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My parents traumatized me... then I met my inlaws!
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amother
OP


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:15 pm
So dh and I have bh always been able to cover our bills plus some luxuries like cleaning help etc. We are young - married almost 7 years and we bh own our home for a few years already.. corona has hit us hard and its triggering dysfunction from my very much non dysfunctional childhood. Lol. Lemme explain best I could - there was this undercurrent my entire life that my parents couldnt afford anything. I literally thought we were poor. I even thought that once I was married. It took marrying someone truly from a poor home to point out to me that my parents are actually comfortable. I was in such denial for so long when dh 1st introduced the idea to me but over time I see how anything the need they are easily buy. They are just very big savers and NOT spenders. Everything is taken good care of and kept for maximum amount of years (embarrassing backpacks, winter coats) things my mother said "its not necessary to replace" and there was no arguing!!

Then my met dh. The dysfunction with his parents finances run so deep. Im getting tired of typing but the gist is- they lived off of their parents their entire lives and never had steady jobs/income and now they live off of dh siblings who are tzadikim beyond. At this point they are old and cant learn and new trade and arent in good health so if they arent being taken care if financially they will not have food to eat...

So hows ur relationship with money? Any trauma associated with it? Discuss...
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:20 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
So dh and I have bh always been able to cover our bills plus some luxuries like cleaning help etc. We are young - married almost 7 years and we bh own our home for a few years already.. corona has hit us hard and its triggering dysfunction from my very much non dysfunctional childhood. Lol. Lemme explain best I could - there was this undercurrent my entire life that my parents couldnt afford anything. I literally thought we were poor. I even thought that once I was married. It took marrying someone truly from a poor home to point out to me that my parents are actually comfortable. I was in such denial for so long when dh 1st introduced the idea to me but over time I see how anything the need they are easily buy. They are just very big savers and NOT spenders. Everything is taken good care of and kept for maximum amount of years (embarrassing backpacks, winter coats) things my mother said "its not necessary to replace" and there was no arguing!!

Then my met dh. The dysfunction with his parents finances run so deep. Im getting tired of typing but the gist is- they lived off of their parents their entire lives and never had steady jobs/income and now they live off of dh siblings who are tzadikim beyond. At this point they are old and cant learn and new trade and arent in good health so if they arent being taken care if financially they will not have food to eat...

So hows ur relationship with money? Any trauma associated with it? Discuss...


I'm not sure what the dysfunction is with your own parents. They didn't spend like crazy and this bothers you? Did you have enough food to eat? Did you have clothing? What's the "trauma", then?
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amother
Turquoise


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:30 pm
amother [ Cerulean ] wrote:
I'm not sure what the dysfunction is with your own parents. They didn't spend like crazy and this bothers you? Did you have enough food to eat? Did you have clothing? What's the "trauma", then?


I think I can relate a bit to OP. My parents were well off, but they acted like they were poor. I was the kid the others bullied. I had one outfit in HS, and they could have afforded a new one everyday for a month for all of us without any problem. They saved on our back.
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Elfrida




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:39 pm
Also not sure where the trauma comes into this. It sounds like my parents had a pretty similar attitude. You didn't throw anything out until it was past repair. School items were carried over from one year to the next. Winter coats (once we'd passed the stage of out growing them every year) were expected to last for a few years. If you left the room you switched the light off. Heating was set at the lowest reasonable level, and if you were cold you wore a sweater.

But it never occurred to me to feel traumatized by any of this. Money was, and is, something to be aware of and respected. The importance of a new item was weighed against the effort expended to gain the money for it. That's still my attitude. Save where possible. Spend when necessary, and spending on quality is often a long term saving. Don't waste money if its unnecessary.

I can see that it might jar with the way your husband grew up, and the current situation might be highlighting financial tensions between you. But since when did economy equate to trauma?
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amother
Orange


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:47 pm
On the other hand, My parents didnt have a ton of money my father always struggled but I never felt it. I always felt like I got what I needed when I needed it. Every season we went through the closets tried on all our clothes from the year before and whatever was too small we gave away and every year I got some new clothes, new shoes, afikoman presents, birthday presents, chanukah presents, a new briefcase and new coat every other year....
Now after Im married less than 5 years and I still have a hard time splurging on things I think I WANT but dont really NEED, Im slightly jealous of those people who were taught about living frugally all the years. Took me a very long time to even learn the value of money after we married and how hard you have to work to get it. (think overspending on our honeymoon... and then a few months in on our marriage panicking about the amount of money in our bank account)
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amother
Seafoam


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:55 pm
My parents are both professionals. Paid full tuition for school and camp for a large family including 2 special ed tuitions, we never had any money. I wore clothes from the gemach and it was embarrassing. We didnt go to camp, many of us didnt get much needed braces, I slept on a mattress for years, our house was completely run down I would never have anyone over because it was so embarrassing. We had folding table and metal plastic chairs. We were never normal. My parents defined needs very differently to us as children. They told us to be grateful etc but none of us were. We didnt understand student loans or tuition costs. We didn't understand why our parents didnt get food stamp coupons. We didnt understand that they were saving for retirement.
I am definitely traumatized. It is so important for me to be super average. For my kids to have what most kids have (the median) is a big deal.
My husband on the other hand grew up with no money. They lived on a rabbis salary, had a large family. My husband is an introvert and it didnt bother him much. He however is very anxious about money. Anything to not spend money.
So its quite a marriage. Im terrified of my kids being without so I make sure to buy them stuff. My husband is terrified that the kids will be without so never spends.
Were working towards a happy medium but the stuff from childhood is a undercurrent for sure.
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imorethanamother




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:55 pm
Elfrida wrote:
Also not sure where the trauma comes into this. It sounds like my parents had a pretty similar attitude. You didn't throw anything out until it was past repair. School items were carried over from one year to the next. Winter coats (once we'd passed the stage of out growing them every year) were expected to last for a few years. If you left the room you switched the light off. Heating was set at the lowest reasonable level, and if you were cold you wore a sweater.

But it never occurred to me to feel traumatized by any of this. Money was, and is, something to be aware of and respected. The importance of a new item was weighed against the effort expended to gain the money for it. That's still my attitude. Save where possible. Spend when necessary, and spending on quality is often a long term saving. Don't waste money if its unnecessary.

I can see that it might jar with the way your husband grew up, and the current situation might be highlighting financial tensions between you. But since when did economy equate to trauma?


Exactly. It sounds like she was raised in a Saver home, and her husband is from a Spender home. I don't think either one is necessarily dysfunctional. I also grew up in a Saver home, and I think it's a refreshing change from the Spenders I see a lot around me. There's no reason to throw away backpacks if they're still good, just to have a "new" one that looks nearly the same as the old one.
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Learning




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 5:58 pm
Op are you parents holocaust survivors? You can find this behavior a lot among holocaust survivors. Your Dh family probably were in kollel all their lives and didn’t have money, they raised thair children to be good healthy adults and now the children take care of their parents. These scenarios are not perfect but I admire both set of parents. They did as much as they can to raise their children and didn’t spend on themselves what they didn’t spend on you. You turned up well and Dh also. Be grateful. They don’t owe you you anything. You are not entitled to anything if they don’t choose to give it to you at this point.
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amother
Fuchsia


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:07 pm
my parents were not holucust survivors I had to wear hand me downs but they were gourgous
from the time I was a teen ager till I got married they never gave me a penny and I had to pay my way thru school and never finished they both died very recently and I never complained
they gaev my brother money and my sister a house she expected to even get more money in the will
but she said she got screwd
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zaq




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:10 pm
I'm one more person who fails to see where the childhood 'trauma' and "dysfunction" come in. your parents sound remarkably normal and wise. no child should get everything she or he wants, and especially not if s/he wants it mainly because it's what all the other kids have. Children need to learn that resources are finite, possessions must be cared for properly, and they are not to be wasted or taken for granted.

Unless you were walking around in rags--a backpack that is stained or travel-worn but not ripped to shreds does not count as a rag--you have no legitimate cause for complaint. yes, it can be embarrassing not to have everything brand new if your friends get all new stuff every back-to-school, but your parents were trying to teach you values as well as arm you for adulthood. in adulthood, no matter how much you make, there will ALWAYS be people who have more than you: bigger houses, fancier cars, flashier jewelry, you name it. Your parents' job is to bring you up so that you realize this and can be content with what you have, not always looking over the fence at the people next door and feeling sorry for yourself because you don't have what they have.

Many wealthy people stay that way by being careful with their money, buying quality goods and maintaining them for a long time rather than buying new things every mitvoch and donnerstik. (Even Queen Elizabeth keeps her handbags for decades and has them repaired when necessary. )There's nothing wrong with that. Our planet would be in a whole lot better shape if everyone maintained their possessions and kept them going for as long as possible instead of throwing things out as soon as they start to look a bit tired or are no longer at the height of fashion.

Your inlaws, yes, they sound quite dysfunctional. Your parents? They sound admirable.
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lilies




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:10 pm
Elfrida wrote:
Also not sure where the trauma comes into this. It sounds like my parents had a pretty similar attitude. You didn't throw anything out until it was past repair. School items were carried over from one year to the next. Winter coats (once we'd passed the stage of out growing them every year) were expected to last for a few years. If you left the room you switched the light off. Heating was set at the lowest reasonable level, and if you were cold you wore a sweater.

But it never occurred to me to feel traumatized by any of this. Money was, and is, something to be aware of and respected. The importance of a new item was weighed against the effort expended to gain the money for it. That's still my attitude. Save where possible. Spend when necessary, and spending on quality is often a long term saving. Don't waste money if its unnecessary.

I can see that it might jar with the way your husband grew up, and the current situation might be highlighting financial tensions between you. But since when did economy equate to trauma?


When it's done in a way that children feel deprived from societal norms.
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tigerwife




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:21 pm
It can be scary to be constantly told you can’t afford anything. Children need to feel secure.
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lamplighter




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:22 pm
I bet theres a large difference between those who grew up in NY and those living OOT.

Also personality of the kids, parents, community plays a role.

There a huge difference between living in rags and buying designer backpacks. Theres a difference between using a backpack for a second year because its still in ok condition and being the child who never has anything new when everyone else does. Theres a difference between having the thermostat set a bit low or being the kid who no one wants to hang out at because their house is always cold and drafty.
Some kids handle this with grace and for some being poor is social suicide. For the second group there us trauma. I dont know what makes some kids end up one way and others the other.
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amother
Ruby


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:24 pm
Ok,
if you grew up in a home like OP then you would understand where the trauma and dysfunction come in. I grew up in a home where it was a huge deal every time the school asked for $5 for a school project. I was always the last one to bring it in and I was made to feel that I shouldn't even have asked. I never got new clothes and was embarrassed to go on school shabbos because I had clothing that did not fit me properly as people grow (not just in height) and fashions change. I do not think every kid needs new things all the time BUT I do think it is important to let your kids fit in. I even slipped my parents cash anonymously a few times over my childhood thinking they were poor. Our house was always cold and if anyone said anything my mother would say to put on a sweater. Saving is great! but it needs to be done with a slight moderation for your kids feelings. While they gave and still give us a lot of $, I know I would have rathered have a normal childhood and less support money. Even at their stage now, they won't fly to see their out of town children because they are saving for retirement...aka not living now. I don't think they need/should spend extravagently but if you save for the future and never live now I think you lost focus.
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dancingqueen




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 6:49 pm
amother [ Fuchsia ] wrote:
my parents were not holucust survivors I had to wear hand me downs but they were gourgous
from the time I was a teen ager till I got married they never gave me a penny and I had to pay my way thru school and never finished they both died very recently and I never complained
they gaev my brother money and my sister a house she expected to even get more money in the will
but she said she got screwd


That sounds difficult, but what’s so bad about hand me downs?
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amother
OP


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 8:26 pm
tigerwife wrote:
It can be scary to be constantly told you can’t afford anything. Children need to feel secure.


You nailed it
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HonesttoGod




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 8:27 pm
I wore hand me downs.
My parents are not POOR per se but they do not have extras at all. We were brought up not to spend on things unless absolutely needed. We didn't buy random things, didn't spend on gowns, wigs etc. I didn't think it was a bad thing but everyone wants to be "rich" right?

My husband grew up in a poor turned comfortable home. There were times they didn't have a penny but they always spent as if they did. When we got married they were rather comfortable and my husband didn't have the concept of NOT spending and saving instead.
So there was me, feeling guilty if I bought a cereal that was more expensive than the other box vs my husband who just said if you want it buy it.
Together over the years we have balanced each other out and we now both save, a lot, don't spend more than we have, budget religiously, but also don't feel bad to splurge here and there - again, as long as we can cover it.

I don't think there is any 1 way that is perfect. Besides for not spending unless you have it. At this point it doesn't make a difference how you were brought up but rather, how you need to move forward.
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amother
Crimson


 

Post Thu, Apr 23 2020, 9:36 pm
I think I understand what the OP means about dysfunction...if the thrifty behavior was accompanied by anxiety about money.
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Fri, Apr 24 2020, 2:52 am
News flash: EVERYONE has anxiety about money. The poor, the rich.

You're a grown up now, recognize that your anxiety stems from the idea that your money is never a guarantee. People lose jobs, people get coronavirus, a catastrophe occurs, a failed investment or business manifests. We are all seeing it firsthand. It's not some kind of weird carryover from your "traumatic", and "dysfunctional" childhood. It's actually part of the human condition.

Instead, this thread sounds like we should all blame our parents for behaving in a normal, logical way, and that somehow if they behaved better, we would be carefree about budgets and money and the uncertainties life can bring.
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amother
Royalblue


 

Post Fri, Apr 24 2020, 3:01 am
Op

I can relate to you a lot about thinking your parents are poor when they weren't

my parents earned a comfortable living and we all thought until a certain age that we were the poorest in the class. At some point we learned that my parents were from a tiny percentage that were paying full tuition.

Yes it's definitely a form of dysfunction and leaves trauma

Those who didnt grow up this way will not understand they cant.
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