What bothers me about separate dancing

crust

Sun, May 24 2020, 3:18 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

Right. But I’m not “bummy” either. My point was that you can do mitzvah tanz that is appropriate but doesn’t follow all the rules you listed.

I guess every community has different definitions for the words bummy and appropriate.

What you had is simply not a chassidish mitzva tantz.
It doesn't mean it's right or wrong.

mommy3b2c

Sun, May 24 2020, 3:20 pm

crust wrote:

I guess every community has different definitions for the words bummy and appropriate.

What you had is simply not a chassidish mitzva tantz.
It doesn't mean it's right or wrong.

Lol. In my community we don’t use the word bummy, actually. But I’m pretty sure I know what you mean.

crust

Sun, May 24 2020, 3:29 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

Lol. In my community we don’t use the word bummy, actually. But I’m pretty sure I know what you mean.

Happens to be we dont use it either.

If I were to explain such a mitzvah tantz to my husband I would use different words.

pause

Sun, May 24 2020, 3:29 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

Right. But I’m not “bummy” either. My point was that you can do mitzvah tanz that is appropriate but doesn’t follow all the rules you listed.

Please don't take offense because I don't mean any, but if you would be chassidish, you would be considered "bummy" Wink

Since you're not chassidish, I don't know why you would keep a chassidishe minhag and then say you do it differently than chassidishe people do. The way you did it is not the chassidishe way, and, I'll be super blunt, would not be considered appropriate in any chassidishe circles.

amother

Wheat

Sun, May 24 2020, 4:13 pm

asmileaday wrote:

I know this is derailing the thread a bit but I've had hundreds of cousins weddings and no one has ever had the kallah join the ring of male dancers when she's done with the one on one (or one on many) mitzvah tantz which is more like a back and forth or side to side shuffle. That is quite odd within the very frum chassidish crowd.
The ones that are more chilled/ bummy will usually have more dancing than just the kallah joining the circle of male dancers. I think your family's tradition is kind of unique.

Oh I'm sorry I wasn't clear. The kallah doesn't dance with the circle! Bur rather dances (or rather shuffles / walks side to side) 1on1 with the chusson or her father and the circle of men CLOSES around her. When she's done, the circle opens and she sits back down. But that isn't done with a gartel or with "fremda men" but only with imidiate family.

asmileaday

Sun, May 24 2020, 4:24 pm

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

Yeah ok that makes a lot more sense! Still not considered the kind of "dancing" that would be inappropriate for men to watch.

amother

Natural

Sun, May 24 2020, 4:28 pm

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

And I still dont believe your stamar menahel does this at his daughter's wedding or that he partakes in this type of circle at his niece's weddings.

You can't sell me the Washington bridge. I know Satmar menhalim and the likes too well.

amother

Amber

Sun, May 24 2020, 4:34 pm

amother [ Natural ] wrote:

Frum men don't watch this up and down walking either. Except if they are the father or brothers of the kallah.
The Bochurim go home before mitzvah tantz.

My mistake it actually is shuffling from side to side but we just refer to it as 'dancing'

asmileaday

Sun, May 24 2020, 4:59 pm

asmileaday wrote:

Yeah ok that makes a lot more sense! Still not considered the kind of "dancing" that would be inappropriate for men to watch.

I want to add a disclaimer.
I'm not saying it's wrong to dance with family (like Mommy3b2c did) just pointing out it's not mainstream chassidish.
As a Mom of boys only I can't promise I won't get into a circle with my boys at their weddings...

amother

Pink

Sun, May 24 2020, 5:13 pm

asmileaday wrote:

This. I find it upsetting that a mother doesn't get an opportunity to celebrate the wedding with her son. The father gets an opportunity to celebrate with his daughter at the mitzvah tanz, but there is literally no consideration for the mother of the chassan at all in the entire wedding.

I plan on getting into a circle with my boys too.

amother

Azure

Sun, May 24 2020, 5:38 pm

amother [ Pink ] wrote:

By us (RW chassidish) the mother goes to the chosson room after the badekin, she leaves the kallah with the kallah’s mother for a bit and she goes to be with her son. She’s there while they put the ashes on his forehead and she also bentches him. Then when the fathers go with him to the chupa she goes back to the kallahs room and the two mothers walk the kallah down a few minutes later.

(Also by the mitzva Tantz before the father goes to dance with the kallah he first says mazel Tov to his wife (the mechutanista) who is sitting near the chosson kallah).

But no she doesn’t dance with her son and she doesn’t go into the men.

crust

Sun, May 24 2020, 5:47 pm

amother [ Teal ] wrote:

asmileaday and amother pink: Enjoy. The rest of the internet will have a field day watching the clips, and debating you entire life history.

And your figure.

mommy3b2c

Sun, May 24 2020, 5:52 pm

pause wrote:

Please don't take offense because I don't mean any, but if you would be chassidish, you would be considered "bummy" Wink

I do the minhag because it’s my families minhag. You don’t have to be chassidish to have that minhag.

amother

Teal

Sun, May 24 2020, 5:57 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

I do the minhag because it’s my families minhag. You don’t have to be chassidish to have that minhag.

I'm curious about how it came into your family? Chassidish ancestors, or another means?
Because we have some chassidish cousins who do their mitzvah tantz in 15 minutes and yeshivish who do an hour's long mitzvah tantz. And then we have some cousins where the families aren't chassidsh, but some of them have chassidish ancestors, and they just do whatever their mechutanim agree to.
Some of the mechutanim have no clue what a mitzvah tantz is.
So, some of them have no chassidish blood, yet do it because of their mechutanim...
And then my siblings mitzva tantz, we had the kallah's and chosson's friends took it as an invite for couple's dancing...(Luckily for us, the hotel gave us a curfew.)

crust

Sun, May 24 2020, 6:02 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

I do the minhag because it’s my families minhag. You don’t have to be chassidish to have that minhag.

That's true.
But the way you explained it it does not resemble the Minhag. Wink

Mommyg8

Sun, May 24 2020, 6:03 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

I do the minhag because it’s my families minhag. You don’t have to be chassidish to have that minhag.

I think you at least have to have Chassidish roots though Smile

mommy3b2c

Sun, May 24 2020, 6:10 pm

crust wrote:

That's true.
But the way you explained it it does not resemble the Minhag. Wink

Really? How do you know? I’m not sure how old exactly the minhag is. I’m assuming that it’s a few 100 years. Does it specifically say that the father is not allowed to hug is daughter, the brothers can’t hold the Kallahs hands, and that the chossom and Kallah need to look at the floor?

pause

Sun, May 24 2020, 6:12 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

I do the minhag because it’s my families minhag. You don’t have to be chassidish to have that minhag.

Apparently your family has not too far off chassidish ancestry because I never heard of non-Chassidim with this minhag.