will those same people have food? and jobs when this boils down? Pesach is coming for us Jewish people. No work=no pay=no money for yom tov expenses that are going nowher.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 4:53 pm
Some businesses will probably thrive on providing goods and services to quarantined people.
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amother
Yellow


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 4:58 pm
seeker wrote:
Of course health departments are all over this. But it's clear there will be consequences beyond the health care. Are any of the governments being proactive about this? If you want people to stay home and avoid spreading germs, then you need a proactive plan of how they are not going to lose their jobs, or even their homes from debt? El Al is laying off a thousand employees - well who exactly is going to work for them when this ends and demand for travel picks up again? And what are all those people supposed to do now? And that's only one little slice of the world. And I'm in the US which seems even less on the ball than Israel.

I'm not a fan of panic, but the alternative to panic is rational planning - is anyone doing that or are we just speculating and waiting for the chips to fall?


The answer to this is yes.

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump

I will be addressing the Nation this evening at 9:00 P.M. (Eastern) from the Oval Office.
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Mayflower




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 4:59 pm
A lot of people can work from home. Most office jobs can be done from home. Meetings can be held through videoconferencing, etc..

Obviously, some sectors such as tourism and aviation are greatly affected but I think we will be surprised to see how innovative people are when they have no choice.
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Elfrida




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:06 pm
In England the budget speech was delivered today. He announced a lot of measures to help relieve the overall impact on the economy as well as extra funding for the NHS. It may be too little too late, but at least he's made a start.
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amother
Seafoam


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:07 pm
They’ll probably have the pilots and stewards moonshine as doctors and nurses and turn airports into hospitals when ch’v they run out of space
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Elfrida




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:10 pm
amother [ Seafoam ] wrote:
They’ll probably have the pilots and stewards moonshine as doctors and nurses and turn airports into hospitals when ch’v they run out of space


I got a WhatsApp today, mentioning that the spirit of Purim had become very widespread.

In a reversal of normal roles, the airport staff were checking for fever, while doctors and nurses are checking passports!.
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amother
Seafoam


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:12 pm
Elfrida wrote:
I got a WhatsApp today, mentioning that the spirit of Purim had become very widespread.

In a reversal of normal roles, the airport staff were checking for fever, while doctors and nurses are checking passports!.

I Don’t have WhatsApp
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amother
Forestgreen


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:12 pm
Mayflower wrote:
A lot of people can work from home. Most office jobs can be done from home. Meetings can be held through videoconferencing, etc..

Obviously, some sectors such as tourism and aviation are greatly affected but I think we will be surprised to see how innovative people are when they have no choice.


There's sanitation workers, gas and electric workers, retail, grocery, construction workers, general contractors.

How do you know most jobs out there are office jobs?

My husband installs low voltage wiring and cameras. He has to show up and work if he wants to get paid.

If you own real estate. Who's gonna pay their rent if they can't work? I actually don't know many people with real desk jobs.

If you are a trader or broker or hedge fund and the economy is collapsing your desk job is going to be pretty slow as well.
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amother
Goldenrod


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:39 pm
The economy is gonna take a hit. That's unavoidable.
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amother
Goldenrod


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:40 pm
amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:
How do you know most jobs out there are office jobs?

She didn't say most, she said a lot. And offices might be particularly bad when it comes to spreading viruses.
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amother
Blue


 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 5:46 pm
amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:
There's sanitation workers, gas and electric workers, retail, grocery, construction workers, general contractors.

How do you know most jobs out there are office jobs?

My husband installs low voltage wiring and cameras. He has to show up and work if he wants to get paid.

If you own real estate. Who's gonna pay their rent if they can't work? I actually don't know many people with real desk jobs.

If you are a trader or broker or hedge fund and the economy is collapsing your desk job is going to be pretty slow as well.

Italy suspended mortgage payments while the country is shut down. Sanitization workers, gas and electric workers, grocery workers will be deemed essential. They will probably triage as they do in war effforts.

Construction workers on vacant buildings probably can continue with precautions.
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etky




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 6:01 pm
I think it's a bit unrealistic to expect a detailed economic plan when things are so dynamic and literally changing from minute to minute. However, PM Netanyahu gave a joint televised statement today with the Finance Ministry, outlining basically what is a plan to provide first aid to the economy. This is what he said:

Following are Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s remarks, today , at the Prime Minister’s Office in Jerusalem, at the joint statements with the Finance Minister, the Economy and Industry Minister, the Governor of the Bank of Israel and the Finance Ministry Director General, on dealing with the economic implications of the Coronavirus:

“At 14:00, I will talk with Deborah Birx, who is responsible for the Coronavirus in the US. We are in continuous contact together with the head of our National Security Council, Meir Ben-Shabbat and others. Links with the US are essential; I view them as one of our greatest assets in dealing with this crisis.

In general, we are devoting this discussion today to the economic issue. We are closely monitoring developments in the economic changes. Corona is greatly affecting the global economy and our economy as well. We are entering this crisis in a good situation. The Israeli economy is in a better situation than most economies in the world: Unemployment is low, growth is high and the debt to GDP ratio is good. What does this mean? It means that we can pay our debts. The financial system is strong. Simply put: We have strong and stable banks. These are major advantages at the beginning of this crisis.

However, we have a great challenge here that we all are feeling and which we are all aware of. In our view, we can also deal with it in a way that will allow us to get through it successfully in peace. Not without difficulty, and not without sacrifice, but in the end, in peace, and I think that we can do this together in an optimal manner.

The goal of our plan is to facilitate the continuous functioning of the economy. We are doing this through an immediate NIS 10 billion package. NIS 4 billion has already been allocated, but we are adding another NIS 6 billion today in order to stabilize the economy. I say at the outset: This is first aid. We are monitoring developments on a daily basis. We will give additional assistance as necessary.

In this NIS 10 billion, the first thing is NIS 1 billion for health. We see this as not only for health, but for life. We are talking here about saving lives. If somebody gets through this crisis with general malaise, a kind of minor flu, nothing has happened. However, we know that there is also the possibility that this could claim a high price in lives and we want to minimize the cost in lives here. Therefore, we are giving preference to the health system and we are using NIS 1 billion here to first increase the supply of drugs, to purchase medical equipment, to prepare the hospitals to receive a greater number of patients and to prepare the medical teams.

The second thing we are talking about is increasing the assistance fund for businesses and companies. We had NIS 4 billion. We are doubling it today to NIS 8 billion in the wake of lengthy consultations with the Finance Minister, the Governor of the Bank of Israel, the Economy and Industry Minister and the professionals. We are doubling it immediately. A business that has suffered is eligible to apply for a loan from the fund. We have lowered the interest rate. Everyone can apply and request assistance. Let it be clear, whoever has been adversely affected can apply and request assistance. I understand that the banks were closed yesterday so we will know soon the magnitude of the response, but we are already making funds available for assistance to businesses, especially – for example – tourism, which, it is clear to us, has been hit hard. Accordingly, people will receive preference. It is important, everyone who has been adversely affected, every business that has been hurt, can apply to receive assistance from this cash flow fund.

Third, inventories. There is no shortage and no shortage of goods will be created in the State of Israel. The reason is simple: We have the means. Most of the traffic is by sea. First, one must understand that the vast majority of both goods and raw materials are by sea, and, of course, we will make sure it is not be adversely affected. We will ease restrictions for importers in bringing goods into the country. There will be no shortage of raw materials for Israeli industry due to the same capability that I have just described. Of course, there is a question of supply by air, and we will do whatever is necessary to facilitate this. We are recruiting the necessary elements, including the Air Force and Israeli airlines for this.

I want to differentiate - aviation is a separate industry. Aviation as aviation is a separate industry. We give individual and separate treatment to the airlines. It is important to understand this. It is a lifeline. It is important to us. Therefore, we are preserving it in this way, in addition to the NIS 10 billion. It is important to clarify this. I also asked for an additional NIS 1 billion for special needs. What are special needs? This is dedicated to preventing the spread of the disease, managing the crisis - this includes police, firefighters, prisons. And, by the way, we are thinking about how, for example, to treat prisons, for example, so that we do not enter into the restrictions or problems we have seen in other countries.

We are maintaining essential services such as gas platforms, packing houses, food and welfare services for the needy. This is the immediate package that we are dealing with. This is first aid. We continue to monitor and we will provide additional assistance to the extent that it is necessary. I already tell you that later this afternoon, toward evening, we will hold yet another discussion, together with the Minister of Health and the Health Ministry Director General in order to provide additional instructions to the public."
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seeker




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 6:13 pm
Mayflower wrote:
A lot of people can work from home. Most office jobs can be done from home. Meetings can be held through videoconferencing, etc..

Obviously, some sectors such as tourism and aviation are greatly affected but I think we will be surprised to see how innovative people are when they have no choice.

"Some sectors?" You mean like healthcare... Education... Transportation... Retail... Shipping... Foodservice... Childcare.... Elder Care... Rehabilitation... Cleaning... Maintenance... Beauty (yes it's an industry and one in which many people with low income don't earn anything if people stop getting manicures and blowouts)

"Some."

Some of these are obviously more problematic than others. Childcare the providers will suffer but the parents will probably be home with their children and the industry will be right back after the crisis. So that needs to be dealt with on the level of "how are we going to make sure individuals don't starve in the short term." Other sectors have to solve not only that but also larger scale issues and cascades of ramifications. I expect unionized workers will not lose pay, but the people who have to pay them likely will, so where's that money going to come from? And what about "middle class" people like me who are not part of unions, if I OR my clients get homebound (if we both get homebound but at different times then multiply the time off by two) then I earn nothing, and yet I'm not at immediate risk of starvation so emergency measures need to deal with the manicurists (e.g., only because I mentioned them earlier) first - I'm happy I'm probably not about to starve but I don't exactly want my savings to collapse and my budget to plummet, I'm not living large. If I had a house my mortgage would be at risk.

Again my point is not to panic but we do need to discuss what can be done about these things.
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seeker




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 11 2020, 6:21 pm
I mean ideally the govt would throw money at the problem, and they probably will have to, but in the US national debt is already beyond comprehension and with this being a global problem that seems even iffier than it already did. For Israel it possibly makes more sense. Makes sense also about suspending mortgages (though how are the banks going to deal with that? I don't know enough about banking to guess) and keeping essential services.

Still leaves a lot of questions but it's nice to have a start...
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