Refraining from pleasurable things during this time

amother

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:24 am

essie14 wrote:

Like what? S*x? Ice cream?

What would be the reason?

Yes, and the people who are doing this say that they don't feel that it is appropriate to enjoy themselves while people are suffering, or something like that.

amother

Crimson

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:35 am

IMO, people at welcome to refrain from whatever they want. They should NOT be imposing their views on others or having a holier than thou attitude.
No one should feel guilty for trying to keep life as normal and mentally healthy as possible.

amother

Rose

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:39 am

Quite the opposite. Kids are listening to music whereas usually during sefira we refrain. And I’m trying to watch funny movies. Times are sad enough we don’t have to depress ourselves even more.

Busy@mom

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:39 am

I think that it's a little extreme. What's happening in the world now is very sad but the ones that can, should go on with life to the best of their ability. There is no reason to change anything that can go on as usual. There are always ppl in the world suffering, doesn't mean you should stop enjoying yourself.

I'm not trying to minimize the severity of the situation. But if everyone stops doing something they like we will have more depressed people than we already do.
The more ppl that can stay sane, the merrier.

amother

Lawngreen

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:40 am

I think I disagree with that on a fundamental level. Simcha poretz geder is a real and true concept in Yiddishkeit. We must not underestimate the power of real joy. Maybe it's a time to add in Torah and Maasim Tovim, but I definitely wouldn't try to diminish the joy in my life.

amother

Violet

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:44 am

I don't think we have to be in a mourning state of mind, saying some tehillim for those suffering is ideal IMO
My dh spoke to someone who seemed pretty down, nervous, scared and what not......he didn't stop saying that he read and heard how many people died, how many are critical etc etc my husband was like, one minute, did you say even 1 kapital tehillim for all those suffering? Please put down your phone, stop reading so much and do so (only to a close acquaintance u can talk this way)

silverlining3

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:49 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Yes, and the people who are doing this say that they don't feel that it is appropriate to enjoy themselves while people are suffering, or something like that.

And I know someone who lost her father and is trying not to let people bring her down. Yes things happen in our lives, very sad things, but we can't stay stuck there. Many many good things, miracles, happened too. It's what you focus on.

amother

Azure

Fri, May 08 2020, 12:59 am

Idk it seems kind of sickminded to refrain from experiencing joy and thereby only adding on the pain.
You can have compassion, do your part to stay safe and keep others safe, and still appreciate what gd has given you to enjoy.
Repression of happiness is never healthy. I know for myself, I think as is this time makes us so much more vulnerable to mental health issues anything we can do to get ourselves through this staying emotionally intact, not falling into a depression, I believe that’s what Hashem wants me to do.
If I am given the opportunity to experience joy and am blessed with good mood and good circumstance I think Hashem would want me to enjoy it. Why inflict pain or repression upon urself.
Bottom line-I think there’s no need to create more boxes and guidelines during this time. There’s no one way one is expected to feel during this time. There’s no one way one is expected to survive or manage during this time.
Let’s take it day by day and enjoy the simple joys Hashem blesses us with.
That’s what it’s there for. For you to enjoy. I see it as throwing it back in G-ds face when we don’t utilize the joyous moments we are blessed with.
But then again this is just one man’s opinion🤷🏻‍♀️

essie14

Fri, May 08 2020, 1:10 am

If you feel you should be refraining , then do what you want. But if you want a hashkafic opinion, then speak to a Rav.
AFAIAK, most rabbis are allowing music even though its sefira. we are spoiling our kids in any way we can because this time is so difficult. Why would I try to make it even more difficult for them?
Any restaurants that are offering delivery, we order.
Why are the women's mikvaot still open if not to allow married couples to have s*x?
Why were babies born during the Holocaust?
There are specific times to refrain from pleasurable things-- the 9 days, when one is sitting shiva, etc. Otherwise, Hashem wants us to enjoy life.
As someone said above, you can have compassion, you can say tehillim when you hear of someone getting sick or dying, but to mope around all day and be sad is not proper.

amother

Royalblue

Fri, May 08 2020, 1:27 am

Mitzva gedolah liyos Besimcha, Tomid Besimcha!
Ivdu es Hashem Besimcha!
Unless otherwise instructed by Chazal (like in Av and Aveilus ch"v).

The premise of refraining from pleasure, especially mitzvahs, seems to go against Judaism, unless you were instructed to do so. And by the way, Simcha brings miracles. Doing things that make you feel happy, and gives you positive energy, and calms your mind to trust Hashem, these are powerful tools in addition to saying Tehillim and whatever else is in your power to bring about a positive change to the world.

Elfrida

Fri, May 08 2020, 2:11 am

I can't remember the source but I know I've learnt that when the Jews were ordered to leave Spain as the Spanish Inquisition was starting, the Abarbanel led them out on Tisha b'Av accompanied by music and dancing.

When remembering an event, it is appropriate to mourn and maybe adopt some restrictive behaviour. During the event, one utilizes available resources to help get through it. I'm not saying that a huge party would be appropriate now, even if it were allowed, but we don't need impose further limitations on ourselves.

amother

Coffee

Fri, May 08 2020, 8:58 am

It has to be something sustainable and that won't interfere with overall simcha, yet be a reminder. Like - was it Mrs Tress? - who didn't have chocolate or sugar in coffee during WWII. Something like that.

20ish years ago, there was an article in the Jewish Observer. Someone consulted his mashgiach about taking a summer vacation during the height of the Intifada. The mashgiach said, if you can even ask this question, you have a certain sensitivity that makes this the right thing for you to do.

I have shoes. More than I need. I'm trying, bli neder, not to buy shoes for now. (DSW is making this really really hard Twisted Evil

)

ETA: Chayalle mentions this JO story on p. 2.

LovesHashem

Fri, May 08 2020, 9:09 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Yes, and the people who are doing this say that they don't feel that it is appropriate to enjoy themselves while people are suffering, or something like that.

That's the same logic that survivors of the holocaust used when they said "Why should I live? Why should I build a new family? How should I move on?"

It's not healthy to forcibly give your self extra needless suffer, pain, or deprivation from pleasure because other people have suffered/are suffering.

During this time, take care of yourself. Work on yourself. Keep yourself safe. If you want to give back to the world, volunteer and do good deeds instead of depriving yourself of pleasurable activities. People rely on you - you need to be emotionally happy.

There is something of an idea of sensitivity. So when you buy a new pair of shoes, don't announce it to your friends or others who may be dealing with financial hardship and loss of an income. Don't talk about how amazing your mother has been during this time when your neighbors parents have died.

Don't instagram how awesome and amazing life is. But don't deprive yourself or cause yourself to suffer.

Last edited by LovesHashem on Fri, May 08 2020, 9:13 am; edited 1 time in total

mommy3b2c

Fri, May 08 2020, 9:12 am

justforfun87 wrote:

I have felt since this whole started that we are in a time of mourning. I have refrained from listening to music and really allowing myself to feel real joy.

For me it’s the opposite. Even though it’s sefira I am listening to music. I need something to keep me from drowning in despair.