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How do you stand wearing tights in hot weather?
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:11 pm
gold21 wrote:
Wearing tights is a chumrah. Check again.


Wearing tights is NOT a chimrah. Rabbi Falk in his his sefer עוז והדר לבושה brings numerous sources that hold that the bottom part of the leg is the shok and is therefore ervah. Even Rav Kook who was the founder of the Daati Leumi communities also maintains that the shuk is the calf...And as I'm looking into it there are sources that also maintain that although the calf is not an ervah it must be covered (Halichos Bas Yisroel).

I'm not so sure that even the Mishnah Beruriah who maintains that the calf is not the shuk doesn't say that it still must be covered as many sources do...I'm not going to shlep out Rabbi Falk's sefer from my attic, so I'll just leave it at that.
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gold21




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:13 pm
CiCi wrote:
Wearing tights is NOT a chimrah. Rabbi Falk in his his sefer עוז והדר לבושה brings numerous sources that hold that the bottom part of the leg is the shok and is therefore ervah. Even Rav Kook who was the founder of the Daati Leumi communities also maintains that the shuk is the calf...And as I'm looking into it there are sources that also maintain that although the calf is not an ervah it must be covered (Halichos Bas Yisroel).

I'm not so sure that even the Mishnah Beruriah who maintains that the calf is not the shuk doesn't say that it still must be covered as many sources do...I'm not going to shlep out Rabbi Falk's sefer from my attic, so I'll just leave it at that.


Are you deliberately misunderstanding me?

There are other ways to cover ones leg that don't include tights.

You don't understand that?
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:16 pm
Ora in town wrote:
So with all your chumres, you are getting so confused that you don't know assur from mutar any more?
In my view, that's one of the main problem with all those chumres when they are not properly taught as chumres, but keilu they were halacha.
An even bigger problem is the judgemental attitude that often comes with those chumres towards people who don't share those chumres, like the attitude you displayed right here, in this thread (and also in many other threads) towards women who dress differently than you...
Or are you just a troll who wants to make Satmer & co look bad?


Wow, so you know better than Rabbi Falk? You know better than numerous rabbonim and gedolim who maintained that the calf is ervah and those who said it's not but it must still fe covered? You know better than them?!

And you gloat over the fact that I very obviously made a mistake in what I wrote? Is that proof to you that people are "confused" ? OBVIOUSLY I would never say it's ossur to go with tights so OBVIOUSLY it was a mistake...Wow, why am I even bothering here?


Last edited by CiCi on Sun, May 17 2020, 5:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ora in town




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:17 pm
CiCi wrote:
Wearing tights is NOT a chimrah. Rabbi Falk in his his sefer עוז והדר לבושה brings numerous sources that hold that the bottom part of the leg is the shok and is therefore ervah. Even Rav Kook who was the founder of the Daati Leumi communities also maintains that the shuk is the calf...And as I'm looking into it there are sources that also maintain that although the calf is not an ervah it must be covered (Halichos Bas Yisroel).

I'm not so sure that even the Mishnah Beruriah who maintains that the calf is not the shuk doesn't say that it still must be covered as many sources do...I'm not going to shlep out Rabbi Falk's sefer from my attic, so I'll just leave it at that.

But if it were considered "erva" and had to be covered, tights would not be really tznius, it should be something a bit less tight fitting, so that you can't see the shape...

So why are tights allowed at all? And even translucent tights?


Last edited by Ora in town on Sun, May 17 2020, 5:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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giselle




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:17 pm
CiCi wrote:
Wow, so you know better than Rabbi Fall? You know better than numerous rabbonim who maintained that the calf is ervah and those who said it's not but it must still fe covered? You know better than them?!

And you gloat over the fact that I very obviously made a mistake in what I wrote. OBVIOUSLY I would never say it's ossur to go with tights...Wow, why am I even bothering here?

Rabbi Falk is a known machmir. Even in my Bais Yaakov school years ago we knew that.
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amother




Rose
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:21 pm
Cici, wow so you know better than all the rabbonim who hold differently from you?
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:24 pm
gold21 wrote:
Are you deliberately misunderstanding me?

There are other ways to cover ones leg that don't include tights.

You don't understand that?


Ok. If you wear long skirts and socks and walk up steps, ride bikes and walk quickly without seeing part of the calf as many rabbis maintain it should be covered then you are covered from all shittas. Where did I say otherwise? Tights is for those who don't wear longer skirts and the thighs need to be covered. This is not a chimra, this is a minhag in the dress. You will not have Chassidim walking out with long skirts and knee highs because of minhag, not chimras.
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:25 pm
amother [ Rose ] wrote:
Cici, wow so you know better than all the rabbonim who hold differently from you?


In what way do I hold differently than other shittas?
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giselle




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:26 pm
Cici, you come onto a forum that is comprised of all kinds of frum women and spout things that are most definitely Halacha (according to you) that many women here don’t follow. So what you’re basically saying is that many of us don’t follow halacha. And then you ask why bother? I don’t know, why do you bother posting on a site that is obviously not geared towards people like you? Should I quote rabanim who have spoken out against chasidim? I’d never do that, as I would consider it incredibly tactless.
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:26 pm
giselle wrote:
Rabbi Falk is a known machmir. Even in my Bais Yaakov school years ago we knew that.


I'm sure he is... Chareidim were dressed in tights way before Rabbi Falk gave out his sefer.
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Ora in town




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:27 pm
CiCi wrote:
Ok. If you wear long skirts and socks and walk up steps, ride bikes and walk quickly without seeing part of the calf as many rabbis maintain it should be covered then you are covered from all shittas. Where did I say otherwise? Tights is for those who don't wear longer skirts and the thighs need to be covered. This is not a chimra, this is a minhag in the dress. You will not have Chassidim walking out with long skirts and knee highs because of minhag, not chimras.

But the true chassidic minhag is a garter belt
So why did they change that?
Too lazy?
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amother




Rose
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:27 pm
CiCi wrote:
In what way do I hold differently than other shittas?

You're actually claiming to hold by all shittas?
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:28 pm
giselle wrote:
Cici, you come onto a forum that is comprised of all kinds of frum women and spout things that are most definitely Halacha (according to you) that many women here don’t follow. So what you’re basically saying is that many of us don’t follow halacha. And then you ask why bother? I don’t know, why do you bother posting on a site that is obviously not geared towards people like you? Should I quote rabanim who have spoken out against chasidim? I’d never do that, as I would consider it incredibly tactless.


Are you saying that having uncovered knees and ankles is ok?
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giselle




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:28 pm
CiCi wrote:
I'm sure he is... Chareidim were dressed in tights way before Rabbi Falk gave out his sefer.

Yes there have been machmirim around for thousands of years.
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:29 pm
amother [ Rose ] wrote:
You're actually claiming to hold by all shittas?


No, I said I practice my shittah and that is not a chimra to me. To me that is halacha. However, tell me where I said my shittah is halacha for all of klal Yisroel.
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giselle




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:30 pm
Deleted

Last edited by giselle on Sun, May 17 2020, 5:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
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CiCi




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:32 pm
giselle wrote:
Yes there have been machmirim around for thousands of years.


Ok, so I'm saying that according to all shittas having uncovered knees and ankles is against halacha. I'm saying that people who have different shittas does not mean the shittas they follow are chumros.
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gold21




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 5:55 pm
CiCi wrote:
Ok. If you wear long skirts and socks and walk up steps, ride bikes and walk quickly without seeing part of the calf as many rabbis maintain it should be covered then you are covered from all shittas. Where did I say otherwise? Tights is for those who don't wear longer skirts and the thighs need to be covered. This is not a chimra, this is a minhag in the dress. You will not have Chassidim walking out with long skirts and knee highs because of minhag, not chimras.


It really isn't that hard to keep the leg covered at all times with a long skirt and knee socks.

If you hold the leg has to be covered.

You aren't allowed to expose the thigh, with or without pantyhose.

So that isn't a good reason for it.
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giselle




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 17 2020, 6:02 pm
CiCi wrote:
Are you saying that having uncovered knees and ankles is ok?

I answered above then deleted my comment because I wanted to find some kind of source. On outorah.org it clearly says that socks are not required with a knee length skirt according to halacha. Which I knew, but again wanted to back up my knowledge.
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naturalmom5




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, May 18 2020, 3:50 pm
CiCi wrote:
Where does it say you can't wear loose jeans if in today's society pants are also considered a women's beged? And it doesn't specifically say in the Torah that women need to cover their hair...b'kitzer, if you take everything apart you can do almost anything except eat chazer.

No Rav who paskened halacha which was included in the Shulchan Aruch would ever say you can go without tights in the street.



Earth to Cici....pantyhose didnt exist 100 years ago in der heim
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