Tuition and school closure

Raindropsonrose

Mon, Mar 16 2020, 10:30 pm

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

I find it hard to believe that the staff at my kids’ school is working as hard to prepare and deliver a 30 minute daily phone lesson as they would be for the usual 4+ hours they typically teach each day.

I can’t speak for your school but I’m currently working about 5x harder than I typically would...

amother

Seagreen

Mon, Mar 16 2020, 10:34 pm

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

My mother is a teacher in a school where tuition is 25k+. She is teaching 3+ hours on live video. She prepares forever how to engage students one sided. It’s preparing a whole new lesson plan after teaching many years.

amother

Oak

Mon, Mar 16 2020, 10:35 pm

sorry but I should be getting a discount. Why are speciality teachers like gym and art getting their full salary but doing nothing for my kids? They should be sending home projects to do, videos on home exercises etc if they get a salary. Even the main teachers should not get their full salary for making a 15 minute video of their davening songs for preschool. No! You aren't watching my kids, teaching them anything or revamping a curriculum!
The first year you taught you weren't paid extra for prep time. Why should you get paid now for prep time when you are doing only a 30 minute or hour video class or teleconference!? Many jobs including probably mine will soon be cutting hours or just shut down. Why are teachers a protected class plus will get first dibs on any discounts for the chagim, maos chitim etc.
we are all suffering, give us a break or some help!!

amother

Vermilion

Mon, Mar 16 2020, 10:46 pm

amother [ Seagreen ] wrote:

Building morgage
Taxes
Insurance
Utilities

Do you want a school for students to return to?

Teachers salaries are a tiny fraction of tuition.

This is totally inaccurate in most schools (and many other organizations/businesses). In the schools in my neighborhood salaries are over 70% of expenses. I looked up one in Lakewood and salaries were 48%, but take out food (which my area doesn't offer and is obviously not being paid while kids aren't in school) and it goes up to closer to 60%.
That's not to say I think we should stop paying teachers. I want our teachers to feel valued and come back next year prepared to teach next years curriculum and catch up everything missed this year.

small bean

Mon, Mar 16 2020, 10:58 pm

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

I would assume they have to prepare new lessons and keep kids engaged when they are not actually in a classroom.

When I have to be on a webinar, I find it extremely hard to focus. Imagine being the teacher and needing to be reaching the audience.

amother

Ivory

Mon, Mar 16 2020, 11:35 pm

small bean wrote:

How do you rate pay effort and time?

Sorry, not sure I understand your question. I can tell you that my children are receiving weekly packets of worksheets for secular studies. These are worksheets that have been part of the curriculum for years. The first set was sent home, but future packets will likely be emailed to the parents. The same for kodesh. In addition, each kodesh teacher is sending out one pre-recorded lesson per day. So far what I've received is less than 20 minutes long. There is no teleconferencing.

Again, while I appreciate the above, there is no way it should cost me as much as I'm paying in tuition.

And it's ridiculous to believe that the expenses of running a school with the kids at home are anywhere close to what they would be with the kids in school.

amother

Sienna

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 6:46 am

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

For my 40 minute lesson I have to:
1) prepare extra guided sheets for the kids who can’t make it online at the time (an hour)
2) make a quiz or worksheet for the end of class to make the kids were actually with me and understanding because I can’t check their faces and notes (half an hour)
3) grade said quizzes and worksheets with meaningful feedback to clarify everything they didn’t have time to ask. (Two-three hours)
4) answer emails of academic or technical questions (all day)
5) if giving independent work make an introductory video , simplified directions, and be available online to answer questions of all the kids who don’t read the directions or watch the video.

notshanarishona

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 6:54 am

Parents and schools are used to teachers putting in hours of work without getting paid but if you just take the report cards I am expected to fill this week, the IEP paperwork , the 20 minutes a day of recorded lessons , the 10 hours I put in over the weekend to make a packet with 3 weeks worth of work , all of the emails I have fielded, that is already about 20 hours of work for this week and my salary is based on 15 hours a week . We are not exactly getting overpaid per hour .

amother

Emerald

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 6:58 am

I do think initially teachers are working harder as they scramble to figure stuff out. Lots of my kids classes are using online programs such as iready. I assume they are paying for the program. I do think the teacher will “get a break” once kids are using program and she isn’t teaching. I do think she should get paid. I feel bad for the school that now has to pay for a program and I assume still pay the teacher. I also feel bad I have to pay and proctor my kids work but feel that’s life.

amother

Blush

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 7:16 am

My hs daughter has 3 teleconferences a day for 40 mins each instead of 8 periods. That means not all teachers are working and not all getting paid. Additionally there is no building maintenance or meals so tuition shud not be the same!!

amother

Mauve

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 8:01 am

School owner here-

Salaried teachers are getting paid same as I assume salaried workers get paid even if they are asked not to come in to work. The school is closing. The teachers aren’t taking off because they wish to. Expenses are the same as usual for the schools. And FYI tuition doesn’t nearly cover all the school expenses. At least not in the smaller schools.

As a parent of school kids as well, I understand why this doesn’t seem fair but the reality is that ppl don’t realize that schools aren’t saving money by staying closed now. If school will over for the remainder of the year, I guess there will be things to figure out...

amother

Wheat

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 8:09 am

amother [ Sienna ] wrote:

For those of us whose schools use phone conferences and not the internet... based on my kids’ lessons yesterday, their teachers did zero of the five things you mentioned above

amother

Sienna

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 8:18 am

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

For those of us whose schools use phone conferences and not the internet... based on my kids’ lessons yesterday, their teachers did zero of the five things you mentioned above

Then it’s about your school administration’s expectations. We were asked to do this, so I feel I’m honestly earning my money. Talk to your administration if you really want, but don’t take it out on the teacher who’s doing her best.

amother

Amber

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 8:51 am

amother [ Mauve ] wrote:

I think teachers should take a cut- let’s say 25%- and the parents should get a 25% discount. That would be fair. No one needs to walk away with 100% of what they want. Everyone can tighten their belts a bit. Not just parents.

amother

Mauve

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 8:57 am

So unfortunately that’s not really the way it works. Legally you can’t just cut a salary. You can lay ppl off and rehire at a lower salary, but it’s not that simple...

amother

Amber

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 9:03 am

amother [ Mauve ] wrote:

So unfortunately that’s not really the way it works. Legally you can’t just cut a salary. You can lay ppl off and rehire at a lower salary, but it’s not that simple...

I hear, I didn’t realize there were legal ramifications here. In general, people feel better about things when there is an attempt at compromise and they get the sense that people are sympathetic and actually DOING something about the problem (and not just apologies and platitudes) sometimes the actual $ amount doesn’t even matter, as much as people seeing the attempt to alleviate their difficult situation.

amother

White

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 9:11 am

amother [ Mauve ] wrote:

So unfortunately that’s not really the way it works. Legally you can’t just cut a salary. You can lay ppl off and rehire at a lower salary, but it’s not that simple...

Are there any grants or bailout programs available? I mean if the States ordered the schools to close can they be asked to help?

Because just expecting that the parents will pay like usual is just not realistic for the many families who just can't.

I mean this is not about whether the schools or the teachers deserve or not. Because they do. But we just can't pay.

Chayalle

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 9:13 am

Didn't read the whole thread yet...but DH told me the Halacha is, if government forces closure in time of a magefa, you are obligated to pay tuition. If they close on their own due to their own fears, then you don't have to pay.

So it seems to me that we are halachically obligated to pay tuition now...at least where I live, where the closure is state-mandated.

ETA - ask your own LOR, of course.

Last edited by Chayalle on Tue, Mar 17 2020, 1:55 pm; edited 1 time in total

small bean

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 9:14 am

If you can't afford tuition right now, I would suggest talking to your kids school about at least not paying right now or making a new payment plan. But at the end of the day, you agreed to pay for the year. The school isn't choosing to close.

I can't take my kids to indoor trampoline parks as they have closed and I would never ask for a refund on this months membership. That is life, I have a membership (actually 2) that we can not use. It doesn't entitle me to a refund.

amother

Crimson

Tue, Mar 17 2020, 9:59 am

small bean wrote:

If you can't afford tuition right now, I would suggest talking to your kids school about at least not paying right now or making a new payment plan. . . .

I can't take my kids to indoor trampoline parks as they have closed and I would never ask for a refund on this months membership. That is life, I have a membership (actually 2) that we can not use. . . .

I think it's important to understand that everyone is taking hits here. Just off the top of my head, not counting school tuition and only through the end of March, I am paying $700 for unusable daycare, $200 in various unusable memberships, $1700 for a babysitter to come to my home to watch my kids for the full work day, every weekday, $100 for downtown parking I won't use, $100 for sports that are canceled, and $260 for cleaning services I won't receive.